I Can't Even Express..

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I can't even express the deep seated anger I have towards this game now.

I just got to the point where I would buy something from the C-Store, after looking over all the improvements to the game and how it had changed after so long and finally thought Cryptic had changed just a little.

Then this infuriating sale that includes the TOS Bundle.

After the "limited" talk and the precedent set by other releases. I figured it wouldn't be included in the sale and the wording made it seem like it would go away soon and I really wanted to support the game so I bought it,

As a person not overflowing with cash that had to save up a lot for this game, this has made me so unbelievably upset and puts me off from ever wanting to give STO anymore of my hard earned money or Cryptic for that matter.

Why is there such a precedence of treating people so poorly when they give you money? :( :mad:

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TOS bundle was around $18, and 20% of that is only $3.60. Thats what your so upset about? $3.60?

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I'm upset that every time I buy something from em, [edited for content not Pro-Cryptic in nature]

I know $3.60 may not seem like a lot but for somebody with not a whole lot of money, it is.

Its 1 or 2 costume packs, a couple of playable races, etc

And its just a representation of there overall treatment of customers, in my opinion.

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Sorry to hear that Cpt.W. If it makes you feel any better, the discount on the TOS pack is like $3.

I like the sale because I held out and saved $50 on the lifetime. :)

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I know $3.60 may not seem like a lot but for somebody with not a whole lot of money, it is.

Why would someone with not a whole lot of money be buying virtual items that have no real benefit in the first place?

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cryptic does very often offer those 20% off thing. just keep in mind american holydays?! its pretty normal they dont include the newest offers to that pay off. just wait for the next holyday and youll get your bundle for 20% off too. i dont see any problems.

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Well, that's two threads by folks that bought the TOS Bundle prior to the sale.

Is it unsafe for me to mention that I've been procrastinating about the purchase and haven't yet, even though I've fully intended to for weeks now? :D

I empathise, though, I bought four whole character slots, and now I could have gotten them for 20% off. I'm not really upset, but I can certainly understand feeling like your timing was bad.

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Perhaps this game is there one escape from a very, very not fun life and so they saved enough for a while to buy something to make it a little funner?

I considered waiting till a sale except

1) It was a "limited time offer"

2) They never include new stuff in the following sales.

Well, that's two threads by folks that bought the TOS Bundle prior to the sale.

Is it unsafe for me to mention that I've been procrastinating about the purchase and haven't yet, even though I've fully intended to for weeks now? :D

I empathise, though, I bought four whole character slots, and now I could have gotten them for 20% off. I'm not really upset, but I can certainly understand feeling like your timing was bad.

If it hadn't been for there use of "limited time" crud and the way they never seem to put new times in the following sales, I wouldn't have bought it. I planned on getting some other stuff in this sale, but now I feel so alienated, I almost hate Cryptic.

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Why would someone with not a whole lot of money be buying virtual items that have no real benefit in the first place?

Luxury is relinquishing something necessary to gain something superfluous.
Virtual Items have real benefits. They provide the owner with a little joy, something that particular poor people can have trouble gaining*. That is a real effect on real person in the real world. It makes you feel better just like eating a meal when you are hungry or drinking a drink when you are thirsty.



*) That might be debatable.

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Id really like to know why they do this kinda stuff?

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TOS bundle was around $18, and 20% of that is only $3.60. Thats what your so upset about? $3.60?

second that, who cares

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People need to remember that the discount isnt on the price of the Atari points, its only on the amount of points required to buy the item. Take TOS pack, since that is what the OP is so up in arms about. That normally costs 1400 points, but with the discount it only costs 1120 or something. The catch is, they only sell Atari points in increments of 500. So unless you already had 200 points, then you would STILL have to buy the 1500 point package which would STILL cost the same amount regardless of the sale.

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Key dev post in key thread

http://forums.startrekonline.com/showpost.php?p=3453299&postcount=4

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But since I'd be able to get morr from it, it is cheaper.

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Thats what your so upset about? $3.60?

It's not about pennies. It's about principles.

Once again, the message Cryptic were trying to deliver has been muddled by poor use of language. Despite the best efforts of myself and other posters, we never did get a definite date for the end of the 'limited time offer' nearly a month ago. Clarification at that point would have allowed customers to make an informed purchase at any point between then and now.

To compound the matter, the phrase "Purchase the Value Bundle TODAY" has returned to the C-Store. This wording was rescinded a few hours after the TOS bundle was released, and replaced with more accurate text. "Buy TODAY" is ambiguous at best, deceptive at worst; and it's disappointing to see that phrase return so soon.

The lessons learned and demonstrated by Cryptic less than a month ago have been forgotten already.

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well i just baught the Galaxy X a day before the sale and i have to agree its alittle anoying i mean if an actual holiday was coming up soon i would have waited but "Tax Relief weekend" really?

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TOS bundle was around $18, and 20% of that is only $3.60. Thats what your so upset about? $3.60?

money is money my man. It dosnt matter if its a penny back into our wallets, they made it out to be a special release item that would later be gone, and to take advantage of it being there. Now its on sale... again another cryptic blunder.. Id like some of my money back please

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It's all about the wording. "Limited time" could mean anything from a day to a month (or two). A dev also pointed out that they would give advanced notice before they would stop the bundle offer. Sales happen. We all know that there will be one for major American holidays.

I've been wrestling with myself to buy or not buy the TOS bundle pack. I wasn't expecting to see it included in the sale, but it is. Now I'm more tempted than before to pick it up.

I tend to wait for sales, but sometimes I'll buy something that I really want right away. I call it impulse control.

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Since when does limited mean they won't drop the price of the bundle at any given time? The limited refers to the inclusion of those extra items in the bundle.

If you had read the forums, you would have known that dstahl had hinted at an upcoming sale. I've bought many items full price and I don't regret it. If I can't afford something, I don't buy it at the price and wait for a sale. It's the same for anything.

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People need to remember that the discount isnt on the price of the Atari points, its only on the amount of points required to buy the item. Take TOS pack, since that is what the OP is so up in arms about. That normally costs 1400 points, but with the discount it only costs 1120 or something. The catch is, they only sell Atari points in increments of 500. So unless you already had 200 points, then you would STILL have to buy the 1500 point package which would STILL cost the same amount regardless of the sale.

Consumer pedantry here, but you CAN buy 400 point bundles from:

http://www.testdriveunlimited2.com/ataritokencards

So, 3x400 = 1200 points is a possibility.

And there's always points left over. That's how they sell you more of them - Sunk Cost fallacy and all that.

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Id really like to know why they do this kinda stuff?

Because it's a business.

They aren't just making the game to be your best friend, they are also making it to reach into your pocket and remove the money you have in there, then transfer it into their pocket.

Thats just the way things work, the way to win at that game is to hold on to your money, and keep holding it until they reduce the cost of the item you want.

they will always word an advertisement to make it seem like if you don't buy it now you will never have it.

That's what good advertising is, but the reality of the whole thing is, they will always offer the product again, not offering the product again is stupid, because thats like saying hey, I don't want to make money anymore!


the short version:

wait three months before spending on something and chances are it will either be the same price, or on sale.

wait six months and it will be on sale or half price.

wait a year and it will probably be bundled into a much better package and the cycle repeats.

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Because it's a business.

They aren't just making the game to be your best friend, they are also making it to reach into your pocket and remove the money you have in there, then transfer it into their pocket.

Thats just the way things work, the way to win at that game is to hold on to your money, and keep holding it until they reduce the cost of the item you want.

they will always word an advertisement to make it seem like if you don't buy it now you will never have it.

That's what good advertising is, but the reality of the whole thing is, they will always offer the product again, not offering the product again is stupid, because thats like saying hey, I don't want to make money anymore!

I have never had a company treat me like this, repeatedly.

I got better treatment from Microsoft for a product out of warranty than I've gotten from Cryptic.

Probably why they are so small.


the short version:

wait three months before spending on something and chances are it will either be the same price, or on sale.

wait six months and it will be on sale or half price.

wait a year and it will probably be bundled into a much better package and the cycle repeats.

That doesn't really apply to the C-Store.

Lets look at the first item available at launch

Ferengi- 80 CP

After a year

Ferengi- 80 AT

Doesn't seem to fit.

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Happens all the time. No one forced you to buy the pack. No one told you it wouldn't be put on sale. There was mention of a sale in April, because I read several forum posts asking when exactly the "April Sale" would be, and that was over a month ago.

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I have spent 10 bucks in the C-Store, total. While there are plenty of cool things there, none of it will make my gameplay any better. I generally space PvP...so my bridge interior and uniforms doesn't even get seen much, and my interior rarely ever.

You obviously thought that the items were worth the price, so you paid it. But now, they aren't worth that price any more? What changed? Nothing. The law of business is: Everything is worth exactly what people will pay for it.

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I bought the TOS pack when it came out and i'm very happy with it. I don't care that it's part of the sale.

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Overall, I think they could have handled this a lot better instead of constantly flipping the bird at there customers.

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I have never had a company treat me like this, repeatedly.

I got better treatment from Microsoft for a product out of warranty than I've gotten from Cryptic.

Probably why they are so small.

Ummm yeah. Alright, let's pull our cranial lumps out of our collective sphincter valves. C-store is there to make money for STO (which in turn drives development). It is not some exclusive antiquity house offering priceless, one of a kind artifacts. If you've never had a company put something on sale after you had bought it at a higher price.... what can I say? You need to get out more.



That doesn't really apply to the C-Store.

Lets look at the first item available at launch

Ferengi- 80 CP

After a year

Ferengi- 80 AT

Doesn't seem to fit.

Actually, your example doesn't apply. Ferengi were priced about as low as they will go.

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[edited for content that is not Pro-Cryptc]

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I've never had a company treat customers like dirt, a sale is one thing, using trickery and smoke and mirrors to get someone to buy something is different.

Getting people to buy things is what a business is about. I bought the ToS bundle as well and I bought it before the sale. Did I think that it would disappear from the C-store? No, I assumed these items (which they spent time and effort creating for us) would remain separately or in some sort of packs. Did I assume these items would never go on sale? No.... I bought them because I wanted them. Just like you did. I don't feel the need to start a trail of tears because I bought something when I wanted it only to find later there was a sale.


When his argument is applied to the C-Store, the Ferengi as an example still works.
They could offer it for 20 AT if they really wanted to, its up to them. So, there business doesn;t fit that example/

Saying it again doesn't make this right. I understand that you have made certain statements and feel the need to defend them but this is getting pretty thin.

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Looks like this thread is gonna get closed. :(

Maybe one day Cryptic might treat its customers better and then maybe they will grow.

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Why is there such a precedence of treating people so poorly when they give you money? :( :mad:

I believe "treating our customers poorly" is the Cryptic corporate Mission Statement.

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I believe "treating our customers poorly" is the Cryptic corporate Mission Statement.

I have to agree with you there.

They should have either

A) Made it not part of the sale

B) Ended the limited time offer pre sale.

Like they did with every other high end product.

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I'm really trying hard to understand what the point of the argument is about. You are upset because the ToS Bundle was included in the Sale? Really, is this what you are upset about. Didn't this item come out on sale last month? So it's almost a month, right? Since I can remember they have always put items on sale if the release date is not too close. I new the bundle would be put on sale this weekend because of the amount of time between release and sale. I've always waited for sales with the few exceptions of something that I wanted now, and the bundle was one of them. So the pattern did not change, and it's business as usual. The only problem here is that you made assumptions and your assumptions miss the mark.

I really would like to know why there is such a big resistance when it comes to Micro Transactions stores? It's not just here but in other MMO's. Let me ask this, how long has the $15 a month been in place. Has it been a decade? I'm pretty sure it has, and probably longer. So what is a more realistic monthly price that is up to par with the cost of living these day? What, $20, 21, 22. Cryptic is NOT a None Profit Organization, so get this embedded in your brains.

One of the new up and coming MMO's will have to break the subscription barrier. Which one? Your guess is as good as mine, but it must happen or you will see a tsunami of C-store rise from all the MMO's. The only one I see that might be able to do it is SW TOR. There is a lot of hype behind it, people will scream and holler, but in the end they will subscribe and be happy. With a more reasonable monthly subscription, we can keep the stores down to a low roar, but they are not going away, Gentlemen.

Enjoy The Game
DL

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Well, I'm against this argument. I don't hink you got ripped off in any way, but I will say this:

The $15 a month thing is bogus. Watch TV for a while. Everything is still only $19.95 + shipping and handling. Has been since the 80's. :D

But seriously, in fact, server space, bandwidth and etc are much cheaper today than they were ten years ago. If anything, that $15 should be about $10 bucks. As someone in the webhosting business, I can tell you that it costs me far less to maintain a server with more bandwidth today than what it did only 5 years ago.

The only cost rising part is security, trying to keep those hackers out and being able to counter "denial of service" attacks. I guarantee that Blizzard makes more now than they did per customer 5 years ago, and they have one of the largest server, account and game networks in the world.

Companies like Perfect World have over 50 million players daily, worldwide, but they never charge a monthly fee for their games. Development of content, customer service and licensing costs 75% of a game's overhead. The servers and network is a tiny piece of it.

That doesn't mean I am against the C-Store though. I think it's a nice addition to help boost income and show investors that Star Trek Online is a worthy place to dump their cash, but I can promise you that the population only needs a couple hundred players to maintain the servers.

Well, I will say this. If it needs more than that to pay for servers, they got a bad deal and should find a new server company.

Cheers.

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[edited for content that is not Pro-Cryptc]

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I don't think I've bought a C-Store item outside of a 20% off sale in a long time. They have these sales so often, if you just wait a month or so, you get a discount.

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I bought the TOS pack upon its release due to being a fan. And fine...they had a sale for it. But I don't feel the need to gripe nor do I take it personal. Why? Because this is a buniness. And I know they didn't single me out to work me over financially. They made a sale when they thought many could benefit from it, that is all. I bought lifer during the summer. Since then, they had sales for it twice. And still I don't complain. I bought it when I bought it. Just keep this in mind when you make your purchases. Do you want it now? Or do you want it when it will be cheaper? In the end, it is your choice.

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Except, had they followed their own precedence, I would've gotten it cheaper.

They never include their newest high end items in the sale,s until now apparently.

Had they followed there own pattern, even with a 25% sale on the items in the non limited time offer, it still would have been cheaper.

But, just when I was starting to think about giving Cryptic more money (my 2nd C-Store purchase), they go and do something like this.



Bottom line, they decide to start changing things up, its up in the air when its gonna be cheapest, so I can't give em any money and I certainly can't recommend the game.

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I am not a big fan of the C-store. (And beleive they sell far too many items that should be given away freely)

However, this is how the real world works, businesses have marketing departments made especially to get money out of your wallet, this is how a business runs itself.

If they had told everyone there would be a sale soon, they would have probably lost money (and perhaps even been reprimanted/sacked) for costing the business money.

I have bought many items in my life, only to have them go on sale a week or a month later, that is life, life is not fair, never has been never will be. Learn from this experience and be more prudant in future. Getting the best value for your money is always a cat and mouse game, and a skill that can be honed.

Also bear in mind that the devs and mods most likely have zero imput on how the game and its items are marketed, they get told to make it, they make it, and there ends the relationship, i doubt they have any imput on its past, present or future price model.

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Except, had they followed their own precedence, I would've gotten it cheaper.

They never include their newest high end items in the sale,s until now apparently.

Had they followed there own pattern, even with a 25% sale on the items in the non limited time offer, it still would have been cheaper.

But, just when I was starting to think about giving Cryptic more money (my 2nd C-Store purchase), they go and do something like this.



Bottom line, they decide to start changing things up, its up in the air when its gonna be cheapest, so I can't give em any money and I certainly can't recommend the game.

I would describe this as ingratitude. Despite my missgiving about the C-store, they did not HAVE to give you a 20% discount, nobody is en****led to it. The fact they had a sale is a bonus to the people who like to buy from the C-store. The time factor is moot, if they had offered 20% off 6 months from now, would you still be complaining.

And to those who think that the TOS bundle should not have been included in the sale... how on earth would this make you feel better? you would not get any money back, and you would be putting more money into the pockets of the company you are complaining about, the logic is simply selfish and makes no sense.

Maybe after all this complaining Cryptic will decide never to have a sale again, and I would not blame them.

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I am not a big fan of the C-store. (And beleive they sell far too many items that should be given away freely)

However, this is how the real world works, businesses have marketing departments made especially to get money out of your wallet, this is how a business runs itself.

If they had told everyone there would be a sale soon, they would have probably lost money (and perhaps even been reprimanted/sacked) for costing the business money.

I have bought many items in my life, only to have them go on sale a week or a month later, that is life, life is not fair, never has been never will be. Learn from this experience and be more prudant in future. Getting the best value for your money is always a cat and mouse game, and a skill that can be honed.

Also bear in mind that the devs and mods most likely have zero imput on how the game and its items are marketed, they get told to make it, they make it, and there ends the relationship, i doubt they have any imput on its past, present or future price model.

Unfortunately, prudancy in this case means never purchasing from them again. Due to their highly erratic and randomly changing pattern of sales and how they work. Its impossible to predict these things anymore.

Had they followed there pattern, I wouldn't have had a problem.

This is just another line in the series of unbelievably poor things Cryptic has done and the last straw for me.

I had just started changing my mind about this game a month or tow ago and I had been saving for this sale for a while now and was just starting to get some friends interested in the game, but now I can no longer in good faith buy anything nor recommend it.

I would describe this as ingratitude. Despite my missgiving about the C-store, they did not HAVE to give you a 20% discount, nobody is en****led to it. The fact they had a sale is a bonus to the people who like to buy from the C-store. The time factor is moot, if they had offered 20% off 6 months from now, would you still be complaining.

1) Yes, I should be thanking them for using smoke and mirrors to give them more money

2) No, its not, had they offered this in 6 months, I would not care.


And to those who think that the TOS bundle should not have been included in the sale... how on earth would this make you feel better? you would not get any money back, and you would be putting more money into the pockets of the company you are complaining about, the logic is simply selfish and makes no sense.

Except that the reason I'm upset with them is that they did put it in the sale, had they not, I wouldn't be upset with them right now.


Maybe after all this complaining Cryptic will decide never to have a sale again, and I would not blame them.

Makes no difference to me, never buying another Cryptic product again.


I have no problem with you voicing your opinion, but could you please not tell me how I feel and I react to things, I think I know me a bit better than you know me. :)

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They never include the latest item that was released.

the latest item is the bajoran uniform, and that is excluded from the sale.

so what's the problem?

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They never include the newest big ticket items, until now.

Like the ships and the bundle packs.

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They never include the newest big ticket items, until now.

Like the ships and the bundle packs.

Yes... and thats a GOOD thing, it means LOTS of people are getting things for CHEAPER.

The fact you decided to impulse buy is your problem and nobody elses. If you are old enough to play the game, you are old enough to take responsibilty for your actions.

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I bought the TOS bundle when it became available too. I have absolutely no issues with it being part of the sale now. I expected the latest addition to the store to be full price, and it was (bajoran uniforms). :)

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Yes... and thats a GOOD thing, it means LOTS of people are getting things for CHEAPER.

Speculation


The fact you decided to impulse buy is your problem and nobody elses. If you are old enough to play the game, you are old enough to take responsibilty for your actions.

I did not impulse buy, I spent days calculating and considering. Than took my action based on there record. They decided to go ahead and use marketing to get people to waste money, unfortunately long term that is why they are small.

They treat customers poorly and those customers don't ever want to do business with them again, thats my perogative. I will give them feedback regarding their poor, sickening behavior. I have never had a company be this abusive towards its customers.

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They treat customers poorly and those customers don't ever want to do business with them again, thats my perogative. I will give them feedback regarding their poor, sickening behavior. I have never had a company be this abusive towards its customers.

So I take it you will be leaving the game then? Because if you are paying a monthly sub, that means you will be doing business with them still.

As I have stated before, I find Cryptics business practices 'shady', but it is no more shady than the same practices carried out the world over by millions of other businesses. (if you have never heard of this kind of thing before,.. then you have lived a sheltered life...)

It is always a bonus when a company treats its customers favourably (and can even lead to them making more money) but you should not be suprised when this kind of thing happens, because it is pretty much the norm.

You can complain and that is your right, and I can offer my own opinion, that is also my right :)

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So I take it you will be leaving the game then? Because if you are paying a monthly sub, that means you will be doing business with them still.

No, I'm an LTSer (fortunately for them, I probably would have left months ago)


As I have stated before, I find Cryptics business practices 'shady', but it is no more shady than the same practices carried out the world over by millions of other businesses. (if you have never heard of this kind of thing before,.. then you have lived a sheltered life...)

No, I don't have a sheltered life, I have never had a business repeatedly treat me like such dirt.

And I disagree that it is this common.

Poor service may not be uncommon, but I have never had a company deliver such poor quality product and service of this magnitude.


It is always a bonus when a company treats its customers favourably (and can even lead to them making more money) but you should not be suprised when this kind of thing happens, because it is pretty much the norm.

It isn't a bonus for a company to treat me well, I have always either had a good product or good service, perhaps you have had bad luck with businesses but that is no excuse for them to treat customer poorly.


You can complain and that is your right, and I can offer my own opinion, that is also my right :)

I'm well aware of that, but I disagree with some of your opinion and will voice that disagreement. :)

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People need to remember that the discount isnt on the price of the Atari points, its only on the amount of points required to buy the item. Take TOS pack, since that is what the OP is so up in arms about. That normally costs 1400 points, but with the discount it only costs 1120 or something. The catch is, they only sell Atari points in increments of 500. So unless you already had 200 points, then you would STILL have to buy the 1500 point package which would STILL cost the same amount regardless of the sale.
true...
money is money my man. It dosnt matter if its a penny back into our wallets, they made it out to be a special release item that would later be gone, and to take advantage of it being there. Now its on sale... again another cryptic blunder.. Id like some of my money back please
no, i looked at the wording, only says limited time. it never, not once gives an actual time. Folks draw their own conclusions on that.
Because it's a business.
They aren't just making the game to be your best friend, they are also making it to reach into your pocket and remove the money you have in there, then transfer it into their pocket.
Thats just the way things work, the way to win at that game is to hold on to your money, and keep holding it until they reduce the cost of the item you want.
they will always word an advertisement to make it seem like if you don't buy it now you will never have it.
That's what good advertising is, but the reality of the whole thing is, they will always offer the product again, not offering the product again is stupid, because thats like saying hey, I don't want to make money anymore!
the short version:
wait three months before spending on something and chances are it will either be the same price, or on sale.
wait six months and it will be on sale or half price.
wait a year and it will probably be bundled into a much better package and the cycle repeats.
yeah pretty much.
Yes... and thats a GOOD thing, it means LOTS of people are getting things for CHEAPER.
The fact you decided to impulse buy is your problem and nobody elses. If you are old enough to play the game, you are old enough to take responsibilty for your actions.
I wonder when someone was going to state the obvious. This is true of anything that has the tag "Sale" on it, no matter the market, or commodity.

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I can appreciate where you are comming from, but being 'treated like dirt' is quite subjective.

To some the small amount of monetary value that 20% represends is not worth getting upset about, and then of course there is the principle that you bought the items in good faith, only to have them change the pricing structure.

When the TOS bundle came out with the tag line 'limited time offer' I responded to a post that this is an obious marketing tactic in order to get people to buy (as it makes NO sense to have a limited time offer on a digital item that can be reproduced into infinity)

I have done business with lots of organisations (and have even run one myself) and although I would not use this kind of tactic (as I like to treat customers like family) I can assure you that this kind of marketing is pretty much the norm in the business world (I am not defending it, nor saying it is 'right).

In many peoples opinion, a business is a business, and is there to make money full stop, and as long as they do not go outside of the law, they can (and in some opinions) SHOULD do whatever it takes to make as much money as possible, in the shortest time possible.

If you are not happy, you have done the right thing by voting with your feet and refusing to purchase from the c-store again.

I for one hope that the bean counters at cryptic rethink the way they do business, but this is unlikely.

As for the devs and the moderaters on the forum, I feel for them as they get the backlash from things that are essentially out of thier hands.

If you really want to make a difference you may also wish to contact the CEO of cryptic and tell him of your problems/concerns. If you are polite, it can often lead to positive change (or at least a small refund)

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I get where you are coming from, but I disagree on a few points.

Overall, unless they change, I just can;t in good conscience buy anything nor recommend it to anyone.

And I think business crud like this is why Cryptic is so small and stays that way,

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You really seem to obsessed with the size of the company.

I feel bad for small businesses everywhere. "Oh, you're small, that means you suck."

Srsly?

[Archived Post]

You really seem to obsessed with the size of the company.

I feel bad for small businesses everywhere. "Oh, you're small, that means you suck."

Srsly?

No, only that they have a small business and that restricts the quality they can make which in turn keeps their player base small which in turn keeps the game small.

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Well, yes I can get my blood pressure up and get all offenive over I just purchased the Lifetime membership for $299 last month. I have been unemployed since June of 2009 and I saved up for over 6 months to purchase it. But at the end of it all, getting upset only affects you and your health. So please stop having a heart attack over $3 to $4.:eek:

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I guess some people really don't get how the world works and believe in moaning constantly over such trivial matters. For how long this thread has been going, and how much you've spent moaning and quoting and answering back, you could have earned that small amount you apparently lost many times over.

Companies sell products, and sometime said products cost more or less at different times. Ever heard of Christmas and January sales? We have them in England. Items are more expensive before Christmas, and in January, prices drop to maintain sales. So Cryptic sold a product, and a month later its cheaper. Oh my word.

Now i brought my LTS in December. Two months later there was a 20% sale. Did i moan?

After reading this thread, again i'm subjected to the same people complaining about the same things. Either give up on this game or simply grow up. And which ever you decide, try then refraining from purchasing anything else in life, just in case the price changes on a product and you are left a few pounds/dollars/whatever out of pocket. Some people really need to gain a little perspective in life. You think you have it bad? You have no clue what so ever...

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The timing of this is the problem, had they done it in 2 or 3+ months, it wouldn't have upset me.

But now, I can't in good faith buy anything or recommend anything from Cryptic, C-Store or otherwise.

For such a low quality game, poor service is just making it worse.

The only way they are ever gonna get any other C-Store purchases from my account is the inevitable F2P in a year or so.

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The timing of this is the problem, had they done it in 2 or 3+ months, it wouldn't have upset me.

But now, I can't in good faith buy anything or recommend anything from Cryptic, C-Store or otherwise.

For such a low quality game, poor service is just making it worse.

The only way they are ever gonna get any other C-Store purchases from my account is the inevitable F2P in a year or so.

Okay since you obviously have been here for awhile, based off your forum registration, you said you did research before you purchase things.

Then did you not notice that last year they did the same identical sale, at the same identical time, with the same identical name (pretty much) and think... hrm they probably will do the same again? :p

You blame a small company like cryptic doing this type of stuff for being why they are small. That statement couldn't be more wrong. Marketing teams have done these kind of tactics for god knows how many years now. Small and large companies alike. It's nothing new to use LIMITED TIME ONLY or BUY TODAY! as a marketing tool.

It's like Disney and it's "vault" it puts movies in never to be released again. Somehow magically they kept coming out and being released allover again hehe.

I'm not going to try to change your mind because obviously you feel wronged. Fine so be it, but you might give them a break here. Blaming them for doing marketing practices every major corporation in the world does is not really fair =\

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Okay since you obviously have been here for awhile, based off your forum registration, you said you did research before you purchase things.

Then did you not notice that last year they did the same identical sale, at the same identical time, with the same identical name (pretty much) and think... hrm they probably will do the same again? :p


Unfortunately, this doesn't follow that patter for two reasons

1) Unlike every other sale, the latest big ticket item is included
2) 20%, not 25% Sale


You blame a small company like cryptic doing this type of stuff for being why they are small. That statement couldn't be more wrong. Marketing teams have done these kind of tactics for god knows how many years now. Small and large companies alike. It's nothing new to use LIMITED TIME ONLY or BUY TODAY! as a marketing tool.

It's like Disney and it's "vault" it puts movies in never to be released again. Somehow magically they kept coming out and being released allover again hehe.

There are three components

1) Content quality
2) Consumer base
3) Service/ Marketing

Many of the larger companies get away with poor number 3 because they have 1& 2 in great supply.

Unfortunately, Cryptic does not have high 1 or 2, and they have low quality 3, that is why they are small.


I'm not going to try to change your mind because obviously you feel wronged. Fine so be it, but you might give them a break here. Blaming them for doing marketing practices every major corporation in the world does is not really fair =\

I don't give em a break for doing something "other businesses" do for 2 reasons

1) Many of those "other companies" have different situations than Cryptic.
2) Just because everybody is doing it, doesn't make it right



I'm sure you and many other disagree, but that is my opinion, hardened by there treatment of me over the past year. :(

[Archived Post]

I'm sure you and many other disagree, but that is my opinion, hardened by there treatment of me over the past year. :(

Noone can disagree with your opinion. I´m sorry that you feel this way. But what exactly is your goal in this thread ?

You say you can´t leave because you bought a lifetime sub, but that you would have left without it. You do have the option to ignore the game, don´t play it, don´t think about it and don´t use the forums.

If you really feel that angry all the time, it´s not healthy for you. Take a break, do something else. Maybe it´ll get better with time. :)

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Noone can disagree with your opinion. I´m sorry that you feel this way. But what exactly is your goal in this thread ?

You say you can´t leave because you bought a lifetime sub, but that you would have left without it. You do have the option to ignore the game, don´t play it, don´t think about it and don´t use the forums.

If you really feel that angry all the time, it´s not healthy for you. Take a break, do something else. Maybe it´ll get better with time. :)

1) My goal was to tell Cryptic exactly how I feel and that they have made one of their customers extremely upset and will no longer EVER give them money nor recommend their product

2) I will continue to play since obviously I spent the money to, but I will never EVER give them money again. Not playing the game doesn't help me at all, I'm angry at the service, the content, and the small playerbase. Unfortunately, I can't change any of that, they seem unwilling to. Not playing doesn't help that any, nor does not giving them feedback.

Hopefully one day, they will one day try to improve themselves.

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1) My goal was to tell Cryptic exactly how I feel and that they have made one of their customers extremely upset and will no longer EVER give them money nor recommend their product

2) I will continue to play since obviously I spent the money to, but I will never EVER give them money again. Not playing the game doesn't help me at all, I'm angry at the service, the content, and the small playerbase. Unfortunately, I can't change any of that, they seem unwilling to. Not playing doesn't help that any, nor does not giving them feedback.

Hopefully one day, they will one day try to improve themselves.

Ah, i see. I can see improvements to the game. Not that a new uniform or ship is giving me something to do, other than enjoying the new shiny factor for a day or two. ;)

Sometimes i wonder what a Star Trek MMORPG would look and play like if it had been developed by a large company, a lot of money and it´s own engine, one that actually is made for the game exclusively. But i guess there will never be such a game. :(

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[edited for content that is not Pro-Cryptc]

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Why would someone with not a whole lot of money be buying virtual items that have no real benefit in the first place?

Because he wanted to support the game?

He even said so....

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Bingo.

I thought I'd support a game that seemed to be heading in a good direction, dumbest thing I think I've done when it came to this game (LTS might have been dumber).

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This is not a new phenomenon.

People have been buying on impulse and gotten broadsided by a new sale since sales existed, and surely they've all been rather mad about it.

All I can tell you is suck it up and don't let it bug you too much. You had no way of knowing a sale was on the horizon. On the bright side, if this becomes an annual thing, you can plan for it next time.

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I love the sale. I got lifetime at 60 bucks off.

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I am quite tired of it being called an impulse buy.

I didn't just buy it whenever it hit me, I took several days, calculations and considering based on there pattern. Everything pointed to it not being on the next sale and certainly not as a limited time offer.

There will not be a next time because I'm NEVER buying or recommending anything from Cryptic ever again, I will warn people against them.

I've gotten better treatment for products out of warranty from Microsoft then Cryptic.

Cryptic is well within their right to treat customers as mere garbage to suck for money, but it dies affect them. It's why they are small and why they will stay small.

I'm gonna get C-Store stuff next year for free in a year or two when it goes F2P.

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Okay, fine, it wasn't an impulse buy, it was a cold calculating purchase.

That doesn't change the fact that you're on a ridiculous crusade against Cryptic and the C-Store because you have bad timing.

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William2 you have been a lifetime member since before this sale haven't you? Shouldn't you be more angry about the 60 buck difference in that?

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Imagine going to the supermarket to buy some toilet paper, then the next week the supermarket has a sale on toilet paper for $2 off.

Let me guess, you immediately run to the supermarket and complain to the manager that you got ripped off last week because you bough toilet paper at regular price and they didn't notify you of an upcoming sale. :rolleyes:

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Imagine going to the supermarket to buy some toilet paper, then the next week the supermarket has a sale on toilet paper for $2 off.

Let me guess, you immediately run to the supermarket and complain to the manager that you got ripped off last week because you bough toilet paper at regular price and they didn't notify you of an upcoming sale. :rolleyes:

Actually, a lot of stores offer partial refunds for buying an item, then it very soon going on sale.

It's quite common.


William2 you have been a lifetime member since before this sale haven't you? Shouldn't you be more angry about the 60 buck difference in that?

No, because

1) I bought it pre-launch for $240

and

2) It didn't go on sale for $240 for several months, if they had put the TOS bundle on the next sale I wouldn't have had an issue.

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Many moons ago, just after the launch of the C-Store I bought a boat load of points. I already had the LTS from prelaunch, and I wanted to support the game. Seemed like a great idea.

Then, I reached max level on my first character before the first two weeks were done. Granted, I was on vacation most of that time (actually, I probably was "sick") and logged more hours than I probably would have in the next month or so if I'd worked normally.

I dealt with the spectacular lack of Klingon content and randomly leveled up said Klingon, only finishing off the General ranks when Exploration clusters opened for them. That probably accounted for about 3 months of sporadic playing.. maybe an hour a day during that period. (Averaging in the 11 hour long grindfest of completing all the STF's once the borg bits came out and the mind numbing failed attempts before that)

Since then I've probably spent around 2 weeks, playing around randomly on other characters.

How much time have I actually, really, used... about 5 months.

Would I have cancelled my account during the periods of inactivity? Yes. Most definitely.

Would I be paying for this month? No.

Next month? No.

When the next feature episode series started up? Yes. Those have been awesome.

Am I losing money? Technically, yes. $260 / $15 per month comes out to something around 17 months. I've had the subscription since launch... and I've only played for around 5 of the 12 months. Most of my "preorder" and LTS 'perks' are now in the C-Store, or were added as Veteran Rewards. (Where are the 500 day rewards, Cryptic?)

I bought the TOS Bundle when it was released with my AP surplus... and ran around exploring it for about an hour. That accounted for my entire play time for last month. I wouldn't have bought it if it hadn't said "limited time only." And I would have waited if I'd known it was going to be on sale right away... like I waited for the other high value items to be.

Does this break Cryptic's previous sales pattern? Yes.

Do people have a right to be angry? Yes. They're people. You can't please all of them. Deal with it.

But, here's my point:

Am I mad? No... but I'm not exactly happy either. The points I bought, and the money I paid for my Life Time Sub are a sunk cost. I would have ended up buying the TOS Interior anyway... and the points I didn't spend would probably have gone to some useless uniform set I'd never use.... like 7 of 9s, just for the boots.

So, my females will just do without stiletto boots. Not very practical in combat situations anyway.

In a few years, when the feature episodes start to stack up, and when the foundry has received gallons of polish... I might have broken even on my investment. Until then, I can log in and mess around when ever I want... and I can wait. I paid for it.

[Archived Post]

I respect your opinion and semi agree. :)

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Let me ask you this.

if you had bought Atari Points on a Monday, then on Tuesday that same amount of points was $3.00 cheaper...would you be here complaining about that?

I mean, ultimately, that is what this comes down to. Things are worth what people will pay for them, no more and no less.

If you buy points and I buy points we pay the same amount for them. You had to drop a few more on something that I got for a few less. That is, honestly, just business.

There was mention of sale coming in April, several posts on the forums about it. Honestly, you should have waited to see if they put it on sale. You assumed they wouldn't, even I assumed it wouldn't be due to past sales, but assumption is a dangerous thing....because sometimes your assumptions are wrong.

Shouldn't you have waited to see if it was going to be on sale first? You didn't know about the sale? Why not do some reading of the forums every once in a while? You have surely spent enough time in this thread, so obviously you have the time to do so.

If you want to be honest, you have no one to blame but yourself here. Sure, Cryptic broke the pattern by putting it on sale, but you could have waited to see. I'm sorry you feel ripped off. I'm sorry you aren't happy, but I don't think anyone is to blame here but you. Cryptic never said it wouldn't go on sale. You assumed it wouldn't...YOUR assumptions led to your own dismay.

Cheers.

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I'm not even gonna argue with you, not worth it.

You can believe whatever you want and yell it at others but that don't make it right.

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This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Atari Community Rules and Policies (http://forums.startrekonline.com/announcement.php?f=118&a=5) ~<GM Jahia>

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Why does this set still include the uniforms? When it said it's a limited offer that states buy now or miss out putting it on sale including the uniforms is pretty poor. I bought it knowing it would be on sale but believing when it did it wouldn't include the uniforms. That way buying it when I did would be the best deal. Especially since all other sales don't include the latest item.Yeah it's only a few bucks but the principle is that Cryptic can't be trusted.

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I dont get it anymore.

They said originally that the the few items going into C-Store was because the staff wasnt big enough to make them as the Subs was very few so they had to pay somepone else to make it.

BUT

They now say the Subs are very very healthy, so there excuse is NOT valid anymore.

So tell us , why are you still adding even the littlist thing into the C-Store!

They say the Sub are great now, so prove it stop adding to the STORE!

More lies? pure greed now? We dont want C-store for months then a update with a few bug fixes that break other things,

Enough Store now please as in your own words the subs are now fine.

[Archived Post]

I agree with both of ya'll.

My biggest beef with the C-Store is how massive it is getting for a P2P game.

If they made more stuff earnable in game (reasonably), I would be fine with it.

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While I sympathize with your frustration, I do have to agree, it's not as if they set out to maliciously cheat you out of $3.60 and specifically abuse you. If anything, putting the TOS pack on sale was a NICE thing of them to do. You really shouldn't be ripping them apart for it.

I think what you need to understand is that microtransactions (on games, on our cell phones, on Facebook) are all about the psychology of the impulse buy. Same reason stuff is priced at 99 cents or 97 cents if you shop at Wal-Mart instead of the psychological threshold of $1.00. Make the purchases small enough where people won't miss it.

You just got caught in bad timing. It happens to EVERYONE from time to time. We miss out on coupons, limited time offers, awesome freebies. How do you think people across America feel on Black Friday when the item they got up early to get is sold out?

But abandoning a $300 lifetime subscription over a missed $3.60 discount just doesn't make any sort of mathematical sense, especially when numerous folks paid full price for preorder items that are now on C-Store, the Delta Flyer people bought before it became craftable, the 5 referrals you had to do to get the Galaxy-X before it came to the C-Store, not to mention the various and ridiculously overpriced ships like the Guramba and, well, the Galaxy-X.

I think you just need to be patient, keep an eye out for upcoming US holidays. I guarantee this won't be the last sale you miss. But I encourage you to put down the "I'm a victim" picket sign, write this one off and move on with your life. I guarantee you'll be much happier and forget all about it in a few months :)

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I dont get it anymore.

They said originally that the the few items going into C-Store was because the staff wasnt big enough to make them as the Subs was very few so they had to pay somepone else to make it.

BUT

They now say the Subs are very very healthy, so there excuse is NOT valid anymore.

So tell us , why are you still adding even the littlist thing into the C-Store!

They say the Sub are great now, so prove it stop adding to the STORE!

More lies? pure greed now? We dont want C-store for months then a update with a few bug fixes that break other things,

Enough Store now please as in your own words the subs are now fine.

You could always do a search and read about how the c-store works, who actually works on it and so on ;)

[Archived Post]

I agree with both of ya'll.

My biggest beef with the C-Store is how massive it is getting for a P2P game.

If they made more stuff earnable in game (reasonably), I would be fine with it.

This I can agree with. The sheer amount of crap shoved into the store is getting ludicrous. Yes, other games have MT stores as well, but most of them (outside of F2P and hybrid games) don't have a list so large that you have to scroll down several pages to find what you're looking for.

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Well I think I feel your pain. I did manage to score my lifetime subscription on sale but with the way things have been going I'm not entirely sure that I got such a great deal anymore. You win some and you lose some I guess :/.

[Archived Post]

This is essentially the final straw for me.

I'm not abandoning the game (since I gain nothing by doing that, nor do they lose anything), I'm just not giving them any more support (no purchases, no buying another Cryptic product again) and when people ask me what I think of STO I will tell them my honest feelings.

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Makes that two of us.

Long time ago I made a post, with a question "what is cryptic doing to ensure my money". Answer is, nothing. One way or the other.

[Archived Post]

This I can agree with. The sheer amount of crap shoved into the store is getting ludicrous. Yes, other games have MT stores as well, but most of them (outside of F2P and hybrid games) don't have a list so large that you have to scroll down several pages to find what you're looking for.


I'm not a fan of all the items they have, it to many in my view. I'm not saying that I don't want content but I also won't spend that amount of money at this time. As the game is P2P with added Pay more its you want it.

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I dont get it anymore.

They said originally that the the few items going into C-Store was because the staff wasnt big enough to make them as the Subs was very few so they had to pay somepone else to make it.

BUT

They now say the Subs are very very healthy, so there excuse is NOT valid anymore.

So tell us , why are you still adding even the littlist thing into the C-Store!

They say the Sub are great now, so prove it stop adding to the STORE!

More lies? pure greed now? We dont want C-store for months then a update with a few bug fixes that break other things,

Enough Store now please as in your own words the subs are now fine.

I'm sure they're factoring in the C-Store when they say sales are great.

They want to create grinds as a C-Store alternative. They've made progress with that.

But this game is based around two C-Store releases a month. I don't think that will change if people buy them.

[Archived Post]

This is essentially the final straw for me.

I'm not abandoning the game (since I gain nothing by doing that, nor do they lose anything), I'm just not giving them any more support (no purchases, no buying another Cryptic product again) and when people ask me what I think of STO I will tell them my honest feelings.

im also goin to be doin the same thing

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im also goin to be doin the same thing

Yeah, the timing was just really bad for this.

I had some gift money come in and a friend who has gotten a bit interested in the game, and I was just starting to consider changing my opinion bout how they did stuff (since Stahl was making such an awesome game) and then this.

So, I'm not only not buying anything, but I'm advising him to wait on the game, possibly not buy it.

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This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Atari Community Rules and Policies (http://forums.startrekonline.com/announcement.php?f=118&a=5) ~<GM Jahia>

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This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Atari Community Rules and Policies (http://forums.startrekonline.com/announcement.php?f=118&a=5) ~<GM Jahia>

There are some circumstances in which the buyer has no way to confirm whether an item works at the time of purchase, other than the seller's own confirmation. This is true of pretty much all online purchases. Now, I do agree that if you choose to buy something online you are taking a risk. However, I do not agree that risk = your fault. Every time you get in the car you are taking a risk, but that does not mean it is always your fault if you get in an accident.

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You know stating astute and obvious things doesn't make you wise. But you are right and also wrong, but in the end the its up to the company to actually say "ok we messed up" but it is not the obligation of the company to do so, and the company is actually protected buy the law in this regard. But is is good business sense to do so. All I was stating is that it is useless to complain. And in the case of a car the law is different because the product can lead to a situation of death. With the product being a simple transaction the law is way different.

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All I was stating is that it is useless to complain.

And you are perfectly entitled to that opinion. However, there are obviously those who disagree, and your opinion is no more valid than theirs. That being the case, if their complaints bother you then you have the freedom not to read them if you wish.

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I'm not starting a war with you I only wished to convey a piece of law to maybe give the OP an idea and sense to his grief. So thanks, once again for stating the obvious.

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I'm not starting a war with you I only wished to convey a piece of law to maybe give the OP an idea and sense to his grief.

You also wanted to tell him and others that their complaints were useless.

All I was stating is that it is useless to complain.

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You know what, I'm not going to take your bait. Keep up the good work of stating the obvious.

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You know what, I'm not going to take your bait. Keep up the good work of stating the obvious.

This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Atari Community Rules and Policies (http://forums.startrekonline.com/announcement.php?f=118&a=5) ~<GM Jahia>

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I don't need to make "sense" of their actions.

They treated me a certain way, multiple times and so they have lost a customer.

I won't ever buy from them again and I will tell people my honest opinion, the game is pretty good but the service is awful and I will share my experiences.

I'm just deciding to share my experience and let Cryptic know.

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I'm just deciding to share my experience and let Cryptic know.

I think the only question at this point is how many times you are going to repeat yourself now that you have already shared your experience.

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I think the only question at this point is how many times you are going to repeat yourself now that you have already shared your experience.

Every time I am asked or given a statement that is attacking or disagreeing with it. :)

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Every time I am asked or given a statement that is attacking or disagreeing with it. :)

This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Atari Community Rules and Policies (http://forums.startrekonline.com/announcement.php?f=118&a=5) ~<GM Jahia>

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I think the only question at this point is how many times you are going to repeat yourself now that you have already shared your experience.

Because there are more people out there that feel the same way he does,but are less inclined to share their experiences out of fear?

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Because there are more people out there that feel the same way he does,but are less inclined to share their experiences out of fear of retribution?

Good point. (50% off ship sale anyone?)

To be honest, my greatest hope is that Cryptic can take this and use it to change the game for the better.

On a side note, every time I see a post of yours, all I think is "Shark Week!!!!" :D

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Because there are more people out there that feel the same way he does,but are less inclined to share their experiences out of fear?

You do not seem to understand the question.

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This thread was created a month ago and the TOS bundle still includes the 'Limited Time' uniforms. Are they a permanent addition or does limited mean something different to the person who wrote the description?

[Archived Post]

limited can mean 2 minutes or a year. It all depends on when they decide to remove it.

[Archived Post]

limited can mean 2 minutes or a year. It all depends on when they decide to remove it.

And to add to this, limited really only means it will be removed eventually. There is no implication how long it will be, only that it will happen.

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It just seems dishonest to state limited time and then still have it there but at a lower price during the subsequent sale. So those who believed limited meant short time lose out. Like you say limited could mean they'll stay until the game closes down and still fulfil the letter of the law. Had they said it was limited to a long time people could have waited because it was always going to go on sale. But when it did it was implied the extras would no longer exist.

Ultimately it's only a few bucks but it's made me question when Cryptic says anything and not consider them a trustworthy company. Like they're saying STO is business as usual despite Atari offloading Cryptic. I'm not taking what's said at face value that's for sure.

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It just seems dishonest to state limited time and then still have it there but at a lower price during the subsequent sale. So those who believed limited meant short time lose out. Like you say limited could mean they'll stay until the game closes down and still fulfil the letter of the law. Had they said it was limited to a long time people could have waited because it was always going to go on sale. But when it did it was implied the extras would no longer exist.

Ultimately it's only a few bucks but it's made me question when Cryptic says anything and not consider them a trustworthy company. Like they're saying STO is business as usual despite Atari offloading Cryptic. I'm not taking what's said at face value that's for sure.

Uh.. almost EVERY company in the world does these types of things. "Limited Time" has been used as a marketing tool since man invented the wheel i'm sure (okay maybe not but you get the idea :p). So blaming cryptic/atari for using tried and true methods of marketing is like blaming the cat for the dog chasing it. It just doesn't make sense :p

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I stand by my posts in this thread, in word and money.

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This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Atari Community Rules and Policies (http://forums.startrekonline.com/announcement.php?f=31&a=5) ~GM Tiyshen

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There's a difference between the statements "Limited Time Offer" and "Purchase the Value Bundle TODAY"; especially when communication to an international audience needs to be as clear and accurate as possible.

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I just resubscribed and saw I had some bonus points. I thought "cool" I can get a new ship or something. So my lowly lt went to buy a new one. Not enough ship slots. wtf is this? So, now in order to spend money on a ship, I have to also spend money on ship slots? And to make it even better, the ship slots are for one character, while the ships are for each character?

To me this is saying, "thank you for spending $6 on a ship. Now all you have to do is spend $6 more to use it!"

That is the kind of treatment I'd expect from a F2P game, not one that costs $15 a month.

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I just resubscribed and saw I had some bonus points. I thought "cool" I can get a new ship or something. So my lowly lt went to buy a new one. Not enough ship slots. wtf is this? So, now in order to spend money on a ship, I have to also spend money on ship slots? And to make it even better, the ship slots are for one character, while the ships are for each character?

To me this is saying, "thank you for spending $6 on a ship. Now all you have to do is spend $6 more to use it!"

That is the kind of treatment I'd expect from a F2P game, not one that costs $15 a month.

You dont have to buy new ship slots. You can discharge one you already have.

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To me this is saying, "thank you for spending $6 on a ship. Now all you have to do is spend $6 more to use it!"

That is the kind of treatment I'd expect from a F2P game, not one that costs $15 a month.

There was talk (http://forums.startrekonline.com/showpost.php?p=3481998&postcount=59) a few months ago about giving C-Store ships a bundled ship slot to prevent bad customer experiences like this.

There's always plenty of talk.

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I think the C-Store is due for some policy changes and revamps after Season 4

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I think the C-Store is due for some policy changes and revamps after Season 4

Be careful what you wish for...

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Be careful what you wish for...

Well, for me, I won't purchase anything until this goes F2P (and only using the stipend) so this won't matter.

However, they should revamp in a better way to try to limit this problem.

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This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Atari Community Rules and Policies (http://forums.startrekonline.com/announcement.php?f=118&a=5) ~<GM Jahia>

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eh, just because he's angry and has only one thing to say doesn't necessarily make it spam.

I do wonder, however, how much more money he's spent (under the "time = money" equivalency) being mad about this thing. There's an old parable about two monks, a woman and a river...

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eh, just because he's angry and has only one thing to say doesn't necessarily make it spam

See the words I underlined. That is Cryptic's definition, not mine.

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I was answering peoples questions and clarifying what I was trying to say since some people didn't seem to understand.

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I was answering peoples questions and clarifying what I was trying to say since some people didn't seem to understand.

You were also repeating the same or similar phrase over and over again. That is spamming according to Cryptics definition.

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You were also repeating the same or similar phrase over and over again. That is spamming according to Cryptics definition.

I would hope Cryptic is understanding of the difference between clarification and repetition.

I see repetition in alot of threads, especially in F2P and Foundry threads by individuals.

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Gee, must suck to be you then.

I would hope Cryptic is understanding of the difference between clarification and repetition.

Your not "clarifying" anything. Your point has been clear since the OP: your upset about the C-store and you dont plan on buying anything else. Since then you have just been spamming the same thing over and over again.

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This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Atari Community Rules and Policies (http://forums.startrekonline.com/announcement.php?f=118&a=5) ~<GM Jahia>

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Apparently so...

Even the Devs repeat themselves in different threads. The OP of this thread has been doing it over and over again in the same thread.

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Even the Devs repeat themselves in different threads. The OP of this thread has been doing it over and over again in the same thread.

Yeah, that distinction looked pretty clear to me too...but that is not for us to decide, that is a mod's business.

To the OP, my person view is that cryptic could give the stuff away for free and I would have no grounds to complain. When I buy the item, I ask myself if it is worth the points? If yes, I buy it. If no, I wait until either the answer changes or the price changes and that makes it worth the points. Is it fun to see the stuff go on sale, no. But it is life.

As to your claim that they broke their pattern... There was no pattern, this is the first interior pack (call it what you want to, it is unique).

It was worth it to you (and me, for the record) at the time, and I do not think we should get upset when other people get a little bonus. We got the item, they got the item. They got it cheaper, but we got it FIRST. And some could argue that that extra time was worth the few dollars.

In conclusion, Cryptic can sell it to us for whatever they want, whenever they want, because we do not have to buy it. It is not dishonest to put items on sale, because they could just GIVE THEM AWAY if they wanted to. It's their stuff.

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Your not "clarifying" anything. Your point has been clear since the OP: your upset about the C-store and you dont plan on buying anything else. Since then you have just been spamming the same thing over and over again.

That is your opinion and I disagree. I rephrased to help people understand what I was saying since they didn't seem to grasp it.

Yeah, that distinction looked pretty clear to me too...but that is not for us to decide, that is a mod's business.

To the OP, my person view is that cryptic could give the stuff away for free and I would have no grounds to complain. When I buy the item, I ask myself if it is worth the points? If yes, I buy it. If no, I wait until either the answer changes or the price changes and that makes it worth the points. Is it fun to see the stuff go on sale, no. But it is life.

As to your claim that they broke their pattern... There was no pattern, this is the first interior pack (call it what you want to, it is unique).

It was worth it to you (and me, for the record) at the time, and I do not think we should get upset when other people get a little bonus. We got the item, they got the item. They got it cheaper, but we got it FIRST. And some could argue that that extra time was worth the few dollars.

In conclusion, Cryptic can sell it to us for whatever they want, whenever they want, because we do not have to buy it. It is not dishonest to put items on sale, because they could just GIVE THEM AWAY if they wanted to. It's their stuff.

I disagree and nothing is going to change that, they have repeatedly burned me and this is the final straw.

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Does that mean this will also be your final post (on this matter)?

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Does that mean this will also be your final post (on this matter)?

No, I will respond to people who disagree (feel free to) and anybody who has questions.

It was the final straw for me purchasing things, since I have had too many bad experiences.

^^^^^^^^^^^^ Clarification^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

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That is your opinion and I disagree. I rephrased to help people understand what I was saying since they didn't seem to grasp it.


All those quotes the Nagus posted werent rephrasing, they were saying the same thing over and over again. Thats not an opinion either. All you have to do is read them to see that is true. And the great thing is what you think doesnt matter because by the definition laid out in Cryptic's forum rules you ARE spamming. Thats not an opinion either, all you have to do is read their definition to see that is true.

This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Atari Community Rules and Policies (http://forums.startrekonline.com/announcement.php?f=118&a=5) ~<GM Jahia>

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No, I will respond to people who disagree (feel free to) and anybody who has questions.

It was the final straw for me purchasing things, since I have had too many bad experiences.

^^^^^^^^^^^^ Clarification^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Translation: I'm right, you're wrong, and I have terrible timing.

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You are all free to have your opinions and interpretations.

I still stand by my opinion.




As a friendly tip, its probably best not to start doing what you are accusing someone else of doing, just a tip :)

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You are all free to have your opinions and interpretations.


You dont get it, do you? It has nothing to do with opinions or interpretations. Cryptic's definition is clearly stated in their rules.

Spamming – 1 point
You may not create posts which contain:

Excessive communications of the same phrase, similar phrases, or gibberish.


We're not talking about opinions or interpretations here, we're talking about a clearly stated rule which you are violating in this thread. That is not an opinion, it is a fact.

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Ok, that is enough. Pick a new topic in a new thread and everyone play nice.