Star Trek Online

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-   -   C-store vs emblems - 500 emblems is steep. (http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=205872)

Archived Post 03-07-2011 03:12 AM

C-store vs emblems - 500 emblems is steep.
 
Right, I'm not standing against the C-store. I see its need and its value to players, the game and Cryptic.

I'm happy to see that some C-store items are made available in game. It is a shame that not all items are made available in game. There are going to be younger players (say 15 or younger - who cannot legally work - in England at least -) who will want an item but have no means of getting it. But still at least there alternate options to acquire certain items without having to sepnd hard earned cash.

However

500 Emblems is steep and expensive in terms of cost of time spent completing missions to earn 500 emplems. Even then you have to grind more emblems, marks etc to kit the ship out in weapons and consoles. The process is arduous and painful and while there is the alternate option of simply paying for it with cash, it is unethical that the 'paying for it' should be so much more appealing than playing the game and earning 500 emblems.

In fact I don't think I have collected 500 emblems. I know for a fact that I've never accumilateed 500 emblems in one go.

And again while I see the need for the C-store and I don't feel that purchasing with emblems should be as easy or as instanenous as paying with cash. I feel needing to collect 500 emblems really isn't an option for most, IMO.

Personally my suggestion would be to either lower the cost of emblem/mark related items or increase the opportunities or the number of emblems/marks awarded form completing missions to make it a realistic and viable option.

Archived Post 03-07-2011 03:35 AM

You aren't meant to grind the emblems. You're meant to give Cyptic cash. That's the reason it's so steep.

Or.... the emblem chase is laughingly considered content. A simple way to dress up repetition as achieving a goal.

Or.... as the apologists of the C store like to say, the items placed there are not needed to play STO. It is not game content but merely fluff. By that rationale, Cryptic are not doing you a favour by adding non-content to the game for emblems and calling it treats.

You can either buy a ship from the store, then sit in space dock since there's really nothing to do with your new ship, or grind for a new ship, and in the process, really come to detest the same thing day after day until such time as you have 500 emblems, then stop playing since there's nothing for you to do in your new ship except the same things you've just done for you 500 emblems lol.

Archived Post 03-07-2011 03:40 AM

yeah did you not know that why it is able to obtain the stuff from the c-store you have to grind like a nut not to say you have to do this on every char you want the item :p

imo 500 emblems is indeed harsh, even 100 sounds crazy much but like someone els here said its not meant to be a eazy way to get stuff "sadly" its there to make people see its way to much work so we buy atari points and buy the item from the c-store ! that marketing right there for yah sadly.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Syrinx
Or.... as the apologists of the C store like to say, the items placed there are not needed to play STO. It is not game content but merely fluff. By that rationale, Cryptic are not doing you a favour by adding non-content to the game for emblems and calling it treats.

Ehm its not only "FLUFF" anymore XP boost, Ships like Galaxy X or the Exelcior or even the siege one !! thats just a small portion of the stuff that gives player an edge in game! so not needed YES true in a small sent, gives you an Boost/advantage YES it does.

still the C-store is there for CRYPTIC not us the players, and putting the items from c-store in game for an insane amount of emblems is a way to say to us look we care you hate the c-store and look we add the items to the game this way BUT at the same time say "Grind your butts off if you don't want to pay extra for it" !! double sided edge this is! anyways i never gonna grind stuff this games end game is way to boring for that not to say none existed .

Archived Post 03-07-2011 03:44 AM

I had about 200 something emblems when Cryptic increased the Emblem cost to 500 for those ships.

Since then I have not grinded emblems since. It was a bad move then, its still a bad move now.

Archived Post 03-07-2011 03:47 AM

I'm honestly not sure people are appreciating the hard work the guys at Cryptic have done to even get these things in game in the first place. Yes, 500 is a little steep, but the fact is that if not for Stahl and Stormshade (iirc), this stuff wouldn't even be in-game. It would be solely C-Store. Yet Atari wants to see Star Trek Online make money, so the C-Store is necessary.

I honestly get that it's a lot of hard work, but for many that can't pay anything more than a monthly sub, having the option at all is a wonderful thing. They just had to set a high price to please Atari.

Archived Post 03-07-2011 03:58 AM

While I can agree that 500 emblems is somewhat steep, I do have to wonder how some of the people who are complaining about the emblem cost would cope in some older MMOs, Korean MMOs, or Eve... The emblem grind looks easy in comparison to what you have to do in other games to get high end equipment (or even just level)

Archived Post 03-07-2011 03:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pr1983 (Post 3413202)
I'm honestly not sure people are appreciating the hard work the guys at Cryptic have done to even get these things in game in the first place. Yes, 500 is a little steep, but the fact is that if not for Stahl and Stormshade (iirc), this stuff wouldn't even be in-game. It would be solely C-Store. Yet Atari wants to see Star Trek Online make money, so the C-Store is necessary.

I honestly get that it's a lot of hard work, but for many that can't pay anything more than a monthly sub, having the option at all is a wonderful thing. They just had to set a high price to please Atari.

again i fail to see the view of some players !! C-store DON'T make sense wen the game is NOT F2P !! you say hard work, cryptic bla bla YES all TRUE but ask your self why in the hell do we pay monthly fee for the game?! (well i'm lifer but i speak for the rest of us) don't get me totally wrong here i do understand the C-store to some point (example: the services) BUT things like Costumes or wait even better a new RACE my god don't make me start about them, you buy a new race, lets say ferengi or that fed klingon, and then you see OMG i need to buy extra char slot too ?! what the hell cryptic !!!
untill this game goes F2P i will be a no-no to the C-store's idea, sadly even i have given in to the "dark" side and got stuff from the store cus its easy :/
anyways done talking about this there will be always people positive and negative c-store most likely the rich (positive) "cus money is not on there mind or care" and the "not so rich" (negative) "money has a value".

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darkphenoix
While I can agree that 500 emblems is somewhat steep, I do have to wonder how some of the people who are complaining about the emblem cost would cope in some older MMOs, Korean MMOs, or Eve... The emblem grind looks easy in comparison to what you have to do in other games to get high end equipment (or even just level)

LOL played Lineage2 dude the grind in that game is so high you look-up a new meaning for the word "GRIND" !! hehe like the game very much BUT this has nothing to do with the emblems and C-store !! why most korean games that have a insane grind have no c-store or store for items!!! so the grind is the only way !! here its more like a bone we got tossed "look people now you can get c-store items ingame not for cash (so you think) but for emblems" ! HA it cost you more CASH in play time "to grind" the item then to buy it from the c-store. ... damz i said a post before i was not talking about this any-more hehe guess the hate runs deep.

Archived Post 03-07-2011 04:08 AM

I really hope you didn't just suggest that I'm rich.

Archived Post 03-07-2011 04:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Syrinx
You aren't meant to grind the emblems. You're meant to give Cyptic cash. That's the reason it's so steep.

It does *feel* this way :(.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Syrinx
Or.... the emblem chase is laughingly considered content. A simple way to dress up repetition as achieving a goal.

The repetition for these emblems is mind-numbingly dull, and 500 of them is a bit crazy - especially when you consider that you only have to buy the item on the c-store once for all your characters, whereas if you choose to use emblems, you have to grind out 500 emblems per character. In short, this number needs to be reduced to make it realistic for people.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Syrinx
Or.... as the apologists of the C store like to say, the items placed there are not needed to play STO. It is not game content but merely fluff. By that rationale, Cryptic are not doing you a favour by adding non-content to the game for emblems and calling it treats.

I don't agree that these new ships are just 'fluff', these are game changing additions! The ships you can buy in the c-store provide unique abilities or crew setups that are not available elsewhere. If they were just 'fluff', then you would be able to get these abilities without having to grind. Point in case: the new MVAS Prometheus coming out will offer an escort with a Lt. Cmdr science officer - which I believe no other escort does, so no other escort captain will be able to use Tier 3 science powers.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Syrinx
You can either buy a ship from the store, then sit in space dock since there's really nothing to do with your new ship, or grind for a new ship, and in the process, really come to detest the same thing day after day until such time as you have 500 emblems, then stop playing since there's nothing for you to do in your new ship except the same things you've just done for you 500 emblems lol.

Well, I can't speak towards 'nothing to do' since I'm in a fairly social fleet and we help each other out, pvp, rp, etc - that's your own thing. But I can say that grinding out 500 emblems is a sure way to drive someone to leave the game from boredom - its just too much grinding over the same content to be fun, especially when you consider that you also need to grind even more emblems if you want to equip that new ship with the best equipment you can (or grind resources if you want to craft said equipment).

Dstahl, perhaps you can look at the ratio or players who are buying vs. grinding out these ships. Is anyone actually going to the trouble of grinding them out, because (and I don't mean to accuse anyone of anything here), it feels like the 500 emblem target is just a way to 'offer' the item in game without it actually being practical to do so. Perhaps there is some way to get these marks in a reasonable amount of time without ruining the game experience with too much grinding? Your assistance/advice/insight into the emblem 'pricing' (or how to get emblems reasonably) would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers and thanks,

- Z

Archived Post 03-07-2011 05:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zapgun (Post 3413270)
It does *feel* this way :(.

I don't agree that these new ships are just 'fluff', these are game changing additions! The ships you can buy in the c-store provide unique abilities or crew setups that are not available elsewhere. If they were just 'fluff', then you would be able to get these abilities without having to grind. Point in case: the new MVAS Prometheus coming out will offer an escort with a Lt. Cmdr science officer - which I believe no other escort does, so no other escort captain will be able to use Tier 3 science powers.

I should clarify, it's not me that thinks these things are fluff. That is the view of the C store apologist, you know, the type that says either "you don't need these things anyway, so shut up," oR "you can get them in game for emblems, so shut up".


Quote:

Dstahl, perhaps you can look at the ratio or players who are buying vs. grinding out these ships. Is anyone actually going to the trouble of grinding them out, because (and I don't mean to accuse anyone of anything here), it feels like the 500 emblem target is just a way to 'offer' the item in game without it actually being practical to do so. Perhaps there is some way to get these marks in a reasonable amount of time without ruining the game experience with too much grinding? Your assistance/advice/insight into the emblem 'pricing' (or how to get emblems reasonably) would be greatly appreciated.
Cryptic (not Dstahl personally probably) wouldn't care about that ratio. If you buy the stuff from the store, that's lovely for them. If you grind the emblems and continue to hurl your monthly fee at them in order to do so, that's good too. In fact, if anything, it would seem they care about it only in 1 direction, as is evident by the rise in emblem prices not so long ago. Obviously people were getting their in game items too easily. Basically what they're saying is, they've fulfilled their promise. The stuff is in game, now if it's unreasonable to attain it that way, that's tough. You know their preferred option.

"but the C store funds future game developement bleet bleet. Sub fee alone won't get us future updates and things to do bleet bleet"

Maybe Cryptic should have thought about that before releasing half a game. It's a simple circle. Cryptic want us to pay per month, therefore they must provide content to make us wish to continue paying.
If they do not provide content, we no longer wish to pay and Cryptic lose their income and the game dies.
The C store does not factor in unless we are to believe that the game will survive on Lifers and C store purchases alone. If that's so, make it F2P now and then the store is fine.

So far, what's added to the game in the updates (IMO of course) ammounts to being worth a sub for a month every 5 or 6 months. Perhaps they should offer a weekly sub option since it really doesn't take any longer than that to catch up if you're been away a while.


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