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-   -   KDF Fire Power (http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=218202)

Archived Post 06-05-2011 09:12 PM

KDF Fire Power
 
Ok.. so a few weeks ago I got into a tiff about OP KDF fire power vs that of Fed.. Sooo I took a few days away from the forums here and thought... and thought...

Shortly after a pvp match I had a KDF member challenge me to a 1v1 to see if my build was Fubar.. (I'm no master at this game, but like every Capt. Good or Bad.. Fed or Klingon I accepted) So we went at it.. I was ina Nebula class vessel. He ate me up.. Went through my shields like nothing, and I struggled to even break his. I was using all purped weapons and he was in the green. I had purp shields, engine and deflector.. nothing seemed to work.. I even switched to offensive mode.. nope couldn't punch a hole in him. Sooo I switched ships. I chose the long range recon vessel. I lasted much longer and it went back and forth for a bit, but I was in def mode and couldn't do much damage to him.. I just pretty much stalled him. In offensive mode.. much the same..

I then switched to an an Assault Cruiser, tougher hull str, and two more weapon slots. I find myself doing better in this ship, but my shields still drop rapidly.. even when just fighting a Bop for cryn' out loud. It appears their weapon cycle is faster than mine.. notice I said appears.. I'm still seeing a struggle to get through the shields even against a bop and I can't figure it out... (Please all those with smart ass comments like "You Suck", "Your Build Sucks", "Learn to Play Your Ship") don't respond because if I wanted a child's opinon I'd ask my GF's 9 yr old.

Now I'm going to get back on and trump about KDF Drones.. Now look just hear me out.. is all I ask. I'm going to guess at the number of drones a KDF Carrier gets at being 5. Now lets put two KDF carriers two Cruisers and one Bop in a match with two Star Cruisers, Two Cruisers and One Sci ship.

KDF FIre power is: Ten drones with two weapons.. each thats twenty beam weapons alone. Then there's the Carrier's weapons at being eight each that sixteen... So just two ships with drones brings to bear, Thirty Six Weapons. Now two Cruisers at I"m guess four weapon slots fore and aft..another Sixteen weapons bringing the total to 52 weapons to bear. Last the bop which has I'm guessing two forward and two aft..if I recall from my own KDF player.. so we have a total of 56 weapons to bear total.

Fed Side, Two Star Cruisers eight weapons each thatst sixteen weapons together. Two Assault Cruisers thats eight each again total of sixteen, thats sixteen times two.. thirty two weapons to bear and finally a sci ship with three forward and three aft weapons total of six for a grand total of 42 weapons for Fed side and 56 for KDF side.

56 weapons bearing to 42 weapons to bear. So in the words of the show "Deadliest Warrior" advantage goes to KDF!! The drones brought out gives the KDF side with the other ships, 15 ships to the Feds 5. Advantage KDF. Please I welcome correction because I understand I'm no expert at this but I hope you can all see how and why I feel that the KDF bears to much advantage. I believe that when the Federation goes into battle and fights and actually wins, it is at times by sheer luck and I'll toss in there some skill.

Its aggirvating to see my shields eaten up and yet I don't have the power to return the same kind of fire power even when I'm fighting a lesser class ship. It makes no sense to me and so I get nerd rage as I heard some one call it. I'm not here to start a bickering fight and if thats how your going to reply spare me the demonstraition of your age. I'm here to discuss this as a level headed adult and want the same in return.

Now as we all should know that if one society discovers another hostile society has a particular weapon type that they don't have, it stands to reason they would build a weapon to either counter it or match it. So it only stands to reason that the Federation would themselves build carriers as well.

Thanks and I look forward to your responses.

Archived Post 06-05-2011 10:05 PM

Oh for frell sakes. Federation does not need a carrier.

This thread was a pretty good thread until that ending line. you talked as if you learned from your mistakes when fighting the klingons then POW QQ FEDS NEED CARRIER NAO QQ. you really had me going. you had a well thought out story. details like crazy which is something I really like. Changing of ship types. Process of learning. then QQ. seriously. Carriers are quite possibly the easist KDF ship type to kill lately. there is no OPness. Maybe you need to work on your builds some more to be able to take down certain types of ships. Maybe you need to work on your ship a little more. Whatever it is. FEDERATION DOES NOT NEED CARRIERS. We are the federation. Not the damn borg.

I'm not going to say anymore. I hope the forum goers rip this thread apart.

Archived Post 06-05-2011 10:16 PM

If you want help you'll need to provide more information such as the specific items, Boff skills, and most imporatantly tactics you used.

Your understanding of gear seems to be lacking. For example, "Purple" != best. Sets and/or combo of set items are better than most purples for most things. A green turret w/+accuracy for most cases is better than the same rank turret which is purple, but with only damage boost bonuses.

Further, turrets fire faster than beams (this isn't a KDF thing). Also CRF increases attack rate of cannons.

Your Boff skill choices need to have purposes either as one off cournters or as a combo.

For example TBR is a nice skill vs cannons as it will keep them out of their optimal range while keeping them w/in your beam firing arcs.

Another option would be to use for Sci ships would be CPB, tach beam, target subsystem shields or BO, and follow with HYT or Tric.

Tac Team w/shield boosting is a very nice combo for Shield tankers.

What is it you're trying to do? In your team example you have 4 cruisers and a sci boat. That's little burst DPS firepower and sans team FaW how are you going to finish anything off? Why don't you drop a couple of cruisers and add another sci and an escort for more CC and burst DPS? Is your team organize or PuG? Are you playing C&H, PuGs, or Open PvPvE?

TL/DR

Less rant more details.

Archived Post 06-05-2011 10:24 PM

if you are switching ships without re-speccing, any of my Toons will eat you for lunch. Klingon or Fed.

Archived Post 06-05-2011 10:27 PM

carriers only have 6 weipons but have 18 fighters or 6 bops and the player bop has 4,3. the fighters are 1/30 a ship and have 1/50 the firepower. they have weipons that are weaker and can be killed with 1-2 shoots and what about all those mines,FF ships, and sic spam? do they not count as weipons? NO FED CARRIER EVER!:mad::mad::mad::mad:

Archived Post 06-05-2011 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DecadeComplete
Oh for frell sakes. Federation does not need a carrier.

This thread was a pretty good thread until that ending line. you talked as if you learned from your mistakes when fighting the klingons then POW QQ FEDS NEED CARRIER NAO QQ. you really had me going. you had a well thought out story. details like crazy which is something I really like. Changing of ship types. Process of learning. then QQ. seriously. Carriers are quite possibly the easist KDF ship type to kill lately. there is no OPness. Maybe you need to work on your builds some more to be able to take down certain types of ships. Maybe you need to work on your ship a little more. Whatever it is. FEDERATION DOES NOT NEED CARRIERS. We are the federation. Not the damn borg.

I'm not going to say anymore. I hope the forum goers rip this thread apart.

(this isn't a productive response.. so thanks for not continueing)

Archived Post 06-05-2011 10:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by amidoinitright (Post 3575462)
if you are switching ships without re-speccing, any of my Toons will eat you for lunch. Klingon or Fed.


(Good pt and I failed to see that. Thanks for bringing it to my attention)

Archived Post 06-05-2011 10:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sarhamen (Post 3575464)
carriers only have 6 weipons but have 18 fighters or 6 bops and the player bop has 4,3. the fighters are 1/30 a ship and have 1/50 the firepower. they have weipons that are weaker and can be killed with 1-2 shoots and what about all those mines,FF ships, and sic spam? do they not count as weipons? NO FED CARRIER EVER!:mad::mad::mad::mad:


(Weak as they maybe, they still provide an offensive ability, which should not exist if the mother ship gets blown up. They should fade off. The ability to respawn them as fast as they do, I think should warrant a longer cool down. They still provide a greater number of ships to fire against and give the advantage of having to cycle through by rapid tapping of targets. Its clutter to the Advantage of the KDF. If your not going to kill them off when the mother ship gets blown up, then lower the number to three.)

(Good feedback. thank you)

Archived Post 06-05-2011 10:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iamid
If you want help you'll need to provide more information such as the specific items, Boff skills, and most imporatantly tactics you used.

Your understanding of gear seems to be lacking.

Absolutely. I always felt that the purps provided the best possible outfitting. When game was launched in open beta then in early launch, grabbing up purps was an indication of the best. They are listed as Very Rare so that should warrant them the better end of loot. If thats not the case, I got rid of some damn nice gear.

Thanks for the back brief.


For example, "Purple" != best. Sets and/or combo of set items are better than most purples for most things. A green turret w/+accuracy for most cases is better than the same rank turret which is purple, but with only damage boost bonuses.



Further, turrets fire faster than beams (this isn't a KDF thing).

Yeah I understood that..

Also CRF increases attack rate of cannons.

Your Boff skill choices need to have purposes either as one off cournters or as a combo.

For example TBR is a nice skill vs cannons as it will keep them out of their optimal range while keeping them w/in your beam firing arcs.

Another option would be to use for Sci ships would be CPB, tach beam, target subsystem shields or BO, and follow with HYT or Tric.

Tac Team w/shield boosting is a very nice combo for Shield tankers.

What is it you're trying to do? In your team example you have 4 cruisers and a sci boat. That's little burst DPS firepower and sans team FaW how are you going to finish anything off? Why don't you drop a couple of cruisers and add another sci and an escort for more CC and burst DPS? Is your team organize or PuG? Are you playing C&H, PuGs, or Open PvPvE?

I'm running in open PVP which means all manner of dregs will join.. I'll warp out if I encounter a premade team.. I just refuse to embarass myself by going against a premade team with a rift raft team.

I'm curiouse as to why SCI ships are touted as having the toughest shields yet mine don't seem to hold up.
I run with EMP to shields I, Engineer Team II, Hazard Emitters for the hull, I have a sci officer to pump up my shields.. yet they just get ripped into in a 1v1.

TL/DR

Less rant more details.


(Thanks again for your comments)

Archived Post 06-05-2011 11:07 PM

Good Grief...

Calm down. Ok, you calm, bro?
Good. Now, read below
Quote:

I was ina Nebula class vessel. He ate me up.. Went through my shields like nothing, and I struggled to even break his.
He was hardening his shields and balancing them. Learn to stack shield and hull resists and heals. A properly played Nebula or ANY cruiser will be very tanky.

Please, before you get the urge to go into anymore tirades, read up on the powers, learn buff/debuff, etc. Practice by doing, and don't just blatantly say "oh klinks are op!" Fly with the top fed fleets, and against them IF YOU DARE... They will absolutely murder you and not blink while doing it. Ask for help, don't just call out "he's cheating!" "cryptic gave klings OPness!"


I was using all purped weapons and he was in the green. I had purp shields, engine and deflector.. nothing seemed to work..
Gear color has NOTHING to do with whether you live or die. Your power selection. timing activation, sense of awareness, and general dogfighting skills will save your bacon whereas just having purple LEET gear will leave you breathing space.

I pvp with green/blue weapons, just the Aegis set (no borg gears), and I do ok with my BoP. I myself have pasted you a number of times, the name's Rozav and I'm a sci captain. To be honest it was fun shooting you and then seeing zone chat.

PS:
If you want to harden your shields, try this:
Emergency power to shields > Rotate shield frequency (if engineer) OR Transfer Shield Strength

Quick shield balancing?
Tac Team (any grade)

You want to shoot (burst) someone out of the sky?
Get an escort
Attack Pattern Alpha > Attack Pattern Omega / Beta > Beam Overload > Cannon Rapid Fire > High Yield

Stack, stack, stack abilities.

This goes double when you have teammates. Stack extend shields + tac team + transfer shield strength on a teammate and he'll thank you.

Coordinate with another escort for alpha strike? Yes please.

Learn by doing. I will happily target your ship every chance I get to help you learn the hard way.

PPS:
If you level up a KDF captain and put him in a carrier, I will happily target that with my Fed. Even though she's an engineer if she's respecced into escorts she WILL shoot you down as you are now. And if an engineer / escort can shoot you down, Kahless help you when facing very skilled tac / defiant pilots.


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