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-   -   Tal Shiar Adapted Battlecruiser as a Surrogate Science Vessel? (http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=733171)

miri2 06-03-2013 02:20 PM

Tal Shiar Adapted Battlecruiser as a Surrogate Science Vessel?
 
So, I've been flying a Varanus Support Vessel with my KDF sci for quite some time now, and as much fun as it is to play underdog with it, I'm considering looking into other possibilities to get my science fix.
I noticed that the Adapted Battlecruiser has the ability to manifest the same BOff load-out as my Varanus, and a very close spread of console slots, and that got me thinking.
Has anyone here tried using the Adapted Battlecruiser as a sort of heavy-duty science vessel? If not, anyone have any impressions on whether it would work for the job?
It's got the same aux bonus as a Varanus, a shield power bonus, a better shield multiplier, and nearly twice as much hull, but looks like it turns a little slower and lacks subsystem targeting, which looks to me to be the biggest trade-off.

I'd really like to get as many opinions as possible before I start prying open lockboxes for the lobi crystals, so thank you all in advance for your feedback!

majesticmsfc 06-03-2013 06:38 PM

I would avoid a lock box ship, as you're playing into Cryptic's hand. It be much better trying to throw your support behind getting a decent KDF T5 and Fleet science ship, like the D5 that was mentioned in a earlier thread a month back.

http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/sh...d.php?t=674011

I can understand your situation, I am in the same boat. My science runs the Kar'Fi which is a great ship but not really a true science ship, so she is rarely used. If I wanted to run a pure DSP build, I would just play my tactical.

Best of luck with whatever choice you make though the amount of money you're going to throw into those boxes really isn't worth it for the ship, no ship really is worth what 200 lock box keys?

4 Lobi per box X 200 boxes = 800 Lobi
1125 Zen per 10 pack of keys means you'll need to spend 22,500 Zen if I've done my maths right.

miri2 06-03-2013 08:00 PM

Well, I'm not sure how much I'd be encouraging lock-box-ism, since I already have 10.3k Zen socked away from when the exchange prices were really low after the Rep system premiered. (... then I found that there was nothing out there that I wanted to buy with it, so I've been looking for an excuse ever since. :P)
It'll probably be a while before Cryptic releases a T5 Klingon ship that can science as well as a Varanus*, so I'm willing to sink a stupid amount of zen into picking up a ship... if it's worth using for the job I want it to do*.
Also, it's not a Klingon ship-- which is good, since my KDF character can't stand Klingons. Has something to do with that whole "conquest of the Hegemony" thing...*

*: After all, Cryptic has three factions to work on now, one of whom has fewer end-game ships than even the KDF! Also, is probably more popular for the time being.
*: Just the same, if I do try this and the first 10-pack doesn't yield more than 6 lobi per box, I'll be abandoning the whole process then and there... and then selling the resulting pile of unwanted consumables on the Exchange as some sort of meager consolation prize. :P
*: And, for added points, I kinda' like how the Adapted Battlecruiser looks. It's ugly in a good way, and, unlike the Adapted Destroyer, it doesn't look like a wanna-be Tyranid. Well, not as much, anyway.:P

malkarris 06-03-2013 08:15 PM

Do yourself a favor, gets keys with zen, then sell them for EC and buy the ship with that off the exchange. Its down to about 70 million at the moment I think. You can get about 90 keys with your zen, so you should be able to make 90 million easy since lock box keys sell for about 1.3 million at least.

lianthelia 06-03-2013 10:11 PM

If you're going to spend zen to go after the Battlecruiser you're better off doing what malkarris said, the Battlecruiser is bought with lobi, so you could easily spend all of your zen on keys and not make the lobi needed.

If you're hoping to maybe get the Destroyer on your way to the Battlecruiser I would say don't bother, I made that mistake when I was trying for the Recluse when it was launched, hoping for the Orb Weaver console to put on it. Got up to 800 lobi and never got a Orb Weaver...

miri2 06-04-2013 12:15 PM

Thank you all for the suggestions on how to acquire the ship less dearly. I really do appreciate it, and will definitely be looking into the exchange before I start prying open lock-boxes.
Unfortunately, I don't know whether the Adapted Battlecruiser is even worth using for the job I want it to do: acting as a high-resilience science vessel-- a sort-of upgrade for my Varanus.
Is that even a role the Adapted Battlecruiser can proficiently fill? Is the drop in turn rate and removal of subsystem targeting cause it fall flat on it face the second I try? Or is there some other pitfall I'm missing?

malkarris 06-04-2013 12:41 PM

Well, I haven't flown this ship, so I'm just going off the wiki and what I know of the game in general.

Personally, I'd go with the Tal ship. Overall, you can probably do more direct damage with that one while hitting with science powers as well, and I prefer to go the route of science powers being the insult to my weapons injury. Alternately, if you play healer, this could well be a tripple threat, being able to tank, heal, and do damage thanks to its universal BOFF slots and aux to weapons power transfers. Again, just my opinion.

tom61sto 06-04-2013 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by miri2 (Post 10610371)
Thank you all for the suggestions on how to acquire the ship less dearly. I really do appreciate it, and will definitely be looking into the exchange before I start prying open lock-boxes.
Unfortunately, I don't know whether the Adapted Battlecruiser is even worth using for the job I want it to do: acting as a high-resilience science vessel-- a sort-of upgrade for my Varanus.
Is that even a role the Adapted Battlecruiser can proficiently fill? Is the drop in turn rate and removal of subsystem targeting cause it fall flat on it face the second I try? Or is there some other pitfall I'm missing?

Several Sci abilities, including sub-nuc, got their arcs changed to a nice and wide 135 degrees, so the turnrate is less of an issue than it would've been pre-LoR as far as Sci abilities go (not all changed, you should check what you use regularly for their arcs). Also, how Skills and consoles affect turnrate was changed with LoR, and with a RCS and a Tachokinetic Converter I can line up DHCs on my Kar'fi (same turnrate as the TSABC) in events where it wasn't viable before.

The innate Sub-System Targeting never really did that much for me, since it's only rank I. I don't bother with it on my Vesta, equipping it with all cannons/turrets instead, and I don't miss it much. Unless you can stack Flow Caps deep enough to drain 50 power, it does little to NPCs.

There was a thread not long ago praising their TSABC as Sci ship for KDF, so you're not the first to think of it in such a light. Edit: http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/sh...d.php?t=712631

miri2 06-04-2013 04:55 PM

Thanks, Tom, I... really should have looked a little more closely at page 2 before starting this thread...

As far as the subsystem targeting goes, it seems to make a difference for me, since I run a hybrid heal-boat/drain-boat build with my Varanus right now. It's a reaction to my realization that no matter how hard I try, nothing's going to make 4 beam arrays and a cutting beam a viable threat on a ship with only two tactical powers.
Oddly enough, the innate subsystem targeting has made it so I can actually hurt things occasionally by dumping their shield power and boosting my weapons power to 125 with EPtW 1, ES 3, and a base 70 power setting.
But I don't have any real way of tracking what how well that works, so who knows. *Shrugs.*

lianthelia 06-04-2013 07:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by miri2 (Post 10616341)
Thanks, Tom, I... really should have looked a little more closely at page 2 before starting this thread...

As far as the subsystem targeting goes, it seems to make a difference for me, since I run a hybrid heal-boat/drain-boat build with my Varanus right now. It's a reaction to my realization that no matter how hard I try, nothing's going to make 4 beam arrays and a cutting beam a viable threat on a ship with only two tactical powers.
Oddly enough, the innate subsystem targeting has made it so I can actually hurt things occasionally by dumping their shield power and boosting my weapons power to 125 with EPtW 1, ES 3, and a base 70 power setting.
But I don't have any real way of tracking what how well that works, so who knows. *Shrugs.*

Well look at it this way, you trade your SST and some turning for two weapon slots and 10k hull. You can give the ship a Ensign Tac and give it target shields I if you want to.


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