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Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 1,060
# 437
09-12-2013, 09:50 PM
Originally Posted by spacefortress View Post
All it takes is 1 second to kill a player, leaving bop players a free 4 seconds to smoke their victory cigar

With the amount of bleedthrough doffs (BO stacking) and criticals is now possible to kill a player with 75% shield resistence no matter if you have TSS + TT + RSP or eptS all working together, since a specially equipped bop or romulan spiker can shoot through that tough shield exterior without blanching with ease.... granted it requires timing and precision for a bop spiker but then again it requires defending players an equal amount of ...say 10 shield buffs and heal buffs to defend a op spike dmg attack in a single second....

oh wait ...that's right it doesn't work anymore since bleedthrough is so bad..that those spikers will penetrate your heavily defended shields regardless..... take it from me, having over 10 defensive buffs readily when minimax used his spike on me....well it was a surprise when his attack ignored my shields and popped my 60k hull boat inside a second despite the fact i had rsp III + TSS II + TT II + and Rotate shield frequency with high auxiliary power active...much to my disgust
Originally Posted by spacefortress View Post

The point I'm trying to say, is that double taps are not the only problems with bop spikers....the main problem is that there is too MUCH shield penetrating weapons, especially combined with the combo of doff penetration abilities that will melt a 60k hull without even damaging the shields of that defending ship
I understand what actually transpired now. He didn't hit you with Elachi weapons, maybe yes, maybe not, that's irrelevant. Nor did his shots actually ignore your shields per say. I think you should have at least saved the combat log. If I guess correctly, since I wasn't there, Mini was in his Emoe / Romulan T'Varo when this happened. His Tactical stations would look roughly like this :

Commander Tact : HY I, HY II, BO III, APO III
Ensign Tact : BO I

In addition, he will have DEM I + Marion and likely 3 X purple BO Doffs

At the time of the ambush, he would have stacked the following : BO I, BO III, HY I, HY II

His Fore Weapons set up would be two DBB, likely Acc X 3 Mk XII purple and two Quantum Torpedo Mk XII purple

Prior to decloaking, he would have activated APO III, APA III, possibly Tactical Fleet and even pop a Weapons Battery so that a purple Maintenance Engineer can add 10% all damages including Torpedos, and active EPtW for an additional 10% damage on Energy weapons

Assuming no Crits, and that all his 4 Tactical Consoles are used for his Energy weapons, this is what his damage would look like roughly :

BO I : 25K
BO III : 34K
HY I : 22K
HY II : 28K

The first shot that hit you is in fact a BO I. With RSP and all the heal buff on, the only damage that it did was really just the bleedthrough : 25K X 10% = 2.5K assuming hull damage resistance is neutral for now. So far, the damage is quite manageable.

But when that first BO hit you, the 3 stacking purple BO doffs proc (at 66% of the time) such that all subsequent attacks against you caused an additional 35% bleedthrough. 35% + 10% = 45%

Adding the damage of BO III + HY I + HY II = 34 K + 22 K + 28 K = 84 K

84K X 45% = 37.8 K

37.8K + 2.5k > 40K

Mini likely have additional rear weapons firing forward that are not accounted for here. At 40K, it should be insufficient to kill your Cruiser however, that may not be the case if any of the BO or HY Torp went critical. Mini likely have something like 150% critical severity so even if just the BO III goes critical, it will increase the overall damage by 23K to 63K, enough to destroy your 62K hull cruiser within a blink of an eye and yes through RSP as though it's not there.

The good news is despite these BO Doffs being abused (what a surprise, eh?) and deviated completely from their intended purpose - which is to aid cruisers, the recent change to BO will also nip it. Know that the 5 sec delay will actually prevent BO III from hitting you during the 4 sec proc window and the HY Torps can no longer stack within the same timeframe.

Re do the calculation above, the only damage that will be scored during the 4 sec period is a single HY I or II. Assuming it's HY II, then 45% of 28 K = 12.6K of hull damage. Adding the bleedthrough from the first BO, the total hull damage will probably be somewhere between 15-17K. Even assuming every single shot crit in a worse case scenario, it will still only mean 37 ~45K of your hull but it's highly unlikely every single shot will crit. More realistically, you will lose between 15~30K in hull so at most, half of your hull. Once you survive the initial alpha, Mini will be toast & crunchy too.

Originally Posted by g0h4n4 View Post
That just about summarizes the state of the game at present really, pre and post BO nerf. Extreme resists and heals.
I still fail to see any example of extreme resists and heals despite several claims to the effect.

I've played against you yesterday, you were indeed hard to pop as it should be really, one Double tapper shouldn't be able to vape a decent build really, unless you have two in coordination.
Yet, until the fix hits holodeck, that remains as easy as cutting a cake with the current double tappers.