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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 18
09-18-2011, 04:55 PM
Originally Posted by hurleybird View Post
And I feel horrible about basically shouting at you, but I'm just exasperated about all of the ways we have tried and failed to get through. We want to help. You guys need the help. What's the big problem?

That being said, all too often there is consensus (or something close enough to it) from the PvP population that ends up being ignored. We had consensus about the new FAW before it hit live, and we have consensus about torp spread now, same with scramble and antimatter spread. It looks like the entire "AOE only effecting 5 objects" is gaining a consensus against it as well.

And that being said, there are some people who simply know better than others. RPers and PvErs know basically nothing. The average PvPer knows quite a bit more, but not nearly as much as the top members of say, QEW or TSI know. If PvPers have consensus on something we're typically right. If the top PvPers have consensus on something then they are typically right, even if there is still debate among the larger PvP community.

Sorry, but I'll call BS on that one. The issue is that you don't put any effort into finding credible sources. Having design discussions on the tribble forums, TTS, or God forbid general discussion is going to pollute feedback to the point where it becomes worthless. Guys like Big Red, Era, and Kharn should be on your speed-dial but they aren't. Hell, I haven't even heard of a PvPer ever getting onto an internal or closed test shard, but for some reason this happens all of the time for STF players. In what universe is that the more important consideration for you guys?

That was me. And thanks for the straw man argument but that's not what I said. Here's what the deal is with the max 5 object AOE limit:
  • Balance should be a higher priority than performance. This doesen't mean that performance does not matter
  • You're encouraging massive amounts of spam as an easy and effective counter to AOE abilities
  • Spam sucks and isn't fun
  • A massive amount of spam is also going to create major performance issues, so you're stuck with the same problem anyway
  • Therefore any change in AOE abilities to only effect 5 targets should be met with an overhaul of spam. Specifically, greatly reducing it
  • Otherwise, you need to put in tech that allows you to distinguish players from other objects

People have been trying to point these things out to you, but you just aren't listening. You keep repeating yourself, and you aren't acknowledging any of the points we bring up. This is the problem -- a lack of communication and a "We don't need help!" attitude when you desperately do need it.

Then communicate those limitations to us so we can help you work around them! If you hopped onto OPvP, or better yet Vent/TS/Skype then we could understand better what you can and can not do. Again, we only want to help! What's the big issue here, pride?

If these systems are immensely complicated, then why don't you treat them as such? Slow down. Don't do things for the sheer hell of it (like changing the torp cooldown) without sober second thought from yourself and the PvP community.

If I'm being rude, it's simply due to sheer desperation at this point. I would like nothing more than a productive, mutually respective dialog. Give a little. Come onto OPvP. Vent up. Listen to us. We'll listen to you too. You'll get a much warmer response if you actually try to work with us.

Sure, it may sting your pride a little bit, but it can't be any worse than the constant **** storm of negativity that comes with every single change that you make when you don't listen!
The part in red I take exception to. That is your opinion and not fact. Simply because someone would tend to RP or PvE more than PvP doesn't mean squat in term of knowledge. I could just as easily say that PvP know nothing but I won't. Everyone has got their opinion and insights. One is no less valid than the other. If PvP people have a proble with a particular power being over powered or under powered... fine however, their opinion or knowledge is no better or worse thatn anyone else who has spent equal time playing the game.