View Single Post
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 805
# 51
10-30-2012, 02:13 PM
Originally Posted by bitemepwe View Post
The first parts biased specualtion with no proof considering there are 29+ cruisers ingame but only 20+ escorts and 25+ Science ships.
The last half may be right though since balance seems screwed.

Biased BS.

You should ahve been here before they nerfed it downto what it is today.

They work as healer/Support class very well.

What super buff? The 15 second +x damage resist or the 5 +% defense boost? Both are short lived and niether can get past the defense cap.
In fact a few Cruisers can even use ApO themselves.

You mean that extra 10% bonus defense from moving?

What buffed hull?

What defenses overtime? Everybody can use TT the same as any Escort? WHat new more tanky ship?

Which grew in direct response to the Cruiser insane healing........

Escorts don't use SNB. Science captains do and a Science captain can fly any ship. SO any ship can use SNB. Its not an Escort only thing.

What? Tactical team is unfair on an Escort even though everyone can use TT ingame, but a permanent TT effect for shield distribution is fair for Cruisers?????
You mean like the Engineer Captain abilities?

and Cruisers should get special Torpedo rules as well????

In PvE the problem with the Cruisers lies in that the NPCs are dealt with only by direct applied damage.
In PvP the problem with the Cruisers is a willingness for the playerbase to accept thier role is not as a Direct DD vessel even though agressive Tac/Cruiser pairings are possible.
1.) Number of ships are irrelevant, the fact is that the game mechanics favor escorts over everything else.

2.) I have been here since the game launched (actually a bit earlier in the OB).
I have seen and experienced everything from beginning to end. Starting with the wonderful combo of VM and snb lockdowns, using jam sensors to pull out sci teams, the fact that all ships had RSP as the only vialbe tankign skill, where cruisers dies i none escort pass, where everyone was complaining abut the array-ball of lame (hence the beam array getting nerfed 20% i n damage - without that ever being undone despite all ships getting defense upgrades in terms of base hp {yes, the base hp of all ships got raised, so the glass cannon escorts now are solid prize boxer jaws, whiel the buff to cruisers hp amounts to jack shiite since cannon dps simply is so much out of whack and inflated - all the while leaviong all other weapons at an even worse place.} and game mechanics thusly negating the reason the arrays got nerfed.)

3.) APO grants the escort immunity to the very thing that game mechanically was intended to kil lit: locking it down in movement impeeding powers, like warp plasma, like tractor beam. it also buffs defenses when flying SLOWER than top speed, thusly giving escorts more time to whack away with thir cannons.
Said cannons, at the VERY bginning of the game nuked cruisers almost instantly unless rsp was used. THAT lead to the several revamps to tanking. THAT lead to the era of invul-cruisers because the devs are just that dense. Then came the mitigation caps.

Curiously, NEVER did it occur to them to review the core problem - to few hp on ships and shields combined with guns that do too much damage.
Instead of simply upping the hp pools, they went for boff power based mitigation with has send us into a maddening cycle of buffs and revamps that left the escorts standing as the most efficient ship.

4.) I complain about snb on escorts mostly because that simply is the worst combination.

You give the ship that can burn down other ships fast the ability to strip those ships of their defensive, offensive and utility powers and increases the cd's AND almost requires said ship to sacrifice a slot on sci team and then go ahead and create doffs that massivly boosts the number of snb's it can churn out.

And then you wonder why people complain. SNB, with its "STRIP ALL THE BUFFS!" approach is simply put totally out of line compared to other captain powers (engineers, anyone?) and the continued refusal to aknowledge that is baffling me still today.
This is a power that uterly and completly negates ALL powers the opposing captain has used. ALL of them. INSTANTLY.
It was broken at the beginning, it was broken along the middle its even more broken today.
VM got a nice tweak that turned it from a total lockdown power into a shutdown that applys its nasty effect over a duration. Snb should do the same.

5.) Making shield distribution depend on tactical team was and is another moronic move on crpytics part.

It is a fact that the inhate shield redistribution does absolutely nothing since the magnitude of shields shifted is laughably small, the recharge of that power is to long and you have to hammer the buttong or use a script to even use it.

Now, escorts are not affected by this, they are agile enough to just move the shield arc they want towards the enemy + they have an abundance of tac slots for tac teams.

Cruisers however cannot move like that, they also have very few tac slots.
They are forced (oh sci ships too, btw) to use TAc teams, its VITAL to them. They literally cannot go without.

So you either have to rework shield redistribution as a whole or give cruisers(and sci ships) a boon. Because right now you are again, with game meachanics, favoring escorts.

6.) As i said: the whole trinity thing is a terrible idea. I alrady explained why over several dozen threads over the past years.
Abridged: Every ship class should be able to do damage and heal itself roughly equally well. The diversification should stem from: how said damage is achieved, how they heal up, how they handle (tieeing into how they deal damage).


Crusiers heal themselves with hots (both hul land shields get restored over time, no isntant heals) that include mitigation, they tank with mitigation and they attack via arrays, beam banks and volleys of torpedoes - because they are cruisers and have the room to house all those torpedo's and launchers. They are the logical choice for a ship that bombards others. (naturally one can switch out weapons to modify that behaviour - spamming mines, using single cannons etc)

Science ships heal themselves via drains (basically drain life so to speak), wrangles (steals part of your stats and adds it to theirs), they defend via illusions, anomalies and technobabble (basicaly powers that grant immunity for a duration, defense, buffs, resitances etc). They attack with negative space wedgies and weapons.

Escorts heal themselves via instant heals that are on a cooldown, they tank with movement related powers that lower incoming accuracy, increase defense or give outright dodge chances. They attack in short but power full bursts aimed at attriting the defense of their target and making break throughs. Hots do not instant heal after all.
They cannot survive sitting some palce and taking fire since their heals are on cooldowns and have no over time component that yields further healing.

See, now all ships classses can basically do the same, but simply do it differently. They still have specialitys that when added and combined with other classes yield good results for teams working together.

Ships stats, weapon stats etc would have to be thoroughly redone of course so please do not start yapping about stats and exact numbers.