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Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,753
# 52
11-23-2012, 06:42 PM
Originally Posted by bareel View Post
I will try this one last time for you Skyranger. Tanking is about avoiding taking damage, or healing away the damage when you do not have someone else healing you.
You're proving you really don't understand what tanking is about either. The idea is not only to be unkillable and keep yourself alive.... you ALSO need to HOLD AGRO. If you're not HOLDING AGRO all your invincibleness is wasted. So you end up with a super tough ship that isn't taking advantage of its most beneficial traits because it never gets targetted! If you do end up getting targetted at all it probably happens when the escort that was actually tanking finally pops and the NPC baddies look for other targets.

How often do we hear this very same incorrect statement "tanking is about not getting killed"? How is it that holding agro is missed so often?

Originally Posted by canis36 View Post
.......... What bugs us is that when we try to do anything OTHER than tank or heal we have people telling us to either get lost or get an escort. And a lot of the time we get the same reaction even when we do try to fill the tank/healer role because there's really not much use for it in the endgame content. You can argue the point, but when the optimal solution to a mission is to have five escorts specced for raw firepower a tank/healer is completely superfluous.
I can honestly say I've done hundreds of ESTFs and I've only seen anyone critrisize another player once, and I've never done it myself. That's the true beauty of the design Cryptic has made, you don't NEED to have optimal builds to get through anything. So if you want to play a non tanking cruiser... more power to you, you can still get through anything. You must realize though, that you are purposevely NOT using your ship's strengths, and therefore you will be comparatively underpowered when you compare yourself against others that DO try to play to their ship's strengths.

Originally Posted by canis36 View Post
Actually skill points put into threat control are wasted, at least in skill tree's current form because those skill points can be used to greater effect in other places and putting even three points into that skill is 7500 that can be used elsewhere to buff various subsystems, science skills, shield strength or healing, hull strength or healing, critical damage and hit chance, or just straight damage.
... like I said above, if you choose to ignore your ship's tanking potential you are wasting a lot of your ship. You can do it and still contribute, but don't expect to be as amazing at content as people that build to their ship's strengths.

Originally Posted by canis36 View Post
I'll also note you said absolutely nothing about my thought that Threat Control and Attack Patterns should be swapped to encourage people to skill into Threat Control by reducing the opportunity cost of taking points into Threat Control. It's almost as if you think that making it less of a burden to skill into Threat Control is a bad idea? Or is it that you don't want to have to pay more for a boost to your nifty and powerful attack patterns, skills that only escorts/raptors/BoPs can truly use to effect?
I didn't comment on this because I was hoping you might catch on as to WHY its done that way. You are looking at attack patterns, but fail to realize that not only escorts use them. Every ship and captain type should at least consider taking that skill. If it had a higher opportunity cost how many Sci Vessel and Cruiser pilots would take them? Its like asking why are shield systems so low?.... the answer is the same, so that everyone takes it!

Looking beyond that, the threat skill is pretty much on its own. You don't need to spec into several skills to hold agro. This is done by DESIGN so that players like you that choose to fly non-tanking cruisers can do so. Compare that to something like survivability or damage dealing that are spread over several skills. As to why its so high up on the tree.... its THE defining skill for a tanking ship, by itself it enables tanking builds to fulfill half of their primary functions, it even adds a resistance bonus! I see nothing wrong with it being so high up.

Originally Posted by sussethrai View Post
I did spend the points on Threat Control because I do tank, and wanted to take the heat off our escorts while they did what they are specced to do, incinerate the enemy. I don't put out anywhere near the firepower they do, and that, in our team, isn't my job. I keep the escorts flying and delivering the hurt. Have you ever tried boosting an escort with EPS Transfer 3 right before they delivered an alpha strike? Or a Sci when it's about to dump a Gravity Well? That will get even a tactical cube's attention. I also dump warp plasma and radiation clouds, after our science officer has immobilized a cluster of enemies with a gravity well or Tyken's Rift. Then the aforementioned escorts come in and it's cleanup on Aisle 3.

tl;dr Get a consistent group of people you can work with and know your role!
We need more tank pilots like you! Too many try to fly their cruisers like.... pre-aircraft carrier battleships and the game just isn't built like that. I know its a little heartbreaking to realize the giant uber cruisers aren't so ultimate at everything but that hardly means cruisers are useless. It just means people need to learn how to play them.

Last edited by skyranger1414; 11-24-2012 at 07:54 AM.