Compilation of why cruisers are UP
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Join Date: Dec 2012
12-25-2012, 08:51 PM
Originally Posted by
Damage is linear while defences use a [1-1/(1+x)] type of model to prevent reducing damage to zero. If resistances stacked in a linear fashion then you could conceivably reach 100% resistance and avoid all damage, regardless of how much an attacker buffed it. That's what you need to keep in mind, they are independent of each other. Attackers deal damage while defenders resist percentages. That's why it doesn't matter how high an attacker buffs their damage, a defender will always take a % of it. The higher the resistances the lower the % taken.
This type of damage mitigation is often favored in game design because it allows a lot of latitude without being limited by hard caps. Granted it gets hit with ridiculous DR at high defensive values and then it becomes a design balancing act as gear inflation takes place. I would even propose the reason we haven't seen ships really go up in power dramatically is an attempt to keep gear progression in check since they already know that defences are already hitting really high percentages if players really decide to go for it.
Edit: I agree that a mere +2 to turning would make cruisers a lot more fun to play and would even add their effectiveness since they could more reliably get to critical spots.
Also, I think its true that in the game's original design all ships did comparable damage and had comparable survivability... they would just go about it in different ways. I don't know WHY that plan was abandoned as it really would make the game more interesting.
All that said I think cruisers suffer the most from having poor pilots. Lets not kid ourselves, for a new player leveling in an escort or sci vessel is HARD. They don't know how to stay alive and deal damage so they gravitate towards cruisers that can easily carry anyone through the PvE levelling content without actually teaching anything about how to play. I know this because that's what I did. It wasn't until I saw someone being effective with a non cruiser that I started to look at HOW to build ships and use them properly. I would say a lot of the people complaining cruisers are drastically underpowered have noticed others playing well and instead of choosing to learn themselves prefer to complain. Perhaps they are a cruiser fan that desperately wants their favorite ships to be above all others in everything, perhaps they simply don't think they should be forced to learn a totally different game than the one they played while pve leveling in a cruiser (a valid complain actually), or maybe they are still in the process of learning and will understand how to get the most out of their ships eventually.
On the other hand if someone's complaint is that the way the ship roles have evolved into high dps/medium survivability, medium dps/high survivability, and High CC/medium survivability is not to their liking and has several flaws as a system... that can be valid. Honestly, at this point I'm not sure how to bring all ships to do equal DPS, while having equal survivability... except maybe making cruisers more like escorts? Lower their defences while adding a few points of turning and maybe switching an eng console to a tac one? Admittedly what I suggest is more or less making fed cruisers into KDF battlecruisers. Do KDF players feel their cruisers are underpowered too?
Okay took me awhile, but I think I get it.
So if my FDC had resistance 50% from consoles and the like and gets hit for 1000 damage it will block 500 hp of damage, but if I get hit for 2000 damage I block 1000 damage and if I got hit for 26,000 damage I'd only take 13,000 damage, blocking the other 13,000.
So an Escort attacking me with say a 100 percent damage bonus is actually dealing less then 50 percent of that bonus to me in damage. So if the escort deals 500 damage originally and with a hundred percent dealt an additional 500 damage I would block 250 from his original base damage and 250 from his bonus damage for 500 in total effectively negating his entire bonus even though his attack bonus is a 100 percent and my resist is only 50% because his bonus is based only on his base damage, while my resist is based his total damage dealt.
I think the simplest way of explaining the advantage of armour stacking is that points of damage blocked scales automatically with increases in damage dealt, but the reverse is not true.
Judeo jutisu, you use thier strength against them.
As for cruisers aside from the Borque or what ever its called, FDC are probably the closest the KDF has to Fed Cruisers and I fly one and honestly I've found I'm alot more survivable in it then my fed escort. How much my hanger has to do with that I don't know, although I have 250 more crew and .1 shield thingy and an extra ensign sci Boff over the Advanced Heavy Cruiser the closest the Feds have to comparing to my Dacoit. I'm a tact commander btw, grade 26. Same turn speed and hull though as the Advanced Heavy Cruiser.