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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 141
# 141
01-30-2013, 04:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by broken1981 View Post
can you quote me on it? cause ide love to see that. i have said that i always had x2 omegas on a ship. i said its not used for breaking tractors. when tb pets was all you saw in pvp i would slot a ph. im under the impression that the op is blaming a doff for seeing x2 omegas. i said its always been like that. i gave examples of people with et and sci team doffs. so a straight out attack on omega doffs itself is not a valid point. but i am not ignoring the subject of omega having a longer up time on key aspects in the power itself. its not meant to do that.
I'm sorry, I had you confused with another poster. ussultimatum had been arguing that APO was required for escorts because they had unique mobility needs, that was the original context in which APO was brought up, and that was what my post to which you were replying was about.

I think doffs in general need a balance pass, but the reason people complained about APO in the first place was that it allows escorts to be much better at self preservation than other ship types.

When my engineer is in a cruiser, they have basically the same engineering powers for self preservation that they do in an escort. The cruiser picks up a copy of Aux to SIF 3 which I could use on myself, if I'm playing it in a healing spec. But if I need to escape movement debuffs, the cruiser starts off worse than the escort since it has a poorer speed multiplier -- and if I'm even able to power out of them the cruiser's turn rate is so low that it get's dropped to 0 and I'm stuck flying away in a straight line unable to turn. If I'm not playing an Excelsior, I don't even have the possibility of turning with my movement debuffed.

Same character in an escort picks up two copies of APO in addition to much more efficient use of engine power. Popping a battery and evasive in the escort is usually enough to get me moving and give me a reasonable turn rate, and since the two copies of APO cover so much time, I almost always have time for the batteries and evasive to cool down.

So with the same character in a ship which should in theory be tankier, I am much more likely to suffer a negative defense, and much more likely to be stuck while enemy escorts pull to a dead stop behind me and batter down one shield facing.
Quote:
not to clear on why you would bring up epts and tss trying to say in my logic.......inless your trying to link it to what i was saying about tt being op...? not to clear on what your trying to say to me.
It's because you said you survived being immobilized because your team was covering you rather than because of APO.

APO is a massive buff to survivability because of the mobility aspect of it. I can't think of any other case where one ship type has access to a defense that the others don't -- where one ship type is self-sufficient where the others aren't.

Quote:
ok i think i understand now. are you saying this because of my ph comment? of so thoes were the days you used omega and still thoes stupid tb pets locked you back up. so omega, ph, omega, ph. which clearly shows that omega is an attack power. sure you can break holds, but really its ment to keep dhc on target as well as buffing dhc for that alpha. that way you cant tb me in place, tbr or psw. not omfg i got 5 people on me and 1 guy is using tb must....use.....omega......!!!!!
I think maybe you're not conscious of how much the omega is covering you. I know it's used for the DPS, but while it's up you have defense near 100% (less if it gets fixed, but it's still likely to be 50%+ if you aren't at a stop). If you get stopped, your defense is likely to drop to a little below 0%. In that respect, it's one of the most powerful defensive buffs in the game, since it's what allows you to speed tank.

In my escort I don't really pop omega to tank, but I do save other powers to cover the gaps when it's not up. If I'm goofing around with a 'DPS' cruiser (I know it's an oxymoron) then if I have a copy of omega, it's definitely more of panic button just because I have few other options to avoid that defense penalty.

In non-escorts, the need for mobility isn't so much to keep their defense astronomical, but just to prevent it from going negative. That's why I'm less interested in nerfing APO than in allowing other ways to maintain mobility in the science and engineering trees. PH and A2D both kinda sorta do what APO does defensively, but neither is as effective, and both come with higher opportunity costs (like you say, APO is worth using just for the damage).

Last edited by inktomi19; 01-30-2013 at 04:24 PM.