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Ensign
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 5
# 14
02-01-2013, 10:09 AM
Technically nothing makes a sci ship a sci ship unless its a fed sci ship - nevertheless, the bop fits the bill for a ship that can toss one of the three or so useful boff sci abilities and bring something else to the table.

Vu'Qov screams "I can only point my deflector at pve targets, and even that is annoying - but i can tank like a boss...with an engie at the helm boosting my wep, shields, and aux to max so i can actually do dps and quick launch my external torpedo tubes like i know what I'm doing".
Admittedly, you can't really hold aggro in a Vo as an engie like you can in a bc, but hey, who cares, if you actually needed to tanks things in this game for longer than it takes for your tac buddies to kill it then we'd have problems wouldn't we?

Kar'Fi is better sure, but a tac in a Kar'fi embarrasses a sci in a Kar'fi.
-neither, of course, can cloak - barring t5 and a short phase shift-

I've seen the difference, what with loving sci ships, dumping all my resources into both my fed and kdf sci - with every boat you might want to fly to choose from for either - and they're differences that make no difference relative to simply bringing another tac in a dps boat - I know, I know, sucks, I don't like it anymore than you, but it is what it is. The only sci boff skills useful in pve -at all- are gravwell, siphon, and tbr. The most useful thing you have in any stf as a sci you'll have in whatever ship you fly -subnuc the cube/boss buffs and ss-.

In hive though, I do love my mirror Vo. I use siphon (what with not needing to face) and go broadside with beams at range (normally cannons would be better - but range is nice in hive agreed) and hammer em with micro'd bops. Facing the queen for subnucs is fun as well. Similar effect with a Kar'Fi and dbbs plus advanced frigs on micro for the tricos. That said, I generally don't pug Hive, and in a 5 man.......sigh.....5 dps ships again, gumby, fleets, raptors, whatev.

Long story short, your best debuffs are always available to you. Fed scis get SA, and that's nice - but barring the vesta (which again I love) they're just not too hot for pve. Not that Bops are incredibly hot for pve either - but its a similar situation with a vesta - you have dps (not escort/raptor but hey - can't have it all). If you're outdamaging people in pve with your carrier -pets included- you simply have better gear/they're just bad. Don't get me wrong, I could rant and rave all day long with you about the dps centric nature of pve, but our ranting and raving won't change the state of the game at present.

DPS is the name of the PVE game, and sci's aint playing it. In pvp...well...you're required - and in that arena, the b'rel brings something that simply cannot be duplicated by any other ship, the heghta less so - and both can cloak. Nothing else meets the "can sci it up" and "can cloak" bar like the bops. But hey, maybe I'm missing something, you tell me. What sci do you want to throw that a bop can't throw? Hell, if we're talking pve in a sci boat, specifically kdf side....the ability to slot a commander and ltc tac while retaining subnuc and ss in a bop will likely give you higher single target dps for an stf, provided you don't pull aggro...and those lovely new negative threat part gen plasma infused consoles......might just convince me to put away my Karp and go to the bop for stfs. Just shift the boffs around to transition between aoe (probes) and single target (cubes/bosses structures - but if you keep thy3 you can run the aoe boffs against the structures and cubes anyway for epic kinetic lulz.

In PVP, sci is all about disable/cc (and of course your two "take em anywhere" debuffs"). Show me a sci boat, barring vesta, that can run as much of that at once (and in the case of the b'rel - most of it from absolute safety). I'm always down for a new build/boat.

(even if we invoke the specter of trico bomber groups in pve - tacs in escorts raptors still do it better-raaaaaage..but, i guess that's getting nerfed anyhow, so I'll have less to complain about. All this said, again, I , like you, love sci, and think people undervalue them - but one has to recognize that they're undervalued for a reason - even if people put their value just a tad lower than it actually is. It -is- telling though, that the best thing to happen to sci in a long time is to be given a ship than can play quasi escort..aint it.)

Last edited by kassahn; 02-01-2013 at 10:55 AM.