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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 102
# 36
03-18-2013, 08:04 PM
Originally Posted by pantsmaster916 View Post
Oh come on...

You must realize you're in the VAST minority by claiming that the Borg are "too easy" or "pathetic", right?

Besides, Borticus is only talking about one-shots here, which I think even the elitists like yourself can claim are a freakin' joke.
Well... okay, maybe I'm in this minority too, but hear me out here:
Working from two basic premises (1: the idea of an STF is to require team-work; 2: all major roles--striker, tank, healer, controller-- should be accounted for in an STF for best results)... yes, the borg are "too easy." Personally, I'd reserve the label of "pathetic" for just the Assmilated Carrier of Cure Space, who, in my opinion, is a complete joke*.

The problem as I see it is this: as the Borg and the STFs are laid out, only one of our four space-based STFs require more than a very small amount of very basic teamwork, and I can't help but feel that part of this is due to the borg being, by and large, slightly under-gunned, and slightly to substantially underpowered defensively, depending on which ship you're looking at.

When I say that the borg are "slightly under-gunned," I am, of course, setting one-shot insta-deaths aside. Except under specific conditions (see later quote) one-shot kills are a very poor way of making the Borg challenging-- it does not allow the tank to stick around to tank properly, or the healer to fix the ship who's under attack, and most of these one-shots are unlikely to be affected by most controller-role debuffs.
If the standard Borg in STFs did a little bit more DPS, but with the spikes tamped down a little bit, that might work a little better from the perspective of encouraging/requiring team-work. The higher DPS means that lone escorts get burned down if they try to Rambo a cube on their own, but a tank can keep the enemy's attention for long enough for the escort to do his job.
Middling DPS with the occasional arbitrary one-shot prevents this core role interaction from functioning properly, as I understand it.

... or I could be wrong. That's not an uncommon occurrence with me. :P

*Regarding the Assimilated Carrier: While I do maintain that the poor thing's an absolute joke of an STF boss, the carrier shows up at the end of what's probably the hardest of the core six STFs, so the party's usually earned a bit of a lop-sided beat-down by that point.

Originally Posted by dapperdrake View Post
one shot kill is something without any interest. No gameplay. No challenge. Why? Because there is nothing to strike back one shot kill. One shot kill and invisible death are something from lazy devs mind. And everyone knows how much those such cryptic devs are lazy.
I agree with you in part, Drake. Arbitrary one-shots (such as eating a 50k damage standard plasma torp from a UM in Hive Onslaught) do very little to increase challenge in an effective manner. This is 100% correct.

However, conditional, triggered, or otherwise avoidable one-shots can certainly add both challenge and interest.

For example, the plasma energy bolts that the Unimatrix command ships fire can be avoided with a combination of speed, firepower, and/or movement debuffs, when combined with a bit of situational awareness (this last part is where I tend to fail). That adds a degree of challenge and interest, since now you're relying on either your wits and reaction, or the assistance of your party's controller to keep you safe. Interest!

Another example could be Donatra's high-yield photon torpedo attack, which I tend to class as a one-shot kill in anything but the most extreme cases. Because Donatra is polite enough to declare quite distinctly when she's going to use it, and whom she intends to use it on, it can be avoided by very quickly getting out of range or out of her forward arc.

The same could be said for the borg queen's aceton-'splodey-nova-of-doom (which establishes a fairly wide null zone around her, but opens up for a few minutes once she's used it), though it would be nice if it had a slightly clearer tell.

Even the Unimatrix torpedo spread of mega-death could be classed in here if its recharge time was just a little longer so that it only took one science officer keep it suppressed with subnuc.

Like what I said before, I could be wrong. I'd love to hear a counter-argument.
Civilly put, of course. :)

Last edited by miri2; 03-18-2013 at 08:08 PM. Reason: Tweaked spacing to mitigate "wall of text" look.