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Captain
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 3,465
# 15
03-22-2013, 11:56 AM
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Originally Posted by tau41 View Post
Just a note here-you insulted me first.
Oh really?


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Originally Posted by tau41 View Post
So I popped on here and saw a bunch of threads about crafting. For the most part, they are whining about how bad it sucks, which is widely acknowledged, with very little about what to be done about it.
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Originally Posted by tau41 View Post
See, you just outright don't get it.
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Originally Posted by tau41 View Post
I'm not going to bother explaining that dilithium sinks are here to stay because it's obviously beyond your ken.
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Originally Posted by tau41 View Post
But here, let me help you out. To sum up the both of you, you put forward lousy ideas that neither change the fundamental system nor address its serious flaws.
All before I called you on it. If you're going to lie, at least do it in a way that isn't instantly noticeable.

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Originally Posted by tau41 View Post
You're a KDF member. Proud Warrior of House... whatever. The Empire has enemies, and your ship is on the front lines, proud to be defending and promoting the ideals and valor of the empire...

Except that you're off in engineering or wherever, tinkering with crap no one wants because everyone is requisitioning better things through NPC's (as you stated). You bring shame and dishonor to your family, and should be shunned, you awful, lousy Klingon.

Nice pack of assumptions you're making there, notably that every KDF member is a Klingon and that they all ascribe to the exact same cultural stereotypes, but I digress.

None of that makes a crafting system less viable for a KDF character than a Starfleet character. If you can't handle the fact that your own character is doing what you appear to believe is menial labor (which assembling, experimenting with and improving massively powerful pieces of machinery most certainly is not), than simply put yourself in the shoes of the genius engineer you keep in the bowels of your ship.

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Originally Posted by tau41 View Post

Look. The literal reason here that I feel strongly that the current crafting system is just garbage is mostly the arms race theory in design.
Translation: I don't like gear based MMO progression.

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Originally Posted by tau41 View Post
What role is crafting supposed to play?
What crafting should be is a viable means to create gear that makes the game more enjoyable in a way that is neither superior, nor inferior, to other methods with the same goal. For some that will be vanity items. For others it will be powerful equipment.

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Originally Posted by tau41 View Post

Your solution, to add mk XII items that are competitive with what's out there is good on paper, and bad in practice BECAUSE of the arms race theory. Every patch, or at least every so often, they will want to release a new rep, or something new with NPC's to keep player interest up. One of the easiest ways to make players want to pursue that content is new, better, flashier gear. If you update the crafting system to current standards, you bump up the power level in the game (which many people on the forums claims is a little whacked anyhow), AND you create a situation where next patch, we'll see Mk XIII and Mk IV super items because the devs want to get everyone excited about the new stuff.
And now we're back to "I don't like gear based MMO progression".

In addition, allowing crafting to reach the same ceiling as other gear sources in no way makes that ceiling any higher. If I bounce a ball 25 feet high, and then bounce another ball the exact same height, the first ball doesn't magically bounce higher.

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Originally Posted by tau41 View Post

Conversely, if you make crafting about items that aren't widely available from other segments of the game, it gives the devs a reason to keep updating crafting every patch, which keeps guys like yourself happy (or well, happier) in the long run. Crafting couldeven become about fun things at that point, and no one would mind because there is ALWAYS a market for fun.
I guess you missed the part where I advocated for items that were crafting exclusive?

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Originally Posted by tau41 View Post
And finally... just a consideration for you... No one is going to have money or resources to grab your crafted items until they finish getting the rep items they want because they're sinking a sizable chunk of their resources into the daily rep grinds. If you work WITH this consideration, you realize that prices for everything have a pretty low critical mass-which is good for somethings and REALLY BAD for expensive crafting. I grind out my MACO set, why am I going to want to Aegis? Seriously, *why*? I also consider it "dumb" that the supreme crafted items compete with the Rep items-that's just a lose/lose situation.
Following that logic, why have Omega, Adapted Maco or Borg sets since we have a Maco set? You want everyone wearing the same armor, carrying the same rifle, flying the shame ship equipped with the exact same weapons, shields and engines?

Because reducing variety is exactly what leads to that sort of thing. Increasing viable options leads to people having more and more things to mix and match, and create interesting, workable and fun combinations.

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Originally Posted by tau41 View Post
Do you get that? Are we at least one the same page now?
I understand that you're looking for something in a crafting system that the vast majority of MMO players wouldn't touch with a twenty foot pole and a hazmat suit.