Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 1 Any lawyers out there?
02-06-2010, 10:27 AM
Is it possible to start a class action law suit?

Maybe if just once gamers stood up for themselves as a whole we could make an example out of one company and scare the rest into only releasing completed products like console games.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 2
02-06-2010, 10:30 AM
The sad part is, you really truly probably believe deep down in your heart that you have a valid point.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 3
02-06-2010, 10:32 AM
Did you know: More Americans are overweight than pay Income Tax. According to recent statistics, 68% are above the average healthy weight, but only around 50% pay Income Tax.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 4
02-06-2010, 10:35 AM
fan boys...


Really.

Buy a condom with a hole in it?
A loaf of bread missing two slices?
a car missing a bumper?

Would you accept these purchases?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 5
02-06-2010, 10:46 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Koldfusion View Post
Buy a condom with a hole in it?
a car missing a bumper?
Knowingly selling such items to customers would be gross negligence.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Koldfusion View Post
A loaf of bread missing two slices?
Incosequesntial, and getting a refund or exchange would be pretty easy.

STO on the otherhand is just a game. I am pretty sure that in the Term & Conditions it is clearly stated that downtime, errors, bugs, etc are ilkely to happen, and that by purchasing the game you acknowleddge those facts.

I doubt anything has happened to anyone yet that would even warrant anykind of legal action.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 6
02-06-2010, 03:39 PM
You know, I am just gonna add my two cents to this, just because I've seen him use this sillyexample before.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Koldfusion View Post

Buy a condom with a hole in it?
A loaf of bread missing two slices?
a car missing a bumper?

Would you accept these purchases?
1 ) Condom with a hole in it : Depends if I knew about it. Maybe I needed a really good strainer of fluids? I've known some special effects companies that have used condoms not for the purposes intended. Then there are also gents who want to "fool" the women they are with and really want to get them pregnant.

2 ) Loaf of Bread : I think as Cygnus-D puts it, this is easily exchanged. The price of bread, in most "stable" countries with non-rampant inflation is not that much. Besides this, I do not know too many people who would know the exact number of slices in a loaf of bread. Maybe there is such a thing and this would make a VERY good quiz question for a TV game show such as "Jeopardy"? In the states, there are laws that cover reasonable variances in "hand-made" foods. If it is close, it is legal. Even then, if you are dealing with a personal baker, I am sure you'd get another loaf back.

3 ) Car with a missing bumper (or door as he has listed before) : I sure would! Such a thing would probably be discounted and if the discount was great and the car's model was desirable to me, I'd buy it and go out and buy a stock fender or door for the car!

And here is the thing: the #3 example is probably closest to buying STO. Actually, if you were in Beta, you know what kind of goods you are buying, just like it is obvious with the car. If you were NOT in Beta, well, you still have a thirty days free to try it before you have to cancel your account. That's not a bad deal to try something out. I know of some car dealerships, especially in recent economic down times, that will give you 30 days to consider a purchase, but that was not the norm. And let's face it: STO is not as big an a financial investment on your part as an automotive would be.

Now, if you bought a Lifetime...well, there is still time to cancel it (they allowed people in CO to do so early on). I just don't understand why someone with an in-game avatar and a sig such as yourself would feel so slighted by this game.

But really, someone mentioned Windows (and others mentioned games that get patched up). You know, as much as I would LOVE for Microsoft to get sued, especially because it is a more IMPORTANT piece of everyday software that many more folks use, they probably are not gonna get sued. People may grumble, some may go to Linux or get a Mac, but people put up with it. Through all the years, in regards to your version of "quality" and a particular company's version, no case has won out. "Quality" is subjective. Always has been. Maybe that makes people "sheep" but there are other things most people worry about in regards to their personal lives. This can be a bad thing (such as not worrying about government laws/regulation), but that wall can be a big one to fight. Most need to worry about their jobs and making sure their children are healthy and so on. All in all "software" is not that necessary (unless your company deals with it) for the average person, even Windows. Game software, doubly so.

Whatever you want to think, go read some Dev posts. Reason they haven't answered every post, beyond that it would be inhumanely impossible to answer the threads that pop up every minute asking the same question for those that didn't bother to glance over 1-10 pages worth of topics that come out everyday, is because they are pretty darn busy with implementing Klingon content, Fed content, bugs, and a few other things that probably shoulda been fixed before release.

But I ain't angry over "unfinished polish" of the game. Heck, even Romulans and those little guys with the pig noses and that race that talks about walls falling with their arms wide ain't even in the game. And why should they be? Those are for expansions. Okay, so some, such as yourself, may be bored of the game, or not. So...leave. End of story. Maybe this will make you happier. No, you want to be a self-appointed "moral judge" and save people from themselves. Let people come up with their own perceptions of the game and act on it. It is not hard for them to uninstall the game. Yes, maybe it is human nature to post a "sour grapes" post, even though it really is not classy or mature, but that is the nature of the best and I can't begrudge them. The fact that these posts are not wiped/closed speaks nicely of Cryptic, I should think, compared to some other MMO companies that squelch any form of negative talk of the game on their forums.

Fanboy? Hater? There are many who are just "gamers" and play what they like. If they don't, it is easy enough to move on. "The game's the thing." Maybe in a few months this game will meet your standards. Maybe not. If not, it is time to move on to something else for you and not be pre-occupied with "lawsuits". Vote with your money.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 7
02-06-2010, 10:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cygnus-Dax View Post
Knowingly selling such items to customers would be gross negligence.


Incosequesntial, and getting a refund or exchange would be pretty easy.

STO on the otherhand is just a game. I am pretty sure that in the Term & Conditions it is clearly stated that downtime, errors, bugs, etc are ilkely to happen, and that by purchasing the game you acknowleddge those facts.

I doubt anything has happened to anyone yet that would even warrant anykind of legal action.


Even by a game developer or publisher claiming you agree to downtime, bugs, etc, etc the EULA and ToS are not ironclad. More EULA's and ToS's have been deemed worthless is court then have been upheld.

Oh and the bit about game play changing, that is another bogus byline companies use that does not and never will stand up in a court of law. It is too ambiguous to be used as a legal safeguard.

To put it in a way that any young adult or older should grasp you need to view a game as any other product you pay money for. There is a reasonable expectation attached to all products and services in the U.S. When those reasonable expectations are not met and money has changed hands the customer is due relief or remedy to either replace the faulty product or a refund when no replacement can be made. Tort laws cover this but you will never find a lawyer worth a damn or dumb enough to take one persons case to court over $60. If you could find enough people to fill a class action suit that would make it worth their while then you have something but you would only end up getting about 10% of the $60 you would be seeking.

It would be better to simply do a charge back on your credit card and if that is not possible go to your local magistrate court or small claims court and file something for the return of your $60 because of a faulty product and services that do not meet reasonable expectations. And yes both of these avenues work as they have been documented as working in a host of other games.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 8
02-06-2010, 02:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Koldfusion View Post
fan boys...


Really.

Buy a condom with a hole in it?
A loaf of bread missing two slices?
a car missing a bumper?

Would you accept these purchases?
Have you no concept of what an MMO is? The answer is obvious. Thanks.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 9
02-06-2010, 06:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Koldfusion View Post
fan boys...


Really.

Buy a condom with a hole in it?
A loaf of bread missing two slices?
a car missing a bumper?

Would you accept these purchases?

You know what dingleberry head? I do know people that have bought loaves of bread with 2 slices missing. We called it stolen wheat because we would make a sangueech (my term) by taking 2 slices of bread from the bag and put the loaf back on the shelf. So I personally know of many many people that have gotten a loaf of bread missing two slices. Maybe after you gather up your mob of adults that still live with mom and dad, that is if you can get them to leave their room, you can get together with the people that bought my stolen wheat.

I also know many people, like me, that are two slices short of a loaf.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 10
02-06-2010, 02:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eirian
Did you know: More Americans are overweight than pay Income Tax. According to recent statistics, 68% are above the average healthy weight, but only around 50% pay Income Tax.
Did you know there's no constitutional law for you to pay taxes in the USA?
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