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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
As I am one of the leader of the biggest and oldest German Multifaction Fleet I see both sides of the medal. So the questions above are really big questions in my op.


thoughts on balance:

I know many of you find T3 and T4 the probably best balanced parts of the game. In my op it' s not. Why? Here some examples of imbalance in my op. Rembember: it is just my op and my experience I am talking about. Maybe you have got others and I would be very interesting in hearing it.

T1: nearly no chance for Feds to win
T2: Three escorts or two escorts on fed side is a 90% win for klings.
3 Science and two cruisers very hard for Klingons, 80% win for Feds.
T3: same
T4: 3,4, or 5 Science vessels 90 to 95% win for Feds.
T5: 2 Vo'Quvs 80 to 90% win for Klingons

As you can see it depends on the shiptype combination but that is not balance as I understand it.

Because in my op every combination of ships should have a real and fair chance to win against any other combination.
But as my experience shows it is not because some type of groups are very stronger than others for both sides and that' s not the way PvP should work, I think. Also there are some hardly overpowerd skills like VMIII or weapons going through shields

So at the end of the road there is really some balance needed on both sides as I see it

I would be very interested to read your views
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 2
02-09-2010, 04:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lt.Renak View Post
As I am one of the leader of the biggest and oldest German Multifaction Fleet I see both sides of the medal. So the questions above are really big questions in my op.


thoughts on balance:

I know many of you find T3 and T4 the probably best balanced parts of the game. In my op it' s not. Why? Here some examples of imbalance in my op. Rembember: it is just my op and my experience I am talking about. Maybe you have got others and I would be very interesting in hearing it.

T1: nearly no chance for Feds to win
T2: Three escorts or two escorts on fed side is a 90% win for klings.
3 Science and two cruisers very hard for Klingons, 80% win for Feds.
T3: same
T4: 3,4, or 5 Science vessels 90 to 95% win for Feds.
T5: 2 Vo'Quvs 80 to 90% win for Klingons

As you can see it depends on the shiptype combination but that is not balance as I understand it.

Because in my op every combination of ships should have a real and fair chance to win against any other combination.
But as my experience shows it is not because some type of groups are very stronger than others for both sides and that' s not the way PvP should work, I think. Also there are some hardly overpowerd skills like VMIII or weapons going through shields

So at the end of the road there is really some balance needed on both sides as I see it

I would be very interested to read your views
From what you are saying, it's crucial for feds to bring groups that have heavy support.

I don't think t5 is a fair place to call it yet... the carriers are bugged to heck.

T1 is unfair for many reasons -
All t1 kdf pilots have already played t1 and worse. some of them are twinks
The miranda has poor weaposn for 1 vs 1, and is outgunned and outmanuevered
bop has universal stations, allowing it to load up on bursty damage
plus cloak, which means that the fight will start when the kdf pilot chooses to start it

I really REALLY think that the tt1 kdf ship should be some piece of crap with weak cloak, 2 forward guns and no rear, and one less universal station. EVEN with all that, the feds would probably be on an even playing field.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 3
02-09-2010, 04:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Meat_Machine
From what you are saying, it's crucial for feds to bring groups that have heavy support.

I don't think t5 is a fair place to call it yet... the carriers are bugged to heck.

T1 is unfair for many reasons -
All t1 kdf pilots have already played t1 and worse. some of them are twinks
The miranda has poor weaposn for 1 vs 1, and is outgunned and outmanuevered
bop has universal stations, allowing it to load up on bursty damage
plus cloak, which means that the fight will start when the kdf pilot chooses to start it

I really REALLY think that the tt1 kdf ship should be some piece of crap with weak cloak, 2 forward guns and no rear, and one less universal station. EVEN with all that, the feds would probably be on an even playing field.
Carriers can be beaten. Feds just dont bring the right skill combinations to do it though. They rely so much on VM and similar shutdown skills its laughable
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 4
02-09-2010, 04:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Larhten View Post
Carriers can be beaten. Feds just dont bring the right skill combinations to do it though. They rely so much on VM and similar shutdown skills its laughable
Generalizations are funny!

I just played this game right, and I got chain VM'ed lol all klingons are VM spammers obviously.

Clue... get one.

On topic - Carriers are fine. I just hope they fix the bloody bay bug... my old computer can hardly handle the evil swarms heh
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 5
02-09-2010, 04:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharpsy
Generalizations are funny!

I just played this game right, and I got chain VM'ed lol all klingons are VM spammers obviously.

Clue... get one.

On topic - Carriers are fine. I just hope they fix the bloody bay bug... my old computer can hardly handle the evil swarms heh
The point of my previous post was that if they stopped relying on single target shutdowns , they may make some headway and end up crying less.....

Here , have a clue on me....'Scatter Shot'
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 6
02-09-2010, 04:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Larhten View Post
The point of my previous post was that if they stopped relying on single target shutdowns , they may make some headway and end up crying less.....

Here , have a clue on me....'Scatter Shot'
And you are right, however, you should understand that both sides have pretty much the same measure of noobs and QQ's. (not to mention the "single target shutdowns" users) hehe
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 7
02-10-2010, 07:03 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lt.Renak View Post

T1: nearly no chance for Feds to win
T2: Three escorts or two escorts on fed side is a 90% win for klings.
3 Science and two cruisers very hard for Klingons, 80% win for Feds.
T3: same
T4: 3,4, or 5 Science vessels 90 to 95% win for Feds.
T5: 2 Vo'Quvs 80 to 90% win for Klingons
My perspective as Klingon, ive kept some statistics ( Pug is solo join que, and Premade is the premade i play with )

T1: Pug: majority Kdf win , Premade vs Premade: 40% fed win, 60% kdf win.
T2: Pug: majority Fed win , Premade vs Premade: 10% fed win, 90% kdf win.
T3: Pug: balanced , Premade vs Premade: ~8% fed win, 92% kdf win.
T4: Pug: majority Fed win , Premade vs Premade: ~3% fed win, 97% kdf win.
T5: no info
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 8
02-10-2010, 07:52 AM
Had someone use feedback pulse in T4 as a klingon and I started getting pinged for 1400 per pulse.... sooooo you can do some really lame stuff as klingons in T4 as well. Im guessing they probably stacked it with scanner sweep though, as my combat log also showed them using feedback III for only 600ish as well.

T4 is where things start getting silly, but its for pretty much like that for every ship type, my raptor in OB was hitting for 10k with quantums (non-crit) because of scanner sweep as well. And that transferred to HYTs as well, shields dropped and pretty much anything would die in 3-5 seconds.

Scaling is wierd in this game, probably needs toning down across the board, scanner sweep starts at 20% debuff and if you max it, becomes 80%+

AP-alpha is similiar, but is broken for klingons from what I hear. (scales with fed escort skills)

This also applies to alot of shield and hull refill skills xP
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 9
02-11-2010, 09:48 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bloodlance View Post
My perspective as Klingon, ive kept some statistics ( Pug is solo join que, and Premade is the premade i play with )

T1: Pug: majority Kdf win , Premade vs Premade: 40% fed win, 60% kdf win.
T2: Pug: majority Fed win , Premade vs Premade: 10% fed win, 90% kdf win.
T3: Pug: balanced , Premade vs Premade: ~8% fed win, 92% kdf win.
T4: Pug: majority Fed win , Premade vs Premade: ~3% fed win, 97% kdf win.
T5: no info
this right here. the reason being in a premade group the klings have a complete advantage due to cloak. They can have their whole team sit cloaked the entire match and only unlcoak when they have a 100% to get a kill and 0% to suffer a loss. That's all I see anymore, 30 minutes of sitting around doing nothing, a fed gets bored and wanders off because they know the only way they will get to shoot a single weapon is to suicide alone. the klings uncloak, fry the fed in under 3 seconds then cloak again.

now I'm not saying get rid of cloak because that would just be silly, but something needs to be done to give the feds a chance against it. premade vs premade the klinks will always win.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 10
02-11-2010, 10:03 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by skullkandy View Post
this right here. the reason being in a premade group the klings have a complete advantage due to cloak. They can have their whole team sit cloaked the entire match and only unlcoak when they have a 100% to get a kill and 0% to suffer a loss. That's all I see anymore, 30 minutes of sitting around doing nothing, a fed gets bored and wanders off because they know the only way they will get to shoot a single weapon is to suicide alone. the klings uncloak, fry the fed in under 3 seconds then cloak again.

now I'm not saying get rid of cloak because that would just be silly, but something needs to be done to give the feds a chance against it. premade vs premade the klinks will always win.
dont put words in my mouth, our team goes straight for the kill with 0 waiting.

move to 8km of fedball, start attack run, pop talents, decloak, do the tactic stuff, and kill 5 feds without any problems.

We dont wait, we dont run (running is only viable option if our team support skills are in CD).

You have played against pugs, GRATS !
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