Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 1 Tanking A Dreadnaught Cruiser
08-30-2011, 06:10 AM
So far I've been training my Bridge officers with new skills for better tanking. Some of these skills I never bothered with until recently. I used to just go with Emergency Power to Shields and Engineering Team with what ever boosted weapons. But I'm sick and tired of Korrat system, blowing up there that is. I say the Klink ships are unbalanced but sense this wont ever change, I want to hold out best way I can without relying on friendlies being around, that's how the Klinks usually attack, when I go for borg and I'm alone.

Here is a screen shot with some copy and paste bits all in one to show you the entire layout and skill settings I have right now. http://www.warzoneradio.com/media/whatitis.jpg
Also attached the same image, use the WZR link if the attached is bad quality.

Suggestions are what I'm after, but I wish to later take what I learn here to make a guide in the future for other Dreadnaught users as I've found nothing, literally nothing on Fed ship tanking on the internet except for a long drawn out explanation of what species is best for what and what base traits to pick.

I'm looking for info on What ships tank best, what consoles used, what skills used, what BO skills used and a layout of those.

Not looking for a high damage ship, want one that can take a beating.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 2
08-30-2011, 08:01 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick-K
I'm looking for info on What ships tank best, what consoles used, what skills used, what BO skills used and a layout of those.
Best tanking ship for Feds is the Star Cruiser, hands down. Not only can you be a pain in the backside to kill, but actually heal others whilst taking a beating! If you want to know my Star Cruiser tank setup, let me know... but since this is a Dreadnaught thread...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick-K
Not looking for a high damage ship, want one that can take a beating.
Warning: Long post ahead! This is just my opinion (based on my style of play), ao I'm sure there's other changes or ways of doing it that people would suggest. Just bear that in mind.

Right, first off you've got the Borg set. Good idea, since you get two free heals. However running all four pieces on a cruiser isn't much of a good idea. Either do one of the following:
  1. Borg Engine, Deflector, Console, Covariant Shield [Cap]x3
  2. Borg Engine, Shield, Console, Aegis Deflector.

The first option gives you both of the Borg heal procs, but you still have the massive capacity of a Covariant shield (allowing you to take a beating!). As a cruiser you shouldn't have to worry too much about shield heals required to help keep Covariants up - especially as an Engineer. You also don't need to worry about keeping shield power too high for regen either, since the main thing with Covariants is their capacity.

The second option has the Aegis Deflector giving an additional +5 to shield power, and Regen Shields benefit a *lot* with the extra power. Ideally have shields set at 75 base power, and using EPtS you need to keep their power close to 125 as possible to maximise their resistance and Regen. I use this setup on my Star Cruiser, and using Tact Team to balance shield facings when under heavy fire means the insane Regen keeps the shields up. Even if some Sci comes and CPB me, in a matter of seconds, the shields are back up to full strength. Note you still have both Borg heal procs!

Devices:

Subspace Field Modulator is good, as is RMC. Get rid of the Deuterium Surplus and Aux battery.

Have a look at getting Shield Batteries. The reason is this: Lucky Phaser procs. I always try to keep my batteries off cooldown specifically for this. If both my Emergency Power to Shields are on cooldown and a proc knocks my shields offline... thats 5 seconds of being unprotected. Doesn't sound much, but in a hail of dual heavy cannon fire, you can see your hull drop from 100 to 50 pretty damn quick. So it's always useful to have a battery to restore shields.

Also get an Engine battery. If you need to run, pop this and evasive - it'll move you out of range a lot quicker. Some people also like to run Target Engines, and that can be highly irritating! Either stopping you as an escort lines up a shot, or killing your engines as you flee from an encounter. Having a battery for these occasions is handy!

Consoles

Engineering looks good to me, maybe look at replacing the +7 weapons console with an EPS relay. This helps recover lost power when dropping from full impulse into combat, and should help replenish power when using the Phaser Lance or Beam Overload. Plus, get used to switching power settings depending on situation - EPS helps with this. I realise as an Engineer you have the EPS Transfer skill, but that has a cooldown, and personally I prefer to have an inbuilt 'always on' ability for fast power transfer. If you find you don't really need it after all, use a SIF Generator instead to increase your Eng Teams heal and your passive hull repair.

Science, good, you've got the Borg Console here. Get rid of the Oberth Console. You already have the RMC and batteries. This item shares a cooldown with batteries, and quite frankly you could have something much better in this console. Put a Halon System here instead.

Tactical.... it's a no brainer. You can't do better here. Phasers are the way to go since it compliments your phaser lance. :p

Weapons

Cannons and turrets? I wouldn't, expecially on such a slow turning ship. It's really not that hard to keep out of the front arc of a Dreadnaught, and once people do that they only have to worry about one beam array and two turrets. That's not going to kill anything. Seeing this build, as an escort I'd just park off your rear and be very unconcerned about the daamge. Yes, a cannon and turret build works on an Excelsior (there's a thread on that in the forums), but honestly not on a Dreadnaught. Run something like:

2x Beam Array 1x Dual Beam Bank, Quantum
3x Beam Array, Quantum

That way you still have a fair punch up front, a broadside thats not too power hungry, and good damage at the back. You're an all round damager! You won't have any damage blind spots, and no matter which direction your ship is facing, you can wear down your enemy.

Alternatively if you want a bit more damage up front, go with two Dual Beam Banks.

Bridge Officers

Tactical: Tact Team, High Yield Torpedo 1, Attack Pattern Beta 1 (or Beam Overload 2, depending on how you feel! Beam Overload is quite good for your dual beam banks and can hurt quite a bit, but as an Engineer you lack hull debuffs, so this is where Beta can help instead). Save Tact Team for when under heavy directional fire, to get rid of boarding parties, or part of your Alpha Strike to slightly boost weapons damage.

Science: Jam sensors is lol. Go with Sci Team 1 and Hazard 2. Sci to clear sci debuffs, and Hazard will get rid of so many things like the Borg Shield Neutralizer (that thing that eats your shields in Kerrat), Aceton Field (-50% damage), prevents Hargh'Pengs secondary explosion, removes the Warp plasma debuff if you fly into a cloud of it... PLUS you get a nice hull resist and a MASSIVE hull heal over time. Never use Sci Team unless you're hit with a particularly annoying ability like Scramble Sensors or SNB. Keeping it (relatively) available for use is key.

Engineer: There are multiple setups, from being totally tanky to total damage, to a mix of both. For survivability something like this works:

Emergency Power to Shields 1 and 3, RSP 1, Aux to SIF 3
Emergency Power to Aux 1, Engineering Team 2 and 3

You have Two massive insta-heals, two shield powers to cycle to keep power and resistance up, RSP to recharge shields in an emergency, and Emergency Power to Aux for when you need to use Aux abilities. With high Aux, the Aux to SIF gives near 8000 heal *and* over 50 hull resist!

Emergency Power to Shields 1, RSP 1, Aux to SIF 2, Eject Warp Plasma 3
Emergency Power to Shields 1, Engineering Team 2 and 3

This one is slightly less tanky that the first, but not by much. EWP3 does 15000 damage, and slows targets killing their defense - it's quite fun to use when an escort is right behind you! In that case just hit full reverse and EWP.

Skills:

Okay... err quite a lot to change here. Get rid of skills in Subsystem Repair. It's useless. Get rid of Weapon Efficiency as this doesn't help you when running at 100 weapons power, and also get rid of Weapon Maintenance (since you're no longer using DEM). Take skills out of Cannons, and Tactical Team Leader.

Those points you saved put into Beam Weapons, Phaser Weapons (why oh why isn't this skilled?!? They're your main weapons!),Quantum Projectiles. Also put skills into Emitters and Hazard System to boost Hazard Emitters. If you're stuck at where to put the last few points to reach the 6700 required at Tier 1, put them into Starship Operations - that'll boost Sci Team.

That at least should be a start.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 3
08-30-2011, 10:00 AM
The Dreadnaught is still a bit under appreciated when it comes to abilities in STO. I mean it's the DREADNAUGHT. Every dreadnaught ship in the game takes 5 other ships ganging up on it to take down. Gorn Mine Field for example. That sucker is made of solid nutronium, I swear it is. Any Dreadnaught in the game or carrier ship is a freak of impossible nature. A Federation Dreadnaught alone with any of those, tanked, DPS or a balance of both is no match for them.

I'd recommend the following ship changes to the Fed Dreadnaught.

1. 3 Tactical console slots. It shares the Assault Cruiser skill and they got 3.
2. 1 Ensign and 1 Lieutenant Commander Tactical Bridge officer assignments.
3. Maneuverability needs to be improved, how about a built in Aux to Inertial Dampeners 1.
4. Compensation for built in A2ID, 2 Minute cool down for Cloaking Device.
5. Phaser lance from the TV show is different, needs to fire 3 shots, reduce damage to original power output to it's previous version and just have it fire 3. Should accomplish around the same thing, this is just for visual accuracy.
6. Hull needs to be increased from 39000 to 42000. It's the freaking Dreadnaught. Enough said... it's suppose to be THE most powerful and most heavily armored ship the Federation has. Make it so!
7. Crew compliment should be reduced to 950. It's not a Galaxy anymore. It's a war ship, not a family ship. I know this takes away from Hull repair speed, but the built in Aux to ID makes up for this by boosting alive crew resistance and recovery. The only thing you are really gaining is the temporary boost in turn rate.
8. Remove the ability to equip Dual Heavy Cannons. allow it regular dual cannons and it's lower powered brothers.
9. Boost Dual Beam Banks and only Dual Beam Banks not single arrays by +5.
10. Double the Cryptic points cost for it. It's way too cheap and it's stats mirror it's price.





Quote:
Originally Posted by Raketh
Best tanking ship for Feds is the Star Cruiser, hands down. Not only can you be a pain in the backside to kill, but actually heal others whilst taking a beating! If you want to know my Star Cruiser tank setup, let me know... but since this is a Dreadnaught thread...
I would love to see what you got for a setup.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 4
08-30-2011, 10:11 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick-K
The Dreadnaught is still a bit under appreciated when it comes to abilities in STO. I mean it's the DREADNAUGHT. Every dreadnaught ship in the game takes 5 other ships ganging up on it to take down. Gorn Mine Field for example. That sucker is made of solid nutronium, I swear it is. Any Dreadnaught in the game or carrier ship is a freak of impossible nature. A Federation Dreadnaught alone with any of those, tanked, DPS or a balance of both is no match for them.

I'd recommend the following ship changes to the Fed Dreadnaught.

1. 3 Tactical console slots. It shares the Assault Cruiser skill and they got 3.
2. 1 Ensign and 1 Lieutenant Commander Tactical Bridge officer assignments.
3. Maneuverability needs to be improved, how about a built in Aux to Inertial Dampeners 1.
4. Compensation for built in A2ID, 2 Minute cool down for Cloaking Device.
5. Phaser lance from the TV show is different, needs to fire 3 shots, reduce damage to original power output to it's previous version and just have it fire 3. Should accomplish around the same thing, this is just for visual accuracy.
6. Hull needs to be increased from 39000 to 42000. It's the freaking Dreadnaught. Enough said... it's suppose to be THE most powerful and most heavily armored ship the Federation has. Make it so!
7. Crew compliment should be reduced to 950. It's not a Galaxy anymore. It's a war ship, not a family ship. I know this takes away from Hull repair speed, but the built in Aux to ID makes up for this by boosting alive crew resistance and recovery. The only thing you are really gaining is the temporary boost in turn rate.
8. Remove the ability to equip Dual Heavy Cannons. allow it regular dual cannons and it's lower powered brothers.
9. Boost Dual Beam Banks and only Dual Beam Banks not single arrays by +5.
10. Double the Cryptic points cost for it. It's way too cheap and it's stats mirror it's price.
Technically there is another Federation Dreadnought, the Jupiter Class. It is CURRENTLY not a playable one, but that may change soonish. The Jupiter needs multiple ships to take it dowm and I believe is the end "boss" in some Klingon missions.

For more info visit my thread (link in my Signature).
-Quiiliitiila
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 5
08-30-2011, 02:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick-K
The Dreadnaught is still a bit under appreciated when it comes to abilities in STO. I mean it's the DREADNAUGHT. Every dreadnaught ship in the game takes 5 other ships ganging up on it to take down. Gorn Mine Field for example. That sucker is made of solid nutronium, I swear it is. Any Dreadnaught in the game or carrier ship is a freak of impossible nature. A Federation Dreadnaught alone with any of those, tanked, DPS or a balance of both is no match for them.
I beg to differ the Jupiter can be soloed. Takes a while but its doable.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 6
08-30-2011, 07:11 PM
I also question cannons, crf/csv start at lt.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 7
08-30-2011, 09:28 PM
How is a Star Cruiser better at being a tanking ship? According to STOWiki the Dreadnaught and Star Cruiser have the same hull strength and crew numbers. Is it simply because the Star Cruiser has an extra Science station?

I was looking at Spidermitch's ship chart and it states on the Dreadnaught:

- Speed and Maneuverability
+30% Hull Strength
+Repair Rate
+Device Slots
+5 Power to all subsystems

So does this mean the Dreadnaught has 30% more hull strength than other cruisers?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 8
08-30-2011, 10:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Idali
I beg to differ the Jupiter can be soloed. Takes a while but its doable.
target shield subsystems 3 rapes PvE
Including Dedara in KA...

But Target shields 3 is a all around OP skill to begin with if spec'd right.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dalnar
so to those who claim BO3 is same/better than lance I can only make a shy smile
Phaser Dual Beam Bank MK 11 ACCx3 on a BO3 will probably make you go
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 9
08-30-2011, 10:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Naekuh View Post
target shield subsystems 3 rapes PvE
Including Dedara in KA...

But Target shields 3 is a all around OP skill to begin with if spec'd right.
Nah, it's easily negated; EngTeam, EPtS, or Shield Battery... but it's not like NPCs use any of those anyways.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 10
08-30-2011, 10:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Naekuh View Post
Phaser Dual Beam Bank MK 11 ACCx3 on a BO3 will probably make you go
Why would it ? My phaser lance without tactical buffs hits 2x19800 dmg...with tactical buffs up and target immobilized with tractor beam the crits are well over 40k each...

60k + beam overload crits => that is like Season 2 with beta stacking or so...
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