Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
I officially hate this idea to add Dilithium to the crafting system. it is Totally unacceptable, and the first change and idea I TOTALLY HATE> The idea to actually start warning people away from STO just crossed my mind.

Turn the crafting system Dilithium requirement off. PERIOD. I HATE THIS IDEA.

For many reasons. first is Since I only have a few characters who are Crafters, it forces me to level my crafting skills on ALL my NEW CHARACTERS. because I can't trade dilithium to my other characters from them and to save my sanity I only have 3 / 4 crafters on holodeck.

This is a terrible idea, I hate it, stop this particular change NOW. for the first time, I actually HATE the idea that the DEvs have put on the Tribble.

Add Energy credits to the Crafting cost would be ONE thing. But this. The cost of Dilithium as is, even if it was 10% the cost addition in Dilithium. the DEVS have said

The Below is Copied from the F2P Blog 11
http://www.startrekonline.com/node/2657

The Dilithium currency is something that we think many starship captains will never need in quantity. If you enjoy playing the episode story line, getting your crew decked out with moderate gear, and so on, you may not need a single unit of Dilithium. The only exception might be the expense of Captain and Rear Admiral ship upgrades for Silver players, which may require a few hours of Dilithium mission play.

You just contradicted yourselves. Now we will need large amounts of Dilithium for all our characters because in order to craft ANYTHING of great quality we have to turn ALL our characters into Crafters. Because we can not trade Dilithium between ourselves.

the DEVS have JUST made a MAJOR BLUNDER on this game's direction. it forces us to BUY C_store points to BUY Dilithium, or forces us to GRIND massive amounts of Dilithium to gear up a character. and since the DEVS have said, (The Dilithium currency is something that we think many starship captains will never need in quantity), you have just majorly kicked us in the rear ends. If you want to keep the currency incoming to pay for STO.

I have a LIFE time subscription. and will get 400 c-points per month. but I can tell you this, it will not be enough. You have taken the first step to what I Feel will BURY this game. I Enjoy the Holodeck, as is, But PLEASE STOP this change to CRAFTING needing Dilithium. I find it unacceptable.

If you want to encourage F2P Silver accounts to GO GOLD, then LOCK the crafting system out to then at say give them a MAX crafting skill that only allows them to craft up to MK VIII Blue gear, or even totally lock the crafting system out to silver accounts. But the addition of Dilithium is unacceptable to the crafting system, it basically makes it mandatory to gather high levels of Dilithium.

I ask many people to post your opinions here. But please, keep it Civil and polite.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 2
10-20-2011, 08:25 PM
I know a lot of people are up set about this. You've got a valid point I guess. The reason I think they may not back away from this move was stated in the blog. Some like they don't want players to be able to mass produce the rare stuff any more. I can see that being a valid point to. I as well and someone who make a lot of alts. Of the six or so characters I have one crafter. With this change going as it is I will just give up on crafting. And I believe that is the goal with this move. I was casual with crafting at best and making it more difficult now will push me out of it entirely.

I'm not nearly as upset about this as you are here but I understand. I just don't think they can back away from this move because the need a dilithium sink in the game people actually care about so they will being willing to buy the dilithium from the people who are willing to grind for it.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 3 terrible "feature"
10-20-2011, 08:30 PM
Crafting is supposed to be a way to bypass the economy altogether.

FML

isn't the dilithium price of Mk (whatever) items already too expensive?
STO team is going to punish those of us who were smart enough to collect samples and work our way up through leveling the crafting with a "Here ya go. it's going to cost you approximately seventeen Brasillian times as much to craft this item as it would to effing get it through grind festing."

Come on, Guys. this is just a slap in the face on top of the rest of the Tribble Tomfoolery. I am beginning to think that Tribble is actually a testbed to see if the forums still work or not.

conceptual fail, this should not have made it from brain to mouth of whomever the genious was that suggested it. . .

this didn't even need to be tested. WTF were you guys thinking?
just . . . . i don't even know what to say. if I were in your office I would kick you out and make you go wait in the break room and think about how much fail you were and if i was going to fire you.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 4
10-20-2011, 08:42 PM
It was bad enough to have to grind samples, especially if you had one crafter on an account that was crafting for all your characters.

This change is completely unwarranted and now requires a double grind.. either for one character to get enough dilithium to make *anything* worth value, or to get all other characters able to craft, at which point they'll still need to grind both dilithium and samples.

Some of the changes on Tribble have been alright, some have been questionable. This one is just downright baffling and unnecessary.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 5
10-20-2011, 09:26 PM
Cryptic is powered by fear of losing money, thats why all these changes had to be made.
Well this fear turns into hate when we start to play f2p sto.
So GJ so far, for creating totally anti star trek experience.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
Hi folks!

I don't understand the need to put the dilithium into the crafting system at all. . . If you think that things are too easy for us crafters, then think again! I craft for an entire fleet, I spend most of my time grinding looking for particles as it stands now. . . If this is what your going to do. . . I believe I will be forced to leave and find a better game!

I believed in you Cryptic! I am a Lifer, and have purchased many ships and items in the C-Store. I believed that you were really after making this game more fun and more facinating to play. The Doff system, and hourly missions are a nice addition in my view, but Now you JACK me and my fellow crafting folks with this. . . What are we suppose to think your doing? This IS NOT making the game better!

You have already made the crafting system next to WORTHLESS! I used to be able to craft the BEST items at the TOP of their Level class, this was the motivation to become a crafting person in the first place!, But now we can only make the Bottom of each level class until we reach Admiral Upper Half. . . NO ONE TENDS TO BUY THE BOTTOM LEVEL CLASS ITEMS! if they have the money for the top. So who do you expect us to market to? The folks who can't afford the best and so you have effectively taken out the motivation to become a craft person.

Given the choice captains will buy the Top of the level items over the Bottom. And now we can't even make TOP of level items. . . So you have already set us crafting folk back enough! We already will not be able to sell as many items because we can't even Make any that most captains are looking for!

And if this is coming down from your F2P partner company, then tell them we Trekers are NOBODYS FOOL, and will only take being Screwed like this for a little while before we go give ANOTHER COMPANY our money. . .

Lifers tend to spend more money proportionally than many other types of paying folks. . . Not that they don't spend a lot also, but come on, if your really trying to make the game approachable, and fun to play, then you just went the wrong direction totally!

Please Don't make this crafting any harder than it is! Make us get particles, create crafting missions to unlock special unique crafting items, and more items at each level, but Please Don't make us have to gather dilithium as well, PLEASE! I am tired already from hours upon hours of particle hunting, let alone going out to do once per day dilithium missions as well. . . When did this game become My JOB and not a fun game? . . . This is just Stupid.

I have a REAL life outside this game where I make my REAL Money that you folks WANT. We all can't log on every day to do ALL these daily dilithium missions, let alone finding the amounts necessary to create purple very rare items you now require. To use in our Fleet events, to buy higher level ships, while also outfitting our own multiple ships that we had to BUY at YOUR C=Store! All in a Trek Universe where people in Starfleet don't even use money. How does this even make sense?

I thought that you would be making more Wonderful content which is what you do so well, not trying to slow us down and make EVERYTHING harder, how can we still call this fun playing your game? . .

So it sure looks like we are getting LESS for MORE of our Money! Please go back to the Cryptic that we have come to respect and Love! Please. . . Keep the game fun through innovation, by making it bigger, more creative, and by taking us to new wonderful places on new adventures , not by hacking the game up and making everything harder and less fun.

And Please tell that Free 2 Play Company that this doesn't Look very FREE!

Thanks for your time to read this ALL!
This has been a plea,
from Tiger
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 7
10-20-2011, 11:44 PM
Here is an idea. I Kinda see why they want to add dilithium to some crafting. I agree with most here though that its a bad move overall. First of all no one as a fleet crafter will even consider using their own dilithium to help out a fleet mate with a simple thing that they can do themselves. This is further split it into a one person game....
Most gear in crafting is FINE without dilithium. The balance is FINE in terms of work VS reward IMHO on crafting.

You need to ADD a new upper end tier of gear. Purple Mark XII with extremely high accuracy. PVP focused weapons that have a slightly higher dps than MK XI, but has say a higher than normal accuracy and crit for those pvpers...make those cost like 20 percent less dilithium than the regular items.

If you go too far on dilithium on crafting you will cause alot of people not to craft at all and play this only like once a month. Most people stay in MMO's in the end for two things:
Community ( Fleet actions and comradarie)
Competition / Cooperation (Simple PVP and "Veteran" Players helping out)

If you do crafting this way it will killing Fleet crafting and take an important element out of Fleet operations, which is one LESS thing to keep players here.
Just my two cents but viable for sure. Please, I hope you guys looked at the repercussions of making a value too blanket.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 8
10-21-2011, 12:59 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadow_mane2001 View Post
The Below is Copied from the F2P Blog 11
http://www.startrekonline.com/node/2657

The Dilithium currency is something that we think many starship captains will never need in quantity. If you enjoy playing the episode story line, getting your crew decked out with moderate gear, and so on, you may not need a single unit of Dilithium. The only exception might be the expense of Captain and Rear Admiral ship upgrades for Silver players, which may require a few hours of Dilithium mission play.

You just contradicted yourselves. Now we will need large amounts of Dilithium for all our characters because in order to craft ANYTHING of great quality we have to turn ALL our characters into Crafters. Because we can not trade Dilithium between ourselves.
Not a contradiction. I have emphasized the key word you seem to have missed. That most of the people complaining on the forums seem to have missed, not only in conversations about adding Dilithium to crafting, but in nearly every conversation involving Dilithium on the boards: Many players, probably most players, really anyone who "enjoys playing the episode story line," will be extremely successful and satisfied with moderate gear. I haven't hit PvE content yet which required high-end gear (you forum posters have kept me scared away from the STFs so far), and for the Normal versions (not the Elite versions) of the STFs they're rolling out, they've said you won't need high-end gear to succeed, either.

Crafting isn't required. Dilithium isn't required. Not for moderate (read: normal) gameplay. Dilithium is required, is going to be required, to obtain the high-end gear. That's what it's there for - moderating the availability of high-end gear.

Every complaint I've heard about Dilithium so far is from people who don't want to have anything (not time and effort, and especially not money) between them and their high-end gear. Shouldn't the best of the best gear be rare? Shouldn't it represent an accomplishment? Preferably an accomplishment of the character using it? Have some pride, people. You complainers are generally the most skilled and accomplished players in the game, min/maxing everything, dedicated to using the best gear and the best strategies, to playing the most difficult parts of the game over and over, preferably on the highest difficulty setting! Play at the level of skill you represent, earn the gear for the characters you play, and have fun doing it!
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 9
10-21-2011, 01:09 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by modernevil
Stuff
Blue gear is *moderate*. Even mark gear is *moderate*.

The only things that should even consider having Dilithium, according to what they've said, would be purple gear - which is basically anything that takes rare traces.

To stack dilithium grind *above* the grind needed for rare traces is just garbage. Plus, the amount of Dilithium needed is also just way too high, considering everything else dilithium is going to be needed for. If they're tossing a diithium cost onto purples or whatnot, then those items should have their rare trace requirement removed. One or the other. Both is a real burden on anybody who wants to undertake crafting, honestly.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 10
10-21-2011, 01:31 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Destinii
Blue gear is *moderate*. Even mark gear is *moderate*.

The only things that should even consider having Dilithium, according to what they've said, would be purple gear - which is basically anything that takes rare traces.
Nope. You've misunderstood the entire system. Why do you think there are two Mks per tier? The lower Mk (odd Mks) has always been the cheap, vendor-available, moderate gear and the higher Mk (even Mks) have always been the drop-only or badge/mark/emblem-vendor-only gear. Both Mks per tier then also have a rarity - White/common is moderate, everything else is not.

This perspective is borne out with your first look at a Dilithium-based vendor in game: They sell the higher-Mk gear, with gear at every tier. The vendor next to them, who takes EC, sells the lower-Mk gear, with gear at every tier. EC for moderate gear, Dilithium for high-end gear. Do you need them to spell it out any clearer?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Destinii
To stack dilithium grind *above* the grind needed for rare traces is just garbage. Plus, the amount of Dilithium needed is also just way too high, considering everything else dilithium is going to be needed for. If they're tossing a diithium cost onto purples or whatnot, then those items should have their rare trace requirement removed. One or the other. Both is a real burden on anybody who wants to undertake crafting, honestly.
As I keep repeating, they're designing the game in a way that rewards playing the game for fun and punishes grinding. If you enjoy playing STO intrinsically, if you enjoy exploring, seeking out particles and traces, then do that. You will find it intrinsically rewarding to do so. AND, if you come back and do this thing every day (this thing you find fun, remember?), you'll also earn a little Dilithium every day, which you can use to get high-end gear.

Having high-end gear is not an end in itself. You want the high-end gear so you can play the game, right? Just ... with slightly better stats? Play the game. If you want the high-end gear to be better at PvP, come play PvP every day for the next two or three months - you'll have fun, doing what you like, and you gradually get better gear as you do. If you want high-end gear for playing the STFs, come play the STFs every day and you'll not only get Dilithium, but you'll gradually earn high-end gear specifically tailored for people who like to play STFs! Amazing! If you want high-end gear for exploring the universe and replaying the story missions... you guessed it, explore every day and you'll gradually earn all the high-end gear, without ever having to do something you don't enjoy doing; without ever having to grind a thing.
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