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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
Excelsior Refit, USS Brooklyn Battery

Fore: 1x Dual Beam Phaser Bank, 1x Phaser Beam Array, 2x Quantums. All Mk12 borg.
Aft: 2x Phaser Beam Array, 2x Quantums. Mk12 borg.

(Im looking for mk12 very rare non borg stuff, it's expensive, how much better is it in pvp?)

Mk11 Maco Deflector (Have mk12, waiting on sheilds)
Borg engines
Mk11 Maco Shields (Working on mk12..)

Eng consoles: Neutronium alloy, Emergency Forcefields, EPS Flow Regulator, all mk11 rare, and a RCS accelerator, mk11 uncommon.

Science consoles: Borg Console, and ? (Sheild Generator, or Sheild emitter Amplifier, which is better with the maco shields? My shields run 70-100 on attack, 118-125 on defense, and i run two EPTS.. as explained later)

Tac Consoles: 2x Zero Point Quantum Chamber, Mk11, one rare, one uncommon. 1x Phaser Relay, Mk11 rare.

Now for my Boffs:

Lt Cmd Tac: Tac Team 1, Spread 2, High Yield 3
Cmdr Eng: EPTS 1, Reverse Sheild Polarity 1, Directed engergy mod 2, aceton beam 2 (Anything better for pvp and pve? :\ Aceton seems only pve quality?)
Lt Eng: EPTW1, EPTS2
Ensign Eng: Eng Team 1
Lt Science: Polarize Hull 1, Tractorbeam 2

Im looking for a good balance between dps and tank, more so a little more dpsish. I like my torpedo setup and i can get quite a number of them off, especially with the doff buffs. I also use phasers and quantums to keep it canon. That being said, how are my equiptment and boff powers set up? If been toying with them a bit lately and this is my latest build. I notice more tanking ability. Also, my power transfer rate is pretty fast, which is nice in stick situations.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 2
05-29-2012, 08:02 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dabba2087
Excelsior Refit, USS Brooklyn Battery

Fore: 1x Dual Beam Phaser Bank, 1x Phaser Beam Array, 2x Quantums. All Mk12 borg.
Aft: 2x Phaser Beam Array, 2x Quantums. Mk12 borg.

(Im looking for mk12 very rare non borg stuff, it's expensive, how much better is it in pvp?)

Mk11 Maco Deflector (Have mk12, waiting on sheilds)
Borg engines
Mk11 Maco Shields (Working on mk12..)

Eng consoles: Neutronium alloy, Emergency Forcefields, EPS Flow Regulator, all mk11 rare, and a RCS accelerator, mk11 uncommon.

Science consoles: Borg Console, and ? (Sheild Generator, or Sheild emitter Amplifier, which is better with the maco shields? My shields run 70-100 on attack, 118-125 on defense, and i run two EPTS.. as explained later)

Tac Consoles: 2x Zero Point Quantum Chamber, Mk11, one rare, one uncommon. 1x Phaser Relay, Mk11 rare.

Now for my Boffs:

Lt Cmd Tac: Tac Team 1, Spread 2, High Yield 3
Cmdr Eng: EPTS 1, Reverse Sheild Polarity 1, Directed engergy mod 2, aceton beam 2 (Anything better for pvp and pve? :\ Aceton seems only pve quality?)
Lt Eng: EPTW1, EPTS2
Ensign Eng: Eng Team 1
Lt Science: Polarize Hull 1, Tractorbeam 2

Im looking for a good balance between dps and tank, more so a little more dpsish. I like my torpedo setup and i can get quite a number of them off, especially with the doff buffs. I also use phasers and quantums to keep it canon. That being said, how are my equiptment and boff powers set up? If been toying with them a bit lately and this is my latest build. I notice more tanking ability. Also, my power transfer rate is pretty fast, which is nice in stick situations.
Unfortunately, whilst MkXII kit can be found on the exchange, the seller usually want's XXX Million EC for it, whether it's purple or not. Not worth it in my opinion - I stick to MkXI, which isn't really that inferior to it.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 3
05-29-2012, 09:25 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dabba2087
Excelsior Refit, USS Brooklyn Battery

Fore: 1x Dual Beam Phaser Bank, 1x Phaser Beam Array, 2x Quantums. All Mk12 borg.
Aft: 2x Phaser Beam Array, 2x Quantums. Mk12 borg.
Problems.

Facing your target you have 1 DBB, 1 Phaser beam array and 2 Quantums.

Anytime your target has shields, your Quantums are basically ineffective.

This also forces you to face your target to get the most out of the DBB, but then youíre backing it up with a weak beam array. And then neither of your fore beams are backed up with a skill of anykind.


Then, aft.

Aft you have two beam arrays and 2 quantums. Are you always going to running away or do you plan to be facing your target for your fore set up?


Broadside, so many limited arc weapons now means you have a 3x phaser beam array broadside, which is extremely weak.


So youíve tried to cover several directions and instead have wound up covering not much in any strong capacity.


If you really want to stick with multiple quantums, then stick with just your quantums fore and go with this:

FORE: 2x Beam Arrays, 2x Quantums
AFT: 4x Beam Arrays

Now at least, you can have a solid 6 beam broadside.

Second is your BOFFs, youíve given way too much priority to Torpedos when Beams are really going to carry the load.

If you must have a torpedo skill, go with the following:

Lt Comm Tac: TT 1 > TS 2 > BFAW 3

Here are some things I would change about the rest of your BOFFs.

COMM ENG: EPTW 1 > EPTS 2 > EPTS 3 > AUX to SIF 3
LT ENG: EPTW 1 > RSP 1
ENS ENG: ET 1

LT SCI: PH 1 > HE 2 or TSS 2


Lastly, you are a Tank and Support ship. Take threat control, at least 3 ranks if not 6.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 4
05-29-2012, 10:02 AM
I pretty much agree with everything USS_Ultimatum has to say.

I run the 2 Torps fore 6 Beam method for STF as you can tilt the ship and get 6 beams and both tubes on the gate or Generator.

But if you going to tank, having multiple tubes forward is a bad idea as you generally want to be moving at all times for the defence bonus. Just move a torpedo to the back for the boss.

If you really want DBB's on the front your kind of limited to running turrets on the back. Not really an ideal setup. You could try Single Cannons on the front and Turrets on the Back and run two CRF's.

And while Phasers are a great weapon in STFs they tend to suck as the Borg are immune to the Proc, making every other weapon better than them.

Oh and if you want to keep it Canon, run Photons they do less damage per torpedo but more DPS than the Quantums due to the higher firing rate and with two tubes and two purple Doffs, I get a fantastic stream of Torpedoes.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 5
05-29-2012, 11:31 AM
Well, I figured it would be an upgraded excelsior

I figured I'd be facing my enemy 60% of the time, most of the time I'm turning in circles, distributing damage across my sheilds and alternating my torpedo tubes, front, rear and repeat. As you can see my build reflects torpedo damage, with the consoles, my skills, boff powers and doffs. I do have full points in threat control.

The one thing that bothers me too is the weak broadside. I guess I should replace the DBB with a beam array? The whole reason i took my excelsior over my assault cruiser was the better turn rate for torps, and HY3. I have an escort for the faster stuff. I was also going to build a seperate beam boat idea.

I prefer Spread over BFAW because the latter targets everything around you, spread is just in the arc you are firing in. I prefer not to draw too much aggro, or rather, i find I have more control of my targets with spread.

What does emergency to aux do?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 6 U.S.S. Lachrymose
05-29-2012, 12:18 PM
I'm a Tac Captain in Excelsior Retrofit and I can tell you this ship kicks a lot of @$$.

Keep in mind I use her primarily for PVE, not PVP.... but in the PVP I've done she is hard to kill.

I will log on tonight and get you my exact current build. In the meantime, from memory:
All my energy weapons are Tetryon. My tactical consoles are all XI Tetryon boosters (no torp consoles).
Up front, I run Dual Beam Bank, Beam Array, Quantum Torp, and I think a single cannon.
Aft, I have quantum torp, and 2 turrets.
These are the purple Borg versions, mostly mark XI.

I do believe I run the Borg set except for Omega shields. To be honest, I do this because someone told me it was a good idea, not because it is any better than full Omega or full MACO.

Her turn rate is quite high for a cruiser. You'll be facing your target(s) 80% of the time. I usually only turn around to fire the aft torpedo while the fore is on cool-down. You can use those engineering slots and consoles to keep your weapon and shield power UP.

I do not broadside in my Excelsior. I equip and fly her as if she were an escort.

Ran Cure Elite a few nights ago and we finished with 5 mins to spare. My ship, the U.S.S. Lachrymose, was definitely a big contributor to that. (It also helps to have a Vo'Quv on Kang defense!)

I want to stress that I first purchased and built up this ship before I knew what I was doing in STO. So not everything is maxed out like it could be, but she's still a beast!
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 7
05-29-2012, 12:25 PM
Those are some typical cruiser configurations. I have seen two unusual setups for Tac Excelsior Retrofits with very good focused DPS...

All energy weapons are Tetryon.

#1 Pew Pew Build

Fore 4X Cannons
Aft 4X Turrets
Eng Console 1RCS, 3 Neutronium
Tac Console 3 Tetryon + Damage
BOFF TAC: Tac Team1, C:RF1, C:RF2

The rest as usual. Heavily focused firepower, similar to the usual all dhc escort build. Just use both Cannon: Rapid fire and pew pew away.

#2 Torpedo Build
Fore 1 X DBB 3 X Quantum
Aft 4 X turrets

Eng console 2 RCS, 2 Neutronium
Tac console:3 zero point quantum chamber

BOFF Tac THY1, BO2, BO3
3x projectile DOFF for extra torp fire rate.

The single beam weapon on this ship works great with the two beam overloads to strip a target's shield, while the constant barrage of quantums does the rest. Use high yield 1 to finish. The two RCS consoles make the ship turn like an escort.
I am using this build myself with an aegis set and antiproton weapons and it is awesome, and a match for the DHC escort I was using before.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 8
05-29-2012, 01:56 PM
That all cannon/turret build sounds tempting. I was thinking about it with phasers..

I'm thinking of going 2x Quantum up front, and 2 beam arrays, with 1 quantum in the rear and 3 beams.

Or a combination of the two..

Maybe.. 2 Quantums and 2 cannons up front, with 1 beam, 1 quantum, and 2 turrets in the rear?

Hows that? It seems like i have a lot better arcs in all directions. 5 weapons broadside, 6 fore, 4 aft.

I may switch out a zero chamber quantum for another phaser relay then, for the cannons and turrets. I dont think im going to use Rapid fire though. Or should i? I'd like to keep both high yeld and spread, and i dont have many spots with my tac.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 9
05-30-2012, 05:58 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dabba2087
Well, I figured it would be an upgraded excelsior

I figured I'd be facing my enemy 60% of the time, most of the time I'm turning in circles,
Which one is it?

It can't be both.

60% of the time is "most of the time", so are you facing your target most of the time or are you turning in circles most of the time?



Quote:
Originally Posted by Dabba2087
distributing damage across my sheilds and alternating my torpedo tubes, front, rear and repeat.
If you are running with Projectile Weapon DOFFs, then you should never need your rear torpedos and would be much better off always keeping the fore torpedos on target.


If that's the case, and you are in fact 'facing your target most of the time', then you should run forward facing weapons such as

FORE: Single Cannon x2, Quantum Torps x2
AFT: Turrets x4



Quote:
Originally Posted by Dabba2087
As you can see my build reflects torpedo damage, with the consoles, my skills, boff powers and doffs. I do have full points in threat control.
At least you have threat control, thatís good.

As far as damage, what you see and what I see are two very different things.
I see a ship that isnít very good at forward facing attacks and isnít very good at broadsiding.

You canít have it all in this game, you need to choose which you want to do Ė Face your targets or keep them in your broadside arc.
Itís one or the other, so pick one and then be good at it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dabba2087
The one thing that bothers me too is the weak broadside. I guess I should replace the DBB with a beam array? The whole reason i took my excelsior over my assault cruiser was the better turn rate for torps, and HY3. I have an escort for the faster stuff. I was also going to build a seperate beam boat idea.
Yes but why does that mean Torps both fore and aft to you?

Running Torps aft means you have weapons fore and aft that do not complement each other.

There is a difference between thinking your ship is ďgood at damageĒ and actually knowing it, so hunt around for one of the log parsers and parse your combat logs Ė youíll probably be very surprised at how much or how little damage you are doing relative to the other ships on your teams.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dabba2087
I prefer Spread over BFAW because the latter targets everything around you, spread is just in the arc you are firing in. I prefer not to draw too much aggro, or rather, i find I have more control of my targets with spread.

Targeting everything around you is the exact reason you should have FAW on a cruiser. Aside from this power being able to pull double duty as a ST and AoE damage boost, it is a great way to get aggro.

Aggro control is what you are there for in a Cruiser on teams.

If you do not want aggro, you should be in a different ship, because Cruisers that avoid threat and avoid aggro while being a middling damage dealer really do not help their teams at all.

You took threat control, so obviously you want some aggro but you do understand that NPC ships you do not hit with your attacks will not be affected by your threat control?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 10
05-30-2012, 10:16 AM
When i say I dont want aggro, I dont want EVERYTHING on me. My ship can tank, but against a number of spheres, it wont last long, and i have to bug out to repair sheilds. I simply like having more control over what I hit is all. If i want to hit everything, i pull out a bit, and fire a spread.

Right now, my setup is as i said, 2 cannons in front, with 2 quantums, and 2 turrets, 1 beam, and 1 quantum in the rear. And im notice a lot more damage on all sides, small increase to the rear arc.

Why isnt it good to mix beams and cannons? If so, ill switch out the beam for the turret. The beam is there for a little more kick for broadsides and the rear facing arcs. I know they do more damage than turrets, and even more so at range. Broadsides are nice now, 2 cannons, 2 turret and 1 beam.

The reason i still have a torpedo in the rear is because when I'm broadsiding, i dont always want to turn into my target, but i may want to fire another spead. Im hesitant about using tircobalt simply because i like to keep the same weapon types.
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