Lt. Commander
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 122
# 1 Avenger Class Feedback
11-10-2013, 06:55 PM
Avenger is still a joke, too many disadvantages of an escort and a cruiser, not enough advantages of an escort or cruiser, a half breed ? Aye it is , but not the best combo and no real advantages for the federation cruiser /battlecruiser class ships (or destroyer class is even better than this ship) vs similar klingon classed cruisers, battlecruisers, and of course still no real "Heavy Battlecruiser" class fed ships. Oh, btw and the so called "Dreadnought Class" GAL X, is no where close to a "Dreadnought" by any kinda definition in comparison to any kinda ship, sea ,boat, vessel or in space sci fi or non fiction , in that class.

My Feedback on Avenger? : Simple, It needs a COMMANDER UNIVERSAL Boff station Period!, as well as, perhaps as a c store/fleet variation, a base turn of perhaps 11 or 12 vs its current base of 9. PERIOD!!!(Cant believe I paid money for this crap which looked good on paper but largely not, with no clear advantage really that would make a serious difference, I'm sure you and your testers are aware, and collated and concluded to your current version) but really vs. any other kinda fed cruiser in any class, it's largely useless and not as modular as it seems to be by comparison.

Tho , I believe feedback, forums, for large, greedy corporate gaming companies are LARGELY USELESS and only a Token in reality, I sincerely hope someone that this kinda feedback concerns, takes it to heart for consideration, TY anyway
Career Officer
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 183
# 2
11-10-2013, 07:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ajgamer1701 View Post
Avenger is still a joke, too many disadvantages of an escort and a cruiser, not enough advantages of an escort or cruiser, a half breed ? Aye it is , but not the best combo and no real advantages for the federation cruiser /battlecruiser class ships (or destroyer class is even better than this ship) vs similar klingon classed cruisers, battlecruisers, and of course still no real "Heavy Battlecruiser" class fed ships. Oh, btw and the so called "Dreadnought Class" GAL X, is no where close to a "Dreadnought" by any kinda definition in comparison to any kinda ship, sea ,boat, vessel or in space sci fi or non fiction , in that class.

My Feedback on Avenger? : Simple, It needs a COMMANDER UNIVERSAL Boff station Period!, as well as, perhaps as a c store/fleet variation, a base turn of perhaps 11 or 12 vs its current base of 9. PERIOD!!!(Cant believe I paid money for this crap which looked good on paper but largely not, with no clear advantage really that would make a serious difference, I'm sure you and your testers are aware, and collated and concluded to your current version) but really vs. any other kinda fed cruiser in any class, it's largely useless and not as modular as it seems to be by comparison.

Tho , I believe feedback, forums, for large, greedy corporate gaming companies are LARGELY USELESS and only a Token in reality, I sincerely hope someone that this kinda feedback concerns, takes it to heart for consideration, TY anyway
Realizing your concern, personally I have the Fleet version of this ship and find it will rounded in PVP and the additional sci slot and shield modifier. I'm sure others will concur, it may be your build that needs some fine tuning. I'd suggest you'd reconsider examining the builds area of the forum for this ship's usefulness. I say this strongly as advice, not to disenheart you. You may see the others that have responded to the outpouring of yes's to this ship.
Captain
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 3,737
# 3
11-10-2013, 07:16 PM
and paint it like an relleh awesome original sonic fan character
Quote:
Originally Posted by redz4tw View Post
can you say attack pattern angry forumers 3?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 210
# 4
11-25-2013, 07:52 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by abfabfleet View Post
Realizing your concern, personally I have the Fleet version of this ship and find it will rounded in PVP and the additional sci slot and shield modifier. I'm sure others will concur, it may be your build that needs some fine tuning. I'd suggest you'd reconsider examining the builds area of the forum for this ship's usefulness. I say this strongly as advice, not to disenheart you. You may see the others that have responded to the outpouring of yes's to this ship.
Your response would have been far more palatable had you addressed the OP's concerns instead of launching into group-think. I spent MY money for this ship (both), and as such I've paid for the privilege of having an opinion: That being true, the Avenger simply is not as "well-rounded" as it should be as a hybrid. This is painfully evident when one considers the lack of innovation in fed ships lately.

Feedback? Sure! The Avenger needs 1, or perhaps 2 more added benefits that are inherent to the platform, that extend beyond the idea that all I need to do is copy some someone else's build to enjoy real success with the ship.

Suggestions? Nope, I'll gladly leave that to the folks who do such things for a living. I will say this though, the Avenger was obviously low-balled in its specifics. This fact will need to be considered and addressed before I pump any cash into the next fed whiz-bang creation.
Captain
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 4,704
# 5
11-25-2013, 08:15 AM
I think the problem is, people who are used to the Fed lineup see "dual cannons" in its specs and therefore expect to fly it just like an escort. Now, if you build it right you can certainly make it act a lot like one (one of my fleet bosses' builds is good for that, albeit it's not a DC build), but it's not an escort and you shouldn't think of it as one. It's a fast, slightly less durable cruiser that can run cannons, not an escort.

I run mine with single aux2batt and beam broadsiding, and I'm usually somewhere in the range of 5-7k DPS.
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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 210
# 6
11-25-2013, 10:24 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by starswordc View Post
I think the problem is, people who are used to the Fed lineup see "dual cannons" in its specs and therefore expect to fly it just like an escort.
That's a self-serving assumption, but I'll play. If CRYPTIC says a ship can mount cannons it would be reasonable to expect that it's a viable platform for cannons of all types, right? Well it isn't, compared to a good escort that is. "But if it had the turnrate of an escort it wouldn't be fair!" Agreed, but why not give us something that would compensate a tad, like higher base flight speed? There are lots of things they COULD have done to make the Avenger unique, but they didn't. I suspect the ship was cheap-licked to make money AND appease the anti-fed whiners at the same time.
Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 961
# 7
11-25-2013, 08:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by chuckingram View Post
That's a self-serving assumption, but I'll play. If CRYPTIC says a ship can mount cannons it would be reasonable to expect that it's a viable platform for cannons of all types, right? Well it isn't, compared to a good escort that is. "But if it had the turnrate of an escort it wouldn't be fair!" Agreed, but why not give us something that would compensate a tad, like higher base flight speed? There are lots of things they COULD have done to make the Avenger unique, but they didn't. I suspect the ship was cheap-licked to make money AND appease the anti-fed whiners at the same time.
Not entirely true. Klingon Battlecruisers have similar or lower turn rate to the Avenger (as do some models of Warbird) and can still use dual cannons.

And besides, your definition of "viable" is narrow, and escort-focused. The Avenger and Other BC's are viable cannon platforms, but require different tactics to compensate for their limitations and leverage their strengths. Y'know, like a proper ship, with advantages and disadvantages. As great as the Avenger is, it isn't an "I win" button, and shouldn't be. I honestly don't understand why some people assume that they automatically buy advantage so long as they spend money in an ostensibly free game.

Just because snarky forum degenerates SAY STO is "Pay-to-win" doesn't necessarily make it true...

And there IS a built-in compensation to the turn rate and flight speed deficiency. It's called the Strategic Maneuvers Cruiser Command.

Last edited by unangbangkay; 11-26-2013 at 09:17 PM.
Ensign
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 5
# 8
12-01-2013, 12:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by chuckingram View Post
That's a self-serving assumption, but I'll play. If CRYPTIC says a ship can mount cannons it would be reasonable to expect that it's a viable platform for cannons of all types, right? Well it isn't, compared to a good escort that is. "But if it had the turnrate of an escort it wouldn't be fair!" Agreed, but why not give us something that would compensate a tad, like higher base flight speed? There are lots of things they COULD have done to make the Avenger unique, but they didn't. I suspect the ship was cheap-licked to make money AND appease the anti-fed whiners at the same time.
There's tons of ships that CAN mount dual cannons and shouldn't, though. The Gal-X is a complete joke with them, for example. You can put five torps on the front of a ship and three DBBs on the rear, doesn't mean it's a good idea.

I support ships having trap features like being able to mount DHCs, so we can tell instantly who is bad. You can put DHCs on a Vo'Quv carrier, is it a reasonable assumption that it is a viable platform for cannons, or is it more reasonable that a player might take two seconds to check the turn rating of a ship first?

Last edited by chuggernaut12; 12-01-2013 at 12:38 AM.
Captain
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,159
# 9
12-05-2013, 12:53 PM
My fleet sovereign is a pretty effective tactical cruiser. Yet, the Avenger meets or beats it in specs in every way. I can't imagine how any would find it underpowered. The only thing underpowered is the ship model. Give us an Excel look for that thing cryptic! You let me make that ugly regent look like a kick ass Sovereign.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,062
# 10
11-10-2013, 09:57 PM
the ship is fine. probably the strongest fed cruiser (one of the strongest fed ships) out there, if it suits you. it is what it says on paper, if you have problems with understanding how stats will translate to gameplay, you should just go and test on tribble before buying anything
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