Career Officer
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 344
I'm all for forming groups having parties of large numbers and just all around community progression, but Fleets OP status has got to be addressed!

I understand it takes a lot to get a T5 Station that your fleet can call home and that there should be rewards for accomplishing such a feet but to allow players of large and active fleets so much power over the casual or less player is ridicules.

I participate in fleets myself. I belong to one very small fleet and one fairly active fleet. The active fleet is moving along with projects the only thing holding them up is the Dilithium requirements. The very small fleet is lucky to have a T1 anything.

The advantages given with the Fleet system just don?t seem fair in the least. I can have an extra Doff slot over others, better BOffs and Kits and the only place to get ultra rare gear in game. I know there was lot of talk about Fleet sizes playing a part on projects yet I have not seen anything in effect and even still that doesn?t address the soloist.

How does a player compete with advanced Fleet players? I used to think that Fleets were around to make organizing Fleet Actions and STFs easier but am realizing they are only there for the elitists to score the best gear so they can keep their foot on the little guys necks with ease.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 672
# 2
01-18-2014, 05:09 PM
The fleet system is a choice, you can either choose to invest the time and resources into building up a fleet or not. You can either choose to belong to an active fleet that can build up fleet holdings or not. Your choices have consequences, if you don't want to put the time and effort into building up a fleet then you should not have access to the best gear. Its not different than if you don't put the time and effort into the rep systems you won't have access to the best gear and abilities.

Someone who does not want to work to obtain the best gear should be at a disadvantage over those that have done so, the fleet system is working just the way it should.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 642
# 3
01-18-2014, 05:18 PM
Maybe rep gear should get a buff to fleet level? STO is pretty much an one player game from level 1-49 if you want to. When you hit level 50 you need team up if you want the "best" shinnies.
Captain
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 753
# 4
01-18-2014, 05:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by rosetyler51 View Post
Maybe rep gear should get a buff to fleet level? STO is pretty much an one player game from level 1-49 if you want to. When you hit level 50 you need team up if you want the "best" shinnies.
Most Rep gear is superior to Fleet gear. Rep weapons are certainly superior. The only Fleet gear that's superior to Rep gear are the Elite Fleet shields. That's about it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by voporak View Post
So yes... you could get everything here for free.
Just like you can get a free steak dinner by collecting dropped pennies in the parking lot.
Career Officer
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 344
# 5
01-18-2014, 09:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by emacsheadroom View Post
Most Rep gear is superior to Fleet gear. Rep weapons are certainly superior. The only Fleet gear that's superior to Rep gear are the Elite Fleet shields. That's about it.
Rep gear is not superior to Fleet gear it is comparable because of the set bonus that comes with. However, I am not solely talking about "gear" here. I am talking about the accesses Fleets have above that of an average player.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rattler2
Besides... Rep gear can work just as well. *shrug* I'm STILL working off the Jem'Hadar set on my Romulan's ship. May not be Fleet gear or Rep, but it seems to work for now.
Rep gear works well, and better in some situations.

Quote:
Originally Posted by emacsheadroom
You're acting pretty hostile towards people trying to give you a reasonable response. I think we'd better assume you're just pushing a personal agenda here (crying that you should get all the best gear without having to work for it) and this has very little to do with any objective ideas of fairness on your part.
The statement belittles the facts f the matter so I had to emphasis in some areas, if you felt I was being hostile then there may be a reason for your feelings to the truth.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jtmarsh
You know I work a lot! Even if I play a hour a day you have grinders getting maco gear way before me. They work hard I agree! But it's unfair to others that can't get the gear as fast as others. I want maco gear! But it takes me way longer than active players.


Sound about the same don't you think
Nope it doesn not sound the same at all, even if "I worked a lot" but belonged to a large active fleet that I had full access to I could get the additional buffs way faster than the dedicated gamer trying to get things on his own.

However, that is less than a part of the point here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ursusmorologus
Most of thefleet ship equipment is just different not better, and some of it is flat out bad. However the consoles and warp cores are OP and have no comparable rep counterpart (the dyson stuff is not in the same league at all). Meanwhile, crafting does not have anything to offer at all, and high-level loot drops are too rare to matter. More generally, item have an aimless design that is inconsistently implemented (at best), where the only real driver is zen sales for the dilithium conversion (favoring fleet and rep).
There are 3 warp core options out there aside from "normal" stuff and Fleet, Dyson, Obilesk and Tal Shiar. Tal Shiar is ONLY available on the 2 Tal Shiar ships and the Obilesk 3pc is limited as well.

Fleet OP Status includes not just Weapons, Shields, Engines and the like but also the boats themselves.

Fleet Ships have better stats and an additional console slot than their counterparts.

Fleet Embassies grant Romulan Kits which grant a 5th ground ability over that of other kits.

Fleets have access to specialty DOffs and BOffs.

Fleet Spires grant a Bonus DOff slot on your active space and ground rosters and Atmospheric Flight Training which grants a buff against the resistance in shuttle atmospher missions.

We are about to get PvP with shuttles and if this is an Atmospheric condition map (which it feels like it will be) then those with the access to this buff will have the advantage over others trying to play this arena.

TLDR
So lets recap:

Ground advantage goes to Embassy and Spire Kits vs Anything available anywhere else and access to a DOff officer buff over others.

Space advantage goes to Fleet Ships, Atmospheric Training and again the advantage of a DOff officer.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,750
# 6
01-19-2014, 04:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tragamites View Post

TLDR
So lets recap:

Ground advantage goes to Embassy and Spire Kits vs Anything available anywhere else and access to a DOff officer buff over others.

Space advantage goes to Fleet Ships, Atmospheric Training and again the advantage of a DOff officer.
Get it through your head, Cryptic WANTS you to join megafleets. That's ALWAYS been very, very clear. Megafleets serve many tasks for Cryptic, they promote higher retention, they promote lockbox and lobi sales by making it so if one in a fleet gets such a ship, everyone in the fleet is more likely to be exposed to it and want it. Why do you think you feel pushed to join a large fleet? Its not by chance, its intentional.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sorceror01 View Post
....you are a bad starship captain and you should feel bad.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tachyonharmonic View Post
However, I think with regard to the Romulan Republic player characters/npcs, it all comes down to a finite point:

These are not the Romulans from the shows.
Career Officer
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 3,619
# 7
01-18-2014, 11:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by emacsheadroom View Post
Most Rep gear is superior to Fleet gear. Rep weapons are certainly superior. The only Fleet gear that's superior to Rep gear are the Elite Fleet shields. That's about it.
Two words:

Set Bonuses.

That is all.

"The Snowmenz Are Coming! The Snowmenz Are Coming!!"

The Masterverse Timeline / Ten Forward Fanfics
Captain
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 3,158
# 8
01-19-2014, 01:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by emacsheadroom View Post
Most Rep gear is superior to Fleet gear. Rep weapons are certainly superior. The only Fleet gear that's superior to Rep gear are the Elite Fleet shields. That's about it.
Debatable. Elite Fleet Shields, while very nice and well-rounded, have several weaknesses of their own, and Rep shields tend to outperform them under those conditions. For instance, an Elite Fleet Shield starts with only the A or B resistance, which means 0% if nothing is matched. A MACO shield has a higher strength, and starts at 10% outright, +20% vs. plasma. It will therefore outperform its fleet equivalent when fighting Borgs, as it immediately begins at 10%+20% plasma resistance, whereas an Elite B only has 15% and has to work its way up. Since Borg don't fire that many shots, you won't get up to 10 stacks for full protection very quickly.

Elite Fleet Shields also generally have inferior capacity. A KHG shield will withstand sudden spikes out of nowhere better, with the additional chance of simply jamming your opponent in mid-alpha.

In short, EFS is not an automatic "gimme" compared to Rep versions.

Finally, it is worth noting that one does not HAVE to belong to a top-tier fleet to get Fleet Gear.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 1,135
# 9
01-19-2014, 04:56 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by rosetyler51 View Post
Maybe rep gear should get a buff to fleet level? STO is pretty much an one player game from level 1-49 if you want to. When you hit level 50 you need team up if you want the "best" shinnies.
Both OP and you have valid points. Crafting is far far behind on this game it's been pointed out on every major network concerning games out there and yet it's still not been improved. EVEN if they made the crafted XII gear BoP some people would complain because this fleet system is just terrible.

It's terrible because it's entirely too difficult to build and maintain a fleet of only 5 people with limited time people have to play, and it's terrible because things like building resources to keep the stores open are not items that are handled by the game rather than the fleet commander or officers directly. So no one can even take time off from the game without the fleet falling under completely.

Take for example people in the military, if they are called away to duty like in a war or skirmish and they happened to be the person in charge of the fleet resources and they had to leave without saying anything (which actually often happens in all mmo's ) then that fleet is pretty much screwed until someone else can take it up.

This system needs some better brains involved in tweaking it.

If they improved the crafting and the reputation rewards to match the fleet rewards we'd see fewer tiny fleets struggling to get to the end just for the gear (which is actually a good thing). That's my 2 cents.
MMO's of 2014 where normal gameplay is considered an exploit and the eastern billing model is celebrated by apologists. smh
Career Officer
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 344
# 10
01-18-2014, 05:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by john98837 View Post
The fleet system is a choice, you can either choose to invest the time and resources into building up a fleet or not. You can either choose to belong to an active fleet that can build up fleet holdings or not. Your choices have consequences, if you don't want to put the time and effort into building up a fleet then you should not have access to the best gear. Its not different than if you don't put the time and effort into the rep systems you won't have access to the best gear and abilities.

Someone who does not want to work to obtain the best gear should be at a disadvantage over those that have done so, the fleet system is working just the way it should.
Wrong! Yes you have a choice to join and build a fleet but the consequences of not joining or participating with a fleet should never result in NEVER being able to compete against a fleeted player, EVER!

You are talking about giving a player MASSIVE amounts of Buffs over others who do not have access to the same things, who may even put in more time and effort to accomplish such a thing. A fleet of 500 players do not need to work as hard as a fleet of 5 to accomplish the same tasks.
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