Republic Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 663
# 91
05-17-2013, 06:44 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by nadiezja View Post
This is EXACTLY why I keep arguing that this mission needs a trigger warning. Well, this, and its distinct parallel to... pardon the rather clumsy euphemism, but the filter eats the word that really ought to be used here and the point desperately needs making... non-consensual intimate activity.

This mission is BRILLIANT. It would be a TERRIBLE loss to the game to delete it. But players absolutely need to be warned before playing it, because there are a lot of people who will have very bad reactions to it.
I didn't trigger, I thought this mission was awesomesauce. I loved that I could fight tooth and nail every step of the way.

Also, was I the only one under the impression that most of this mission was all in your head?
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Career Officer
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 5,572
# 92
05-17-2013, 07:01 AM
The morality choices in this mission are handled much better here than in SWTOR. Here it's obvious your character is being brainwashed against his/her will. While in SWTOR I've found some the morality choices idiotic at best.

Like in one instance you have to choose between giving medicine to people who "might" get sick without it or saving the lives of people who will die before morning without the medicine. You get dark side points if you save the lives of the people in immediate danger of dying.

Another example has a group of corrupt soldiers forcing civilians to run an obstacle course thru a minefield in order to get supplies they need to survive, and if you turn them in the authorities berate you and call you a tattletale.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 5,572
# 93
05-17-2013, 07:13 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by commanderkassy View Post
I didn't trigger, I thought this mission was awesomesauce. I loved that I could fight tooth and nail every step of the way.

Also, was I the only one under the impression that most of this mission was all in your head?
I simply assumed the entire indoctrination was a holodeck induced delusion, with the first "simulation" done deliberately to convince the character that the rest was real and not happening on the holodeck. Cuz I refuse to believe that Hakeev is stupid enough to let a prisoner that hasn't been completely indoctrinated wander around his ship by him/herself between indoctrination sessions.

Everything from shooting your Boff to the borg conversion was a holodeck delusion with the undercover agent hacking the holodeck database to communicate with you. The only "real" stuff happened after you woke up in the medbay after the brainwashing was broken.
Republic Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 663
# 94
05-17-2013, 09:14 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sopwithsnipe View Post
I simply assumed the entire indoctrination was a holodeck induced delusion, with the first "simulation" done deliberately to convince the character that the rest was real and not happening on the holodeck. Cuz I refuse to believe that Hakeev is stupid enough to let a prisoner that hasn't been completely indoctrinated wander around his ship by him/herself between indoctrination sessions.

Everything from shooting your Boff to the borg conversion was a holodeck delusion with the undercover agent hacking the holodeck database to communicate with you. The only "real" stuff happened after you woke up in the medbay after the brainwashing was broken.
It's been a few weeks, so I forgot about there being a holodeck involved.
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Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 14,502
# 95
05-17-2013, 09:27 AM
It could be a holodeck inside your head....

but yeah, I also had the feeling that the indoctrination part wasn't actually "Real" when I first played it.
HAIL HYDRA!

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I can haz joystick!
MMOs aren't charities. Corporations are supposed to make a profit. It's what they do.
Rihannsu
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 258
# 96
05-17-2013, 09:37 AM
It's not the first time this issue has come up in an MMO. In WoW, to create a Death Knight, one must go through a storyline/starter area which requires at one point murdering your best friend in cold blood. A lot of people (including myself) refused to make a Death Knight character in part because even if it's only virtual, we won't participate in a scenario that is murder for the sake of depravity.

This is just one of those subjects that some people "get" and others don't.

Some people just want an interesting story and appreciate being in the midst of it, even if that story means murdering people or doing really terrible things. This may be compelling storytelling, but it is not heroic.

Others (like the OP) obviously enjoy the tension of striving to be better than their circumstances, of rising above, even in a video game, to do the moral thing. This is heroic.

The Star Trek universe has traditionally been about "being heroic" and even Cryptic's rationale for not allowing players to be Tal Shiar is based on the idea of being heroic, and not letting players be part of a faction where circumstance would require them to knowingly do evil.

It seems that they may be contradicting their own philosophy, even though it is for the sake of telling a compelling story.

Last edited by voxinvictus; 05-17-2013 at 09:40 AM.
Career Officer
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 893
# 97
05-17-2013, 09:42 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wufangchu View Post
yeahh, but then its easier for me to kill humans than animals anyway.. Yes, I AM a vietnam vet.. I AM a monster according to a great many people still and not much different than Hakeev ( and i never fired a single shot against another human being ).. Yes, I DID trigger on this mission, badly.. Those military ships? the pirates? all of em? i'll kill them a million times over. they knew the risks and they took their chances, It's they're turn to die.. The epoohs or whatever they are did not know the risks, they did not volunteer, and they do not deserve to die while defenseless and helpless..
This episode caused me to remember. I dont want to remember. That was fourty years ago and i dont want those memories any more. they arent fun, they arent part of a game and they are as offensive as it can possibly get. Just like this mission.
I'm a Vet too although not of Vietnam but I can see where you are coming from and for that I say Thank you for your Service. You are not a monster, war is truly Hell on earth, those that serve deserve our praise and thanks not distain and hate. This story rubbed me the wrong way too.
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 14,502
# 98
05-17-2013, 09:53 AM
Honestly only the Borg experiments caused me to flinch.... Epohhs are one step up from vermin. And nothing else involved inflicting any actual harm on others.
HAIL HYDRA!

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
I can haz joystick!
MMOs aren't charities. Corporations are supposed to make a profit. It's what they do.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 5,628
# 99
05-17-2013, 10:38 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by voxinvictus View Post
It's not the first time this issue has come up in an MMO. In WoW, to create a Death Knight, one must go through a storyline/starter area which requires at one point murdering your best friend in cold blood. A lot of people (including myself) refused to make a Death Knight character in part because even if it's only virtual, we won't participate in a scenario that is murder for the sake of depravity.
I can say first hand you ppl where a small group paladins/death knights are the 2 most over played classes in the game
swimwear off risa not fixed
system Lord Baal is dead
Quote:
Originally Posted by macronius View Post
This! Their ability to outdo their own failures is quite impressive. If only this power could be harnessed for good.

Last edited by daan2006; 05-17-2013 at 10:40 AM.
Career Officer
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 893
# 100
05-17-2013, 11:11 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by daan2006 View Post
I can say first hand you ppl where a small group paladins/death knights are the 2 most over played classes in the game
It is not in my nature to play a cold, ruthless and bloodthirsty character as to me that is the villain, but to others this kind of character give them a feeling of power that they cant get from the normal Hero type.
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