Captain
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 5,394
# 121
05-17-2013, 05:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cha0s1428 View Post
I'm sorry, were you still trying to claim that you aren't being a troll?
Yup. Just as much as you're claiming your D'D is unplayable and in need of a boost.
Commander
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 405
# 122
05-17-2013, 05:57 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by marc8219 View Post
They probably won't do that, but if it were to happen the D'D would get balanced in some other way with lower stats elsewhere, so not worth it.

How about learn to pvp with big ships instead first before saying the D'D is unplayable. Or just stick to PVE with the D'D if you can't be bothered to do that. Now if you can't manage PVE with this ship just because of turn then you need to stick to escorts.
I do pvp with big ships. I do know how to play, quite well. And anybody can get top damage in ESTFs in any ship in their sleep.

I am not saying or have ever said that the D'd is unplayable. I have been asking why this ship must suffer a disadvantage in turn rate as compared to the other cruisers. It is not a carrier, nothing in this game sticks to canon, and the reasoning of it being so is to balance out it having BC, DHCs and singularity powers, makes no sense because the other romulan ships suffer no such disadvantage for having access to the same thing. Aside from lower power, but cruisers have that too.

What is the rationale behind it?

If you do fine with your low turn cruiser, that's great, good for you. Everyone I seem to fight is running dual omegas so TB or EWP doesn't hold them for me as well as you, but oh well. Yours is also a carrier yes? So there is that. I haven't done much pvp in a carrier so I can't say how much different it is. I have killed quite a few though as its pretty easy to stay out of their arc, even in a fed ship. So I guess I really don't know what kind of advice you are trying to give me, aside making your point while being a ****head? The attitude is really not needed.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 7,176
# 123
05-17-2013, 05:58 PM
everything that boosts turn rate does so with a multiplier. thats why the base number is so important. start with 16, easily end up with 40. start with 5, you wont even get 20.

the d'deridex aint no good at being a flying hospital with that many stations taken up by tac, and its not any good at being a battle cruiser with that turn rate that there is nothing you can truly do anything about. nothing that will get you to the mid 20 to the low 30s turn rates you need to be a decent tactical cruiser. spamming faw only kills npcs, its harmless vs any player.

the ship cant do anything right as it stands. a turn rate of 8 or 9, (followed by a buff to every cruiser and carrier turn rate by 1-3,) and the droping of the 2 ENS stations for a LT eng, or uni are needed for this ship to be somewhat useful, as a kirker cruiser.


keep on drinking the RP coolaid though, about how its size should prevent an ok turn rate, as if size has any effect at all on escort turn rates. even the great big ones automatically get a great turn rate just for being escorts. a battle cruiser turn rate is not a lot to ask for a battle cruiser.

even the lower section of the ha'apax, the escort, has a 16 turn rate. that solid section in the middle of that ship? its has at least the d'deride's volume, if not more. it gets a 16 turn rate. the top section thats a sci ship? which has MUCH higher volume? twice the d'deridex's turn rate. theres a 10 turn rate to laugh like an idiot about.
gateway links-->Norvo Tigan, Telis Latto Ruwon, Sochie Heim, Solana Soleus
Commander
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 405
# 124
05-17-2013, 06:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by snoggymack22 View Post
Yup. Just as much as you're claiming your D'D is unplayable and in need of a boost.
Never said unplayable. Did say could use a boost though.

Keep claiming its great though.
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 14,439
# 125
05-17-2013, 06:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bunansa View Post
The D'Deridex is fine the way she is either L2P the ship she was meant to be played or gtfo


honest... some of you need a breather and realize not every single thing has to be exactly like the other...get over it...some people like tobasco on pizza some dont

I like the Big D the way she is as a heavy slow moving monster tank ship that has style


so for the love of all thats good and holy....just drop it...before they increase the turn rate to 10 and drop its hull to 20k or some stupid crap...leave it alone!

Infact I speak for the entire IRF when i say...LEAVE IT ALONE
Your candor is refreshing. I agree with this. It's NOT a bad ship at all. Then again.... I'm not one of those "Escorts Online" players. One of my chars on live flys the original Oddy. Thus I have a lot of experience flying ships that turn like bricks.
Quote:
Originally Posted by marc8219 View Post
I'm sure you remember me getting annoyed with you in the other D'D threads which finally ended up producing the results I wanted. Anyway I'll give you the benefit of the doubt when you said you weren't trolling in those threads, but it does seem like the posters in this thread are reacting the same way I was to you in the other threads. Ease up with the laughing at people some please, its a very tense subject when you consider how many fans of this ship there are.

Turn isn't so much of an issue for me though since I am able to handle DHC on the Bortasqu and Gal-X, but I do sypmathize a little with these people as most people don't know how to pilot low turn ships, and I want more people to be able to enjoy this ship other then experienced Bortasqu/GalX pilots. Anyway I hold out hope that RCS and impulse thruster changes make this issue moot, just please stop trying to aggravate D'D fans until then, whether intentional or not.
So? Not all ships are escorts.... this is about as far from an escort as you can get. Trying to fly it like an escort is a matter of personal choice. IMO it's a bad choice, but that's just my opinion. I fly it like a Dragon Flagship. That's worked out quite well so far.
HAIL HYDRA!

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
I can haz joystick!
MMOs aren't charities. Corporations are supposed to make a profit. It's what they do.
Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 311
# 126
05-17-2013, 08:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by markhawkman View Post
"target facing"?

Lemme guess you were actually trying to use DHC on a ship that is (for all practical purposes) a heavy cruiser? Umm.... no. I used beam arrays with a dragon setup and FaW.... worked great!
I use DBB on it and I don't think DHCs should ever be viable for it. I was thinking more along the lines of it becoming a torp boat, for a build like that you need better turn than what we have, you don't need 10+ but you need more than the current base

A base of 7-8 would be a huge improvement and if it's not going to get that it needs a significant boost to it's hull. In a drawn out fight the reliance on the stealth will be the undoing of this ship.

and for the record at sub-light speeds the D'Dex can out maneuver the galaxy according to cannon both in speed and turn. It is only slower at warp. I don't think cannon should play a part in ship balance though.

Last edited by wardcalis; 05-17-2013 at 10:21 PM.
Commander
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 355
# 127
05-17-2013, 09:42 PM
Ugh...after water-carrying this for two weeks now, and umpteen bajillion posts, all I have to say is,

First, learn to use the forum's search function.

Second, it's fine. Learn to play.
Somebody getting uppity about canon? No problem! Just take a deep breath, and repeat after me:

Spock's Brain.
Rihannsu
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 700
# 128
05-18-2013, 01:13 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wardcalis View Post
I use DBB on it and I don't think DHCs should ever be viable for it. I was thinking more along the lines of it becoming a torp boat, for a build like that you need better turn than what we have, you don't need 10+ but you need more than the current base

A base of 7-8 would be a huge improvement and if it's not going to get that it needs a significant boost to it's hull. In a drawn out fight the reliance on the stealth will be the undoing of this ship.

and for the record at sub-light speeds the D'Dex can out maneuver the galaxy according to cannon both in speed and turn. It is only slower at warp. I don't think cannon should play a part in ship balance though.
Allow me to propose using the Ha'Feh Assault warbird. with four weapons in front, three in back a base turn rate of sixteen and base hull of 31000 it could make an excellent torpedo boat..
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 7,176
# 129
05-18-2013, 03:08 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by theodrim View Post
Ugh...after water-carrying this for two weeks now, and umpteen bajillion posts, all I have to say is,

First, learn to use the forum's search function.

Second, it's fine. Learn to play.
its fine in stfs and pve, its NOT fine in pvp
gateway links-->Norvo Tigan, Telis Latto Ruwon, Sochie Heim, Solana Soleus
Commander
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 405
# 130
05-18-2013, 04:18 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dontdrunkimshoot View Post
its fine in stfs and pve, its NOT fine in pvp
Face it drunk. Its these people arguing from the pve side drinking their rp koolaid who just keep constantly validating the devs decision on this stuff, and its why the turn rate won't change. Pvp will always be a mess because the vast majority are conent with running underpferfoming builds, who think turning like a brick is "canon" so its fine.

Its why the game is in its current state pvp wise.

"Example X" is causing problems, so are Y and Z.
Most people don't pvp because of problems X,Y and Z.
Dev don't bother working on pvp because hardly anyone does anymore.
Its a never ending cycle and pvers aren't helping, and no matter how much people like us try to have a rational reasoning behind what we say, they don't listen.

I mean honestly, the vast majority of the arguments against us right now are "its not an escort, and shouldn't turn like a defiant. And no matter how many times it is said that +2 or 3 to base = 7.5 or 8.5 NOT 17, the same argument comes back "if you want to turn like an escort, fly an escort"

Its honestly mind boggling.
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