Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,336
# 151
06-06-2013, 07:04 AM
Hey taco,

I haven't tried to follow the development of this, but I wanted to let you know I don't think this work very well yet.

It is now much harder to take good screenshots, for example:

If I want to have a closeup on a characters face it switches to lowres crappy textures after a short while, so it has to be done very quick.

Also sometimes in different areas low and highres are mixed, making it look.. not so good.

Personally I liked it better as it was before the introduction of this low/highres function, but perhaps it just needs tweaking and some polish still?

Hope you take this as constructive feedback cause that is what I tried to do.
Cryptic Studios Team
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,201
# 152
06-06-2013, 08:20 AM
There is no new low res/high res function. All of our textures have had Mipmaps this whole time.

Several people have reported similar issues with the lower mip popping up when close to something, and that adjusting the "Video Memory Limit" in the video options to '1024+' has fixed it. There have also been reports of nvidia driver issues. If you can, please update your driver, and set your video memory limit, and then let me know if you're still seeing the issue.
Only YOU can prevent forum fires!

Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,336
# 153
06-06-2013, 10:23 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tacofangs View Post
There is no new low res/high res function. All of our textures have had Mipmaps this whole time.

Several people have reported similar issues with the lower mip popping up when close to something, and that adjusting the "Video Memory Limit" in the video options to '1024+' has fixed it. There have also been reports of nvidia driver issues. If you can, please update your driver, and set your video memory limit, and then let me know if you're still seeing the issue.
Guess I could have been more clear, with "new low res/high res function" I meant the new stuff you talk about in the OP of this thread.

As for drivers, I always have the latest (unless I have to revert temporary).

Will try raising the Video Memory Limit though.

Edit: Looks like it were already on 1024+ MB.

Last edited by idrona; 06-06-2013 at 10:42 AM.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 744
# 154
06-06-2013, 12:29 PM
I changed to Video Memory limit, and that seemed to fix the issue.

The problem is, before LoR, I just used the default graphics slider, and everything was fine. It made it much easier to play the game without lag, but I was able to just click the slider up a few notches to take pretty screenshots.
Join Date: July 29 2008
Captain
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 1,223
# 155
06-06-2013, 02:56 PM
Has the way textures load now changed the amount of overall data being sent to and from my PC?

Because post-Legacy of Romulus, the game is absolutely using less bandwidth to just go through normal play. I figure it's something to do with the game having to talk to itself less over loading textures, or something.

It's a non factor to most, but as someone on a limited plan it's been quite noticeable that I'm getting more bandwidth bang for my buck out of gameplay post-LoR, and I can't figure out what else it would be.

At any rate... it's a nice side bonus, wherever it's coming from.
--------------------------------------

"We are smart." - Grebnedlog

Member of Alliance Central Command/boq botlhra'ghom
Cryptic Studios Team
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,201
# 156
06-06-2013, 04:54 PM
Once you've patched, you have all of the textures, and there is no *extra* bandwidth needed to load them. There were plenty of other changes for Legacy of Romulus, and maybe something else is causing an uptick there. The textures themselves are all on your machine, and should be using less video memory than before (only slightly)

If you've already maxed out your Video Memory Limit, I don't know. I'll bring it back up with the graphics guys.
Only YOU can prevent forum fires!

Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,336
# 157
06-06-2013, 11:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tacofangs View Post
If you've already maxed out your Video Memory Limit, I don't know. I'll bring it back up with the graphics guys.
Cool, thanks.

Let me know if they want more info and/or screenshots.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 184
# 158
06-07-2013, 02:20 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by afree100 View Post
/worldTexLODLevel 10
worldtexlodlevel maxes out at 2. It's directly equivalent of "200%" in the "World texture quality" slider.
Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 259
# 159
06-08-2013, 06:16 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by nanomorph View Post
worldtexlodlevel maxes out at 2. It's directly equivalent of "200%" in the "World texture quality" slider.
From testing I just did you are right about 2 is the max setting in the game options but the max value is 10 since this text is drawn from the game /cmdlist

worldTexLODLevel Sets the quality level for world textures. Normal values range from 0.5 to 10.0.

Although values higher than 2 shouldn't make a difference since textures that far away probably don't even get drawn with a pixel size high enough for there to be a difference, therefore you are for all practical purposes right (unless someone has an insanely high screen resolution and likes sitting several cm from it lol). Although the video ram size dosen't seem to increase when I set the number above 2 on New Romulus furthering your point.

Also the worldtexlodlvl doesn’t override low texture sizes (e.g. those set with video memory at 128). I am guessing that the game defaults to the lowest possible setting people on wine and/or something could be wrong with anything along the line of telling startrekonline what there video ram size is, thus causing sto to reduce texture draw size forcibly, since if the game tried to use more video ram than there was available when a certain setting caused textures to over the video ram limit the game would crash. Therefore these people are being forced into low quality textures and 1024+ removes the cap therefore fixing the issue, since most likely your video ram would be over 1024 (esp since extra video ram is shared with system ram).

Also Intel Intergrated Graphics uses system ram entirely (or possibly almost entirely with an insanely low video ram amount (something like 32mb) this is all just a guess though I am pretty sure it only uses system ram))). And this cap (amount of normal ram Intel integrated graphics (and the system) decided to give intel intergrated graphics) is usually set above what STO uses (which atm looking into the reman thing in New Romulus gpu values with /renderscale (got a little sidetracked when writing this):

/renderscale 1
Entire System: Dedicated: 750 Shared ram (or video ram being used in system ram (the ram everything else uses)): 70
STO: 675 26
/renderscale 2
Entire System: 883 72
STO: 750 26

hmm renderscale causes the game to gain a little bit of gpu ram usage but causes quite a lot extra in the dwm (desktop window manager, Microsofts transparent window implementation) and csrss (windows user process, being the non kernal (much like standard users instead of administrative users) process of windows (or at least a part of it) that used to store all the systems graphics data and now in windows vista,7,8 stores less of the % of video ram stuffs (due to dwm doing some of the work)). Guess that extra screen size makes the windows screen buffer (or that’s what I am calling it anyway) (place in the system where windows pretends that its actually the data of the actual screen so it can (dosen't always mean it does) make modifications, there are also multiple places this gets done (both it windows and in games (don't know specifics, I didn't make either lol)) that much larger.

This information is based on what I know, I am not a graphics programmer or anything (although I am planning to be one) but I have looked into this kind of stuff quite a bit, so it is prone to errors.

Also I am grateful to the devs (original post and posts from other devs on game mechanics) for sharing information, it is very interesting and I haven't seen really any other proprietary games do it (esp. in the MMO field).

Also regarding the UI textures, I was angry that the game started to use the newer ones because it is a lot like Windows 8, Windows 8 looks so ugly I pretty much went to Linux, found Arch Linux forums and had a party, although Linux is faster and in general better than windows it has two deadly flaws: 1. It is a pain to set up and iron out all the bugs in the system (I know there is Ubuntu but Ubuntu is horrible imo) and it isn't something the average person is able to easily/practically do, 2. While the software is the best you can get (other than the gaming field due to these reasons (and offshoots of them)) they are not designed to be harmonious (like windows) and therefore cause point 1 (oh okay so its just reason 2 as the main reason), and UI issues etc. Although UI issues are common because Linux programmers usually make things for themselves and not end users in mind and because of point 2 (too many ways to do stuff, no one platform/API/whatever to concentrate on.

Okay back to STO UI textures after my second distraction, well I have to say I have got quite used to them (dare I say to the point where I like them), although they are done in a much better way then microsofts. But they do lack two things (maybe the number with the bi prefix is getting two (did that on purpose) me (I am assuming anyone who got to this point in my post is interested in computers (actually I have assumed that for a while) esp since my writing contains far too many brackets)); 1. They are to simple and 2. They don't match the item icons (designed for the old UI) as well (obviously). Congratz you have read 900 unfriendly (grammer wise), unproofed and unspellchecked words.

Edit: Extension of Linux stuff:
Linux also has a lot of text based stuff, this turns many people off because it is in some cases harder and people are not used to it. Although text based can be a lot faster than image based stuff for a lot of things even if it doesn’t seem like it. Also a nice thing about Arch Linux is you can type in one command and everything on your system automatically gets updated to the latest version. Arch Linux is so up to date that AMD drivers have to have some arch Linux software kept from updating because AMD doesn’t support it fast enough. So basically games and some ease of use is why I still have windows installed. Nevertheless when I do finally learn C++ and some other stuff I will do it all for Linux, I hate the dark world of Windows 8 and like the fact that Linux is so much better. Thus Windows could be called Gamedows (perhaps I should change the login text with this method (assuming it works): http://www.cleverit.nl/technical-kno...ws-logon-logo/ to reflect my new name), it would be a more appropriate name for me (wine is bad (too long to setup and can still have a lot of bugs when I can just dual boot windows)).

Oh and I decided to spell check this after all. I find it ironic that Microsoft Word likes Linux instead of linux and doesn’t recognise csrss.

Starfleet M.A.C.O. KDF Honour Guard

Last edited by afree100; 06-08-2013 at 06:58 AM.
Career Officer
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 174
# 160
08-15-2013, 10:39 AM
Digging through some old STO screenshots today and realised how ugly some of the 'new' textures are, particulary held weapons and wall signage - was their ever a half decent official reason for this LoR uglify-patch?
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 04:04 PM.