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Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,625
# 11
06-06-2013, 10:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by steamwright View Post
I heard years ago that Roddenberry considered certain parts and episodes to be canon, but not all of it. I don't recall the source of that conversation, sorry. I don't know all of what he considered canon, but I'm pretty sure it was said he considered the episode "Yesteryear" as canon. I suspect Robert April was also considered canon.

I personally see the tripodial Lt. Arex as canon. For a while, I thought I glimpsed either him or another Edosian in the background in the new movies, but I'm now thinking I was mistaken.

I'd also like to think the tribble predator is canon.
He considered the story about Spock's youth canon, at least, it was less clear about the whole time travel back to see. Roddenberry was a bit chaotic with canon, and not just with TAS. He'd pull episodes of TOS in or out of canon, too. Particularly with Star Trek V he changed his stance several times, ranging from the entire movie being out of canon to the events, people, and locations being canon but Sybok is not related to Spock.



As far as STO is concerned, though, it's not. Not because it didn't canonically happen, but because CBS doesn't own the rights to license it.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 3,177
# 12
06-06-2013, 12:21 PM
As I see it, thanks to one episode in particular, TAS would have to be soft canon at best.

When Larry Niven's original TAS script was rejected by the network, and he had to grab another story and modify it, he chose "The Soft Weapon", which he reworked into "The Slaver Weapon". Thing is, about all he changed were the protagonists - instead of two humans and a puppeteer, he used Trek characters.

The titular weapon was a leftover from the Thrint-Tnuctipun War, sometimes called the Slaver War, over a billion years ago. The side-effects of the ancient Thrint Empire include the existence of so much life that's similar to other life in the galaxy - descendants of a mutated version of a yeast plant that fed the thrintun. The war ended when the thrintun, who had a sort of telepathic hypnosis ability they called the Power, used an amplifier to issue an order through the Power for every sentient being in the galaxy to die. (Note: sentient, not sapient. If it had a central nervous system, it was dead. Yes, this included the thrintun themselves. With the Power, they never had to be very bright...)

This history is at extreme odds with Trek's forerunners, who were running around a billion years ago planting messages in DNA. The two histories are fundamentally incompatible; they cannot both be canon. Therefore, I have to place TAS in the "soft canon" category, where you can use the bits you like and ignore the bits you don't.

(Well, there's also the fact that while we have personal shields in the game, nobody had them in the movies, which take place later than TAS...)
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But I'm young enough to remember the future, the way things ought to be...

- Rush, "Cut To the Chase", Counterparts
Lieutenant
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 49
# 13 TAS Cannon?
06-06-2013, 01:01 PM
Star Trek has ALOT of material out there, between, games books, shows, movies and RPG games. I'm pretty sure not all of it is canon.

The question is does STO look at TAS as canon?

I believe Dstahl, and Gekko have said in the past that STO has the rights to TAS and do consider it part of the STO universe (sorry cant give you direct links as reference)

HOWEVER....

I don't see Edosians/Edoans running around on ESD. =(

I would love to see them as a playable race. They basically use the same mechanics as the Undine.

There's my two cents and my "Put Edoans in STO plug"
Captain
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 2,268
# 14
06-06-2013, 01:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by avertyoureyess View Post

I don't see Edosians/Edoans running around on ESD. =(

I would love to see them as a playable race. They basically use the same mechanics as the Undine.

There's my two cents and my "Put Edoans in STO plug"
Exactly. They already have the wire-frames for tripods, just need to arrange it for playable rather than NPC.


It is no wonder fans squabble over canonicity if Gene himself didn't clearly specify what is and what is not. IMHO, I hope he left The Infinite Vulcan out of the canon. I know Koenig wrote it, and I respect his effort, but I considered it about the same as Spock's Brain, that is, pretty flimsy stuff.
Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,625
# 15
06-06-2013, 01:37 PM
Quote:
I believe Dstahl, and Gekko have said in the past that STO has the rights to TAS and do consider it part of the STO universe (sorry cant give you direct links as reference)
He said the opposite, actually. It was in the old engineering reports, though, so it's pretty much lost.

We were originally going to get the Kzinti. They were listed as in progress forever, being held up by CBS approval. That fell through, since Filmation kept many of the rights from that show, meaning they now lie with Dreamworks, not CBS.

which is why we have the Ferasans now, which are pretty much the Kzinti in everything but a couple inconsistencies (Kzinti females weren't intelligent, Kzinti telepaths were forced into low social status, and the species had a slumped feral posture).

Last edited by hevach; 06-06-2013 at 01:39 PM.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,674
# 16
06-06-2013, 01:52 PM
Voiced by the original cast. Everyone, including Roddenberry got a paycheck....Yes, it's canon.
The Photobomb of Khan.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,081
# 17
06-06-2013, 02:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by steamwright View Post
Exactly. They already have the wire-frames for tripods, just need to arrange it for playable rather than NPC.

Already is. When Q is hanging around, he can sometimes zap you into an 8472 for a time. Which means, yes, last christmas, there were ice skating 8472's on the ice lake.
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A Romulan Strike Team, Missing Farmers and an ancient base on a Klingon Border world. But what connects them? Find out in my First Foundary mission: 'The Jeroan Farmer Escapade'
Lieutenant
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 49
# 18 TAS and Cryptic
06-06-2013, 02:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cptjhunter View Post
Voiced by the original cast. Everyone, including Roddenberry got a paycheck....Yes, it's canon.
...i totally forgot about that.... its been a while, LOL That works for me as canon.

I did some hunting, in the following link Dstahl confirms Cryptic has the rights to TAS .

Dstahl: Good question. Our license with CBS is restricted to the TV Shows, the movies (up to Nemesis), the Animated Series, and some of the book fiction. Unfortunately, this license doesn?t extend to other video games. January(2013) Ask Cryptic

http://sto.perfectworld.com/news/?p=800861


There is a podcast (maybe UGC) with Captain Gekko also making reference to TAS and what Cryptic has the rights for, and what they consider canon. He also mentions how the new JJ movies messed up their world view a little in the same sentence. However, Gekko makes like 4 hour interviews, so finding that will be tough.
Captain
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 2,268
# 19
06-06-2013, 02:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by grylak View Post
Already is. When Q is hanging around, he can sometimes zap you into an 8472 for a time. Which means, yes, last christmas, there were ice skating 8472's on the ice lake.
Sorry I had not joined then, I am.

Undine on ice. Sounds like a Disney show.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,674
# 20
06-06-2013, 02:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by avertyoureyess View Post
...i totally forgot about that.... its been a while, LOL That works for me as canon.

I did some hunting, in the following link Dstahl confirms Cryptic has the rights to TAS .

Dstahl: Good question. Our license with CBS is restricted to the TV Shows, the movies (up to Nemesis), the Animated Series, and some of the book fiction. Unfortunately, this license doesn?t extend to other video games. January(2013) Ask Cryptic

http://sto.perfectworld.com/news/?p=800861


There is a podcast (maybe UGC) with Captain Gekko also making reference to TAS and what Cryptic has the rights for, and what they consider canon. He also mentions how the new JJ movies messed up their world view a little in the same sentence. However, Gekko makes like 4 hour interviews, so finding that will be tough.
A T-5 connie via Filmation?
The Photobomb of Khan.
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