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Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 650
# 51
07-09-2013, 12:17 PM
My advice, is dont rush the mine.

Cryptic always performs a rectal extraction of their head after a while and they have the numbers prove them they screwed up on the pricing of developments.

I just sell stuff on the exchange for those without patience then buy stuff later. Though that has not worked out as I thought now with doffs. The change in generalizing the doffs has actually raised the overall prices because the Sec, ops, med doffs did not drop as much as the tac, eng, sci rose.

They screwed up the holding system when they made the upgrades cost so much and the provisions cost so little. A big fleet needs mroe provisions, small fleet does not. Therefore the bias is for huge fleets because they will level fast enough to b able to comfortably provide provisions while the smaller fleets can get the provisions, but no access to the higher tier things. I think this is by design though, as a means to reduce fleet numbers in support of future fleet pvp type program that I anticipate.
Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 650
# 52
07-09-2013, 12:26 PM
I do feel that the starbase system is sucking the fun out, it takes too long to get somewhere they gated us with materials, time, and progression, and people are not pvping as much as they used too due to holdings and rep system. I get the feeling that there are a few still hording great resources, but most of us are near dry and have little to show for it.

At some point the game needs to be a game. Right now content is being added in the form of more empty boxes to fill by running established missions. Hive is nice, but they need to put a new STF out every quarter at this point just to keep things interesting. Perhaps have a foundary challenge to design the next 3 stf's and let us vote them in!

Content should make the game exciting, right now we are building this stuff up in hope the future will be better, but if there is no tangible improvement the next level isnt going to be worth the grind. Small fleets I know of have just stopped progressing, they just have fun and dont worry about resources, and their disenchantment will eventually lead them away from STO if other games offer a more jovial environment. F2P is being used everywhere now and there will need to be more incentive to make games more fun, not tedious.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,329
# 53
07-09-2013, 02:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by shadowwraith77 View Post
One of the reasons it costs so much, is when it is maxed out it becomes a regular source of rich dilithium mining. Not to mention the fact that dilithium farmed from this mine can be refined beyond your daily cap!!!
Elite STF's are still far superior for Dilithium. FAR FAR FAR superior and do not COST anything but time. They generate EC and Dilithium.

I can already refine a bit over the limit and anyone with multiple characters can basically refine well over the limit.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 5,662
# 54
07-09-2013, 05:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hasukurobi View Post
Elite STF's are still far superior for Dilithium. FAR FAR FAR superior and do not COST anything but time. They generate EC and Dilithium.

I can already refine a bit over the limit and anyone with multiple characters can basically refine well over the limit.
Assuming that you actually like to do Elite STFs and don't run into horrid PUGs. Not everyone likes to run STFs so it is not a superior method for some people.
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 3,619
# 55
07-09-2013, 06:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by starkaos View Post
Assuming ...
Well do you actually know what is the Mining Daily? or are you assuming as well?

Since I can end such assumptions, I will ...

There are 3 dailys, ALL using that GOD AWFUL minigame, since I rather claw my eyes out that play that ... "thing", its 40 D at 0 points (I am not playing it), 5 nodes means 400 for 2 of then, the 3rd payed 96 at 0 with only 1 node meaning its 496 total.

Thats the minimum pay, thats not much now isnt? I can get far more then that without passing how many loading screens now? I counted at least 2 because apparently PUTTING OUT SHIP IN ORBIT is the highlight of the transwarp there from the Starbase instead of DIRECTLY TO THE GROUND MAP! but I am getting off the mark so ... I get more then that with a Ground Fleet Action, like Big Dig or KAGE.


Now if you are going to throw the whole "but you get more if you are good at that game" I will point out I get even more if I am good at the STFs, meaning those Mining Daily are nothing but a PUNISHMENT for some players.

Yes, I am not a happy camper because of that minigame ... be thankful I did it to show a point, that is the whole argument "it pays for itself in dilithium" is absolute NONSENSE since technically "The Adventures of Pluto Nash" at one point in time will turn a profit and this is exactly the same logic applied here.

Edit:

Further clarification, there are 2 Duty Officer Assignments, one gives a extra 500 Dilithium Refining and the other gives 500 Dilithium ... this is within the expected as they arent really substantial to justify the holding overall costs.

Last edited by f2pdrakron; 07-09-2013 at 06:15 PM.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 228
# 56
07-10-2013, 05:46 AM
Believe it or not, but i got a few guys in the fleet who actually enjoy that minigame, and challenge eachother each day to get the better score of the day (luck still has alot of influence it seems).

As for fleet holdings taking too long ... well ... it is something that is added to the game for people who like that.... if u hate it ... dont go there ...

I used to hate the ground stf's for over a year i have never even been able to complete the first parts of cure & infected , that is ... untill i got taken along with a group that had experience, and now i quite enjoy doing them, things change, not every thing added to the game is required to be like by 100% of the players.

Same goes for the players who have every single point they could set in space skills & gear, and the only time they even see their captain is when it is walking around a trade ship, or changing their ship, because u need to visit a shipyard for that.

What cryptic will try to do is create things that are hopefully enjoyed by the majority of the players,
Captain
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 3,465
# 57
07-10-2013, 05:53 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jivedutch View Post
As for fleet holdings taking too long ... well ... it is something that is added to the game for people who like that.... if u hate it ... dont go there ...
Ah the innocence of naivete...

It's so adorable isn't it?
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 5,662
# 58
07-10-2013, 07:03 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by f2pdrakron View Post
Well do you actually know what is the Mining Daily? or are you assuming as well?

Since I can end such assumptions, I will ...

There are 3 dailys, ALL using that GOD AWFUL minigame, since I rather claw my eyes out that play that ... "thing", its 40 D at 0 points (I am not playing it), 5 nodes means 400 for 2 of then, the 3rd payed 96 at 0 with only 1 node meaning its 496 total.

Thats the minimum pay, thats not much now isnt? I can get far more then that without passing how many loading screens now? I counted at least 2 because apparently PUTTING OUT SHIP IN ORBIT is the highlight of the transwarp there from the Starbase instead of DIRECTLY TO THE GROUND MAP! but I am getting off the mark so ... I get more then that with a Ground Fleet Action, like Big Dig or KAGE.


Now if you are going to throw the whole "but you get more if you are good at that game" I will point out I get even more if I am good at the STFs, meaning those Mining Daily are nothing but a PUNISHMENT for some players.

Yes, I am not a happy camper because of that minigame ... be thankful I did it to show a point, that is the whole argument "it pays for itself in dilithium" is absolute NONSENSE since technically "The Adventures of Pluto Nash" at one point in time will turn a profit and this is exactly the same logic applied here.

Edit:

Further clarification, there are 2 Duty Officer Assignments, one gives a extra 500 Dilithium Refining and the other gives 500 Dilithium ... this is within the expected as they arent really substantial to justify the holding overall costs.
Where did I actually say anything about the Mine Dailies? My whole post was based on the fact that STFs are not a superior source of dilithium for some people. There are people that hate the STFs 1000 times more than you hate the Dilithium minigame.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 757
# 59
07-10-2013, 09:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by therealsivar View Post
Simply because every fleet has those 2-5 guys (particularly in small fleets) who are the primary contributors to their fleet's base, they have made untold millions in total contributions made per character while everybody else is in the hundreds of thousands.

These people have bought all the gear that they're going to buy from the fleet stores, they cannot buy or sell the credits on the market, they cannot trade them to other characters, and they certainly don't earn interest on it. The credits just sit there useless.

Cryptic likely saw this and decided to create a sink to get some use out of the unused credits. Is it the best solution? No it isn't. Honestly I'd just as soon create some method of buying and selling credits (like converting them into bonus credit items to sell on the exchange) but they didn't ask me what I thought.
Pretty much this. I used to have near on 3mil in FC's and nothing to do with them. With embassy provisions and now the mine stuff I'm sitting on a pretty steady 1.6mil FCs (slowly rising again after dumping in all mining provision requirements for T1 mine).

If bigger fleets struggle with this part, good. Gives smaller fleets an advantage of some kind and larger ones some kind of restriction other than just time.

With the possibility of ally fleets happening and projects resource sharing, it'll give small and large fleets stuff they can trade/contribute the other lacks.
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Using - Bulwark, Voth Fighter. Favs - Fleet Corsair, Mogh, Bastion, Nicor, JHEC, JAS
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Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 228
# 60
07-11-2013, 03:50 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by starkaos View Post
Where did I actually say anything about the Mine Dailies? My whole post was based on the fact that STFs are not a superior source of dilithium for some people. There are people that hate the STFs 1000 times more than you hate the Dilithium minigame.
^^^^^^

Right there .... this is a game that has variety , and it keeps increasing on that as well with each upgrade they add to the game...

It is impossible to make new things that are enjoyed by 100% of the playerbase, and the priority for the devs to add to the game is stuff that makes most ppl happy, and adds to their income as well.

That aside, i do think there are some rather weird/annoying choices made on the whole holding system..
U pay dilithium to upgrade stuff, then u pay dilithium to provision stuff, then pay dilithium again to buy the stuff from the stores.

What i would like to see is some "dilithium bank" that a fleet can have, where ppl donate dil to and gain credits ... that can be used by the fleets project managers to fill projects with (already donated & locked to the fleet for projects).
I think it is abit much to have to pay over & over again all the time, and the provisions, yes ... could use some cutback merit on that ....
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