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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 136
Reputation passives, activated abilities, and equipment are all necessary for high-end gameplay. Leveling those reputations costs players nothing but time (as the only limiting factor is marks). But that time is not only gated by the number of daily runs needed to get the marks (unless you happen to be able to play specifically during the bonus mark event every day), but also by a 20 hour forced wait between projects as well.

As such, completing all three reputations to full on one character can be rewarding. However, once finished, being faced with the daunting task of doing it again on another character is a complete deterrent.

The release of the new Romulan Scimitar Dreadnaught pack made me realize this recently. I like the ship. I want the ship. I'm willing to purchase and pay 5000 zen for the ship, as well as the hundreds of thousands of dilithium needed to outfit it.... But I'm not willing to spend 4 hours each day grinding for the next 2-3 months to get the reputation needed to equip the ship.

The part I don't understand is... Cryptic should want to make money. We want Cryptic to make money as well, so the game can stay alive and active as long as possible. Cryptic makes their money off of Zen and Dilithium, neither of which is needed UNTIL AFTER the reputation system is completed (as space equipment costs a lot of dilithium, but nothing while leveling the reputation requires any).

So here I sit, as do many others.... with a Klingon... with a Romulan... with other Federation characters... with a wishlist of things to purchase using dilithium and Zen, with the only thing standing in my way of purchasing them in the form of a huge time sink.

I did it with one character. I won't do it again. And I can't help but wonder why an account-based reputation system isn't in place yet. Each player will still need to run STF's and other PvE activities to get the marks to purchase the items they need, and plenty of times.

There's money that people want to spend... money for Cryptic to make... if they'd just let us do it without all the frustration. Doing reputation once is enough.
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=93695767000&dateline=  1347284393
Lag Industries STO/TOR Guild
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 620
# 2
07-10-2013, 06:34 AM
+1 No arguments from me. I have a queue of characters but there is no way I'm going through the grind(s) on all of them.
Admiral Rednall
* Server Hamster attitude upgrade - Installed *
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,949
# 3
07-10-2013, 06:36 AM
In the grand scheme of things STO's end-game is about excessive grinding. Whether you grind the same handful of STF's 10,000 times or grind Rep missions 10,000 times it's still grinding. STO doesn't have enough varying content to make the grinding interesting - as opposed to other games which have the same mindless grinding but at least have 10 times more choices. That's really not going to change.

Ultimately, STO's going to need to be more like NWNs. It's going to need to use it's Foundry more intensely to earn people the various grinding currencies. At this point that's really the only way to get enough content into the game. I mean, look at all the KDF mission just added, done in less then 1 week. Look at all the Rom missions just added, done in a week. There's never going to be enough content that people can't do it 100 times faster then it's made. Thus they really need to expand the benefits of the Foundry.

Not that they don't need to add a ton of new end-game mission, just that no matter how many they add, they're still going to be played faster then they can be created.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 989
# 4
07-10-2013, 06:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by thecosmic1 View Post
In the grand scheme of things STO's end-game is about excessive grinding. Whether you grind the same handful of STF's 10,000 times or grind Rep missions 10,000 times it's still grinding. STO doesn't have enough varying content to make the grinding interesting - as opposed to other games which have the same mindless grinding but at least have 10 times more choices. That's really not going to change.

Ultimately, STO's going to need to be more like NWNs. It's going to need to use it's Foundry more intensely to earn people the various grinding currencies. At this point that's really the only way to get enough content into the game. I mean, look at all the KDF mission just added, done in less then 1 week. Look at all the Rom missions just added, done in a week. There's never going to be enough content that people can't do it 100 times faster then it's made. Thus they really need to expand the benefits of the Foundry.

Not that they don't need to add a ton of new end-game mission, just that no matter how many they add, they're still going to be played faster then they can be created.
This just highlights the dangers of releasing a game too early. People shout and scream, and stomp their feet trying to tell this to developers, but these teams are forced to work under deadlines imposed by people who only interested in a return on investment. I hope those empty suits see how the "hurry launch it now" mentality is extremely detrimental to the ability of a game to advance and grow.

Cryptic will always be playing catch up, unless and until they have a team and resources to rapidly expand development. I'm willing to bet that given the game's age and mediocre success (thanks in large part to the state of the game at launch), there's little motivation to do this.

Last edited by purplegamer; 07-10-2013 at 06:49 AM.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 620
# 5
07-10-2013, 07:19 AM
People say "grinding for 10000 toons is NOT fun" and as a response the dev say "we are proud to indroduce a new rep and hope there will be more in the future".

Scotty we have 10,000 tons of BS for transport
Commander
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 486
# 6
07-10-2013, 07:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by voxlagind View Post
Reputation passives, activated abilities, and equipment are all necessary for high-end gameplay. Leveling those reputations costs players nothing but time (as the only limiting factor is marks). But that time is not only gated by the number of daily runs needed to get the marks (unless you happen to be able to play specifically during the bonus mark event every day), but also by a 20 hour forced wait between projects as well.

As such, completing all three reputations to full on one character can be rewarding. However, once finished, being faced with the daunting task of doing it again on another character is a complete deterrent.

The release of the new Romulan Scimitar Dreadnaught pack made me realize this recently. I like the ship. I want the ship. I'm willing to purchase and pay 5000 zen for the ship, as well as the hundreds of thousands of dilithium needed to outfit it.... But I'm not willing to spend 4 hours each day grinding for the next 2-3 months to get the reputation needed to equip the ship.

The part I don't understand is... Cryptic should want to make money. We want Cryptic to make money as well, so the game can stay alive and active as long as possible. Cryptic makes their money off of Zen and Dilithium, neither of which is needed UNTIL AFTER the reputation system is completed (as space equipment costs a lot of dilithium, but nothing while leveling the reputation requires any).

So here I sit, as do many others.... with a Klingon... with a Romulan... with other Federation characters... with a wishlist of things to purchase using dilithium and Zen, with the only thing standing in my way of purchasing them in the form of a huge time sink.

I did it with one character. I won't do it again. And I can't help but wonder why an account-based reputation system isn't in place yet. Each player will still need to run STF's and other PvE activities to get the marks to purchase the items they need, and plenty of times.

There's money that people want to spend... money for Cryptic to make... if they'd just let us do it without all the frustration. Doing reputation once is enough.
^Totally agree with this Lag guy.

Cryptic you will lose money because of it because it is exactly how i feel as well.
Lieutenant
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 63
# 7
07-10-2013, 07:50 AM
+1 Reputation system turned away my friend from the game. Account based sounds like a fair thing to do.
Au contraire mon capiten! He's back!
Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 417
# 8
07-10-2013, 08:00 AM
I am most certainly not enjoying regrinding Reps on my Romulan, an account based system would be great.

And don't even get me started on the DOff grind...
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 62
# 9
07-10-2013, 08:01 AM
Repeated for emphasis:

I did it with one character. I won't do it again. And I can't help but wonder why an account-based reputation system isn't in place yet. Each player will still need to run STF's and other PvE activities to get the marks to purchase the items they need, and plenty of times.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 918
# 10
07-10-2013, 08:03 AM
Reputation should be made account wide.

Gear bought from the fleet and dilithium stores should be Account Bound.

They also need to make the currency account wide so it's much easier to use. One would think they could easily do this so that switching characters constantly to transfer things wouldn't be such a drag on the login servers resources.

Hands down no question, they need to do this in their next update really, they do.
I would like for the devs to open a poll/feedback thread on what exactly the players would like to see in the near future for the game.

Last edited by the1tigglet; 07-10-2013 at 08:10 AM.
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