Captain
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 3,530
# 11
09-10-2013, 10:21 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by thishorizon View Post
Wait what?

5 sec cd on stacking tac powers? When and why is this being implemented?
Not to tribble yet but most likely the next tribble build I would wager.
When the messenger comes to appropriate your profits ... kill the messenger.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,400
# 12
09-10-2013, 10:24 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjgrands420 View Post
mt tie knew exactly what he was doing, the kind of leet player thinking that has ruined this game for years " WE WILL SHOW THEM HOW BROKE IT IS"

Mini, dude. Come on man.

Don't be like the rest of the sheep, I don't always agree with you but you never acted like the rest of the sheep when it came to outside issues.

You and I both know, in our hearts, that there was never any intent to "show them how broke it is".


Everything has been done in the art of the kill, the vape and the need to protect your alpha and score kills outside of SNB cycles.




Hell man, he even made a thread offering 10 mil EC to any player who could vape his Sci/Recluse to show people that it can be defended against.

No one took him up on it, because none of them are able to find their big boy pants when the gauntlet is thrown down.


He also made a full thread on how to defend against the vape, people made up all manner of excuses.



We can't help it if people cry about it and the devs respond - and we're going to go right back to figuring out the next most efficient method for turning targets into respawn monkeys. I promise you this.

Lt. Commander
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 135
# 13
09-10-2013, 10:25 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by antoniosalieri View Post
Not to tribble yet but most likely the next tribble build I would wager.
lets kill this before it even hits tribble. at least the torps part. is ridiculous and completely makes no sense.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 135
# 14
09-10-2013, 10:28 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ussultimatum View Post
Mini, dude. Come on man.

Don't be like the rest of the sheep, I don't always agree with you but you never acted like the rest of the sheep when it came to outside issues.

You and I both know, in our hearts, that there was never any intent to "show them how broke it is".


Everything has been done in the art of the kill, the vape and the need to protect your alpha and score kills outside of SNB cycles.




Hell man, he even made a thread offering 10 mil EC to any player who could vape his Sci/Recluse to show people that it can be defended against.

No one took him up on it, because none of them are able to find their big boy pants when the gauntlet is thrown down.


He also made a full thread on how to defend against the vape, people made up all manner of excuses.



We can't help it if people cry about it and the devs respond - and we're going to go right back to figuring out the next most efficient method for turning targets into respawn monkeys. I promise you this.

you wotn be using torps then either, will you? all i know is mt tie says "YOUR WELCOME" after nerf. soudns like he expects gratitude for pushing the cheese to the extreme and doing whats unintended. the subnuke before the attack says it all. the lack of torpedoes in most winning builds speaks volumes.


oh where are thou hales and horizons and akfourtysevens, where are the legend of the torp.
Captain
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 3,530
# 15
09-10-2013, 10:29 AM
Well I like the change in theory....

I do agree it doesn't need to affect torpedo skills... however.....

I do understand that the devs like continuity, so likely if it comes in it will effect all skills.

Perhaps this is the point where we really really need to push them on a Torpedo change.


This is my idea to make Torpedos a viable... and widely used weapon type.

Implement a Sliding scale of Bleed through on shields with less then 30% of there cap.

So Anyone that has more then 30% of there facing will still resist 75% of the torpedo dmg as it is now.

At 28%... it would drop to 73
at 26%... it would drop to 70
at 24%... it would drop to 67
at 22%... it would drop to 64
at 20%... it would drop to 60
at 18%... it would drop to 56
at 16%... it would drop to 52
at 14%... it would drop to 48
at 12%... it would drop to 44
at 10%... it would drop to 40
at 8%... it would drop to 35
at 6%... it would drop to 30
at 4%... it would drop to 25
at 2%... it would drop to 20

Something along those lines... meaning that battering a shield facing down and unloading torps will always do something useful... if a cruiser can keep there facing at the 20% mark it won't be a bunch of one shots... but it sure would make torpedos a lot more attractive. It would also mean people would be much less upset about not being able to back to back HY and Spread patterns anymore.
When the messenger comes to appropriate your profits ... kill the messenger.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,400
# 16
09-10-2013, 10:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjgrands420 View Post
you wotn be using torps then either, will you? all i know is mt tie says "YOUR WELCOME" after nerf. soudns like he expects gratitude for pushing the cheese to the extreme and doing whats unintended. the subnuke before the attack says it all. the lack of torpedoes in most winning builds speaks volumes.

He was Joking.

Next time you go extracurricular man please turn on some Bob Marley or Jimmy Cliff.

Take a look at some other threads going on, we all see the nerf for what it is.



Quote:
Originally Posted by jjgrands420 View Post
you wotn be using torps then either, will you?
It depends. If I can get consistent, clean, kills with it and a high ratio of success on decloak alphas - yes, I will.

Captain
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,167
# 17
09-10-2013, 10:53 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by antoniosalieri View Post
Well I like the change in theory....

I do agree it doesn't need to affect torpedo skills... however.....

I do understand that the devs like continuity, so likely if it comes in it will effect all skills.

Perhaps this is the point where we really really need to push them on a Torpedo change.


This is my idea to make Torpedos a viable... and widely used weapon type.

Implement a Sliding scale of Bleed through on shields with less then 30% of there cap.

So Anyone that has more then 30% of there facing will still resist 75% of the torpedo dmg as it is now.

At 28%... it would drop to 73
at 26%... it would drop to 70
at 24%... it would drop to 67
at 22%... it would drop to 64
at 20%... it would drop to 60
at 18%... it would drop to 56
at 16%... it would drop to 52
at 14%... it would drop to 48
at 12%... it would drop to 44
at 10%... it would drop to 40
at 8%... it would drop to 35
at 6%... it would drop to 30
at 4%... it would drop to 25
at 2%... it would drop to 20

Something along those lines... meaning that battering a shield facing down and unloading torps will always do something useful... if a cruiser can keep there facing at the 20% mark it won't be a bunch of one shots... but it sure would make torpedos a lot more attractive. It would also mean people would be much less upset about not being able to back to back HY and Spread patterns anymore.
This^^

I'm sure number will need to be tweaked, but something like this is what the game needs. If you watch the old promo videos for STO they talk about taking down the shields then finishing off with torpedoes. This, however can never happen when 1% shields can block 75% damage.

I'm sure when these changes will suck for high end PvP, but hawk said, if people become unkillable they would look at healing and resists. This could be a good thing. Once it goes live, then finally we can start to talk about over healing. Really, it gets old stripping someone's shields, getting their hull to 10%, then having them instantly get 100% hull and shields back.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 135
# 18
09-10-2013, 10:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ussultimatum View Post
He was Joking.

Next time you go extracurricular man please turn on some Bob Marley or Jimmy Cliff.

Take a look at some other threads going on, we all see the nerf for what it is.





It depends. If I can get consistent, clean, kills with it and a high ratio of success on decloak alphas - yes, I will.
its sad cus man i wtf pwn with new doff and torps. the doff pen stack was what was running my show, and it was hard to do solo but pandas could make it happen every time id wager. mt didnt know torps also gained the pen, all fire on target does. This change wont affect premades multiple (seperate players) proc initiating for overpen (more damage to hull than given to shield).

i always had a high ration of success with torpedoes. in controlled circumstances. Thats what premades are good at. Torpedoes are and have always been simply more challenging to effectively implement. Doesn't mean it cant be done, few targets DEMANDED it. And certainly no situation within a team game that succesfully managed their approach demanded it. I did what mt did AND used torps, when it worked i put much more damage out in one pass.

Its about easy button and hard button. There was a time no one wanted to use beam overload cus of miss rate, when they committed to the tractor/ timing window they found success. Now you dont even need that. Im getting one shotted in my brel/tvaro at 10k from mts bo1 autofire the second i fire the first torp. This is about acc rom boffs and decloak bonus. The "gimmick" of double tap is and always was part of the game, many skills make more sense with the mechanic and barely any at all without it.

Without an in depth understanding of the many relevant factors, primarily of what it means to have certain buffs on and what it means to not, the devs simply fail to comprehend the complexity relevant and swing a wild nerf hammer, often creating more collateral damage than good.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,522
# 19
09-10-2013, 11:08 AM
double and triple taps were an exploit to a loophole, period. did premade meta call for spike that strong? yes, but thats not the point. how many 5 second lock outs are there now on things? phasers, SS, elatchi weapons, placate lockouts, proc heal lockouts, its all necessary steps because without them a mechanic would run amok.

at first i thought applying a lockout to torp skills to was like kicking an old diabetic dog, but actually it removes an argument against a massive torp 'buff', that you could stack HY and spreads on someone, so if torpedoes were buffed a triple tap HY would be a guarantied kill no mater what.

now, they can remove the 75% base resistance shields have to knetic damage, which is over 80% most of the time actually, and if your energy res is caped, at about 90%. without that built in res, shields would resist knetic damage at the same level it resists energy damage, so in the 40 to 75 range. this game is correct, when it feels like not running torps is a bad idea on everything, imo. id love for there to be a day when a 2 to 4 torps are worth the weapon slots they would take on a beam array cruiser.
gateway links-->Norvo Tigan, Telis Latto Ruwon, Sochie Heim, Solana Soleus
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,059
# 20
09-10-2013, 11:15 AM
ah yes.... oh how i love those torp kills.....

when you pop someone with a torp hit...it means you really got your timing down.

here recently on my defiant and bop builds i have had good success with 1 bo, crf, and a high yeild. while still running dem or a well timed "old school" style weapons battery.

its still my favorite way to fly a fighter in STO.

yet will all the insane passive shield regen out there thanks to rep passives and the like....those kills have long lost their way in consistent effectiveness. on top of just plain old res bonuses on someone running fleet elite shields and being hardened by someone on my side of the table firing off the same type of energy weapon while im trying to decloak pop.

which is why i am fully against any kind of change like this. i seem to survive just fine against double tappers in my sci and engineer builds. sure...you will get hurt often, but isnt that the name of the game? and with only a handfull of tacs in the game that can pull off this kind of playstyle with close to 75% effectiveness....whats the problem?

i see this kind of change just pushing further towards....OMG ha ha you tried to kill me with that? im a fed cruiser! and ill kirk all over you!


all in all....stacked spike damage is needed in the game right now to combat insanity healing......the time of the DHC CRF grind kills has long passesd us.....with this change it will further reduce a tac officers options of how to get off a kill shot without a friendly sci nuking the target first...

it really....well.... takes both burst and grind damage off the table for tacs....so....what would they be left with?

have fun kill bad guys

-thrusters on full-
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