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Ensign
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 23
# 411
09-12-2013, 08:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by spacefortress View Post
All it takes is 1 second to kill a player, leaving bop players a free 4 seconds to smoke their victory cigar

With the amount of bleedthrough doffs (BO stacking) and criticals ...it is now possible to kill a player with 75% shield resistence no matter if you have TSS + TT + RSP or eptS all working together, since a specially equipped bop or romulan spiker can shoot through that tough shield exterior without blanching with ease.... granted it requires timing and precision for a bop spiker but then again it requires defending players an equal amount of ...say 10 shield buffs and heal buffs to defend a op spike dmg attack in a single second....

oh wait ...that's right it doesn't work anymore since bleedthrough is so bad..that those spikers will penetrate your heavily defended shields regardless..... take it from me, having over 10 defensive buffs readily when minimax used his spike on me....well it was a surprise when his attack ignored my shields and popped my 60k hull boat inside a second despite the fact i had rsp III + TSS II + TT II + and Rotate shield frequency with high auxiliary power active...much to my disgust
where are your neutroniums, hazards, a2s, ph, jump console, a2d, evasives, jam sensors etc. etc.

a2s is a major life saver
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 136
# 412
09-12-2013, 08:53 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by lake1771 View Post
yea because shield res is the only res we have in the game. right?

**facepalm
Well if that is your attitude then why did people scream about the time when feedback pulse ignored your shields resistence and shielding in general?

Alot of people protested for a good reason LOL ...

the same thing is kinda happening here you know...

If your not still aware, there must be over 10 different kinds of space disruptor weapons in this game by now.... the majority, all focused on shield penetration...interesting trend don't you think?

The point I'm trying to say, is that double taps are not the only problems with bop spikers....the main problem is that there is too MUCH shield penetrating weapons, especially combined with the combo of doff penetration abilities that will melt a 60k hull without even damaging the shields of that defending ship
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 136
# 413
09-12-2013, 08:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by galilleos View Post
where are your neutroniums, hazards, a2s, ph, jump console, a2d, evasives, jam sensors etc. etc.

a2s is a major life saver
*sigh* If you must know I was using 3 fleet neutroniums with the turn rate modifier with HE, brace for impact, subspace field modulator and i went full impulse to get the most out of speed defense % modifier...


The trouble is you are going to get higher shield resistence than hull resistence and since a decent alpha spiker these days can pretty much ignore your shields....and you can only cap around 50% hull resistence compared to the 75% shield resistence...well you do the math!

The bop can spike ya for 60k hull dmg without a single hit to shields ....a shocker I know


Now don't get me wrong, there needs to be a subtle balance in this game where its possible to kill players regarded as impenetrable (truth is nothing is impenetrable...just requires skill and patience) and players that have just 'enough' juice to kill but not be considered too overpowered!!!

What I think bops should be doing is trying to get past my shields and kill me....not the other way around otherwise, what is the point of having shields in this game if they don't work to protect you from someone that has focused on max shield penetrating and criticals ....

We might as well be playing Battlestar Galactica Online

Last edited by spacefortress; 09-12-2013 at 09:10 AM.
Captain
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 12,429
# 414
09-12-2013, 09:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by spacefortress View Post
subspace field modulator
What flavor of weapons did Mini hit you with...?
Ensign
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 23
# 415
09-12-2013, 09:09 AM
then use sci control, stop always depending on heals and resists, if you were a sci cap or had a sci team m8 then that wouldnt of happened.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 136
# 416
09-12-2013, 09:12 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by virusdancer View Post
What flavor of weapons did Mini hit you with...?
I can give you one guess

Green as the hulk!


btw I enjoy getting my ass blown up by mini I find it hilarious but cryptic's power creeps are delving deep into weapons that is making gameplay unbearable

Last edited by spacefortress; 09-12-2013 at 09:17 AM.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 135
# 417
09-12-2013, 09:49 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by spacefortress View Post
I can give you one guess

Green as the hulk!


btw I enjoy getting my ass blown up by mini I find it hilarious but cryptic's power creeps are delving deep into weapons that is making gameplay unbearable
cheers vang, few have played the other side as often and well as you. your accurate summation of the situation makes me smile. the new doff that bypassed shields gave teeth to my spike even if i attacked at the "wrong time"

against the vangs renims and lacus of the world spike never has had 100% success rate when generated from a single ship. even psw doesnt guarantee a kill.


vang and others know it isnt that luck shot vape thats the problem, its that u dont even need to be lucky or good anymore. the style itself was fine, the boosts/new doff/rep pushed it into questionable territory.


and the fact that minmax died so easy from heavy spec and boff inveztment made instant death easier to swallow. now zombie rom rolls thru one shots and is 15 k away in a blink.


not a thing to do with marion or double tap, which vang has been surviving for months (mostly)

ggs and i take back 99% of bad i said about u :-)
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,400
# 418
09-12-2013, 09:50 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by galilleos View Post
then use sci control, stop always depending on heals and resists, if you were a sci cap or had a sci team m8 then that wouldnt of happened.

Gali some people hope the game eventually lets them have permanent RSP uptime.

100% RSP.

Remove SNB.

Remove APA.


Basically anything that kills their ship is too strong.

Captain
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 1,003
# 419
09-12-2013, 09:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by spacefortress View Post
All it takes is 1 second to kill a player, leaving bop players a free 4 seconds to smoke their victory cigar

With the amount of bleedthrough doffs (BO stacking) and criticals ...it is now possible to kill a player with 75% shield resistence no matter if you have TSS + TT + RSP or eptS all working together, since a specially equipped bop or romulan spiker can shoot through that tough shield exterior without blanching with ease.... granted it requires timing and precision for a bop spiker but then again it requires defending players an equal amount of ...say 10 shield buffs and heal buffs to defend a op spike dmg attack in a single second....
What you are describing is a once in a blue moon lucky shot. For shots to bypass shields like that you will need have the planets lining up correctly all at once. The Elachi weapons have a 2.5% chance of doing 100% shield bypass for that particular shot in question, after that, there is 5 seconds internal CD. Not only that, you will need to be extremely unlucky for that one single shot to be a Beam Overload as opposed to a regular non-buff shot. Needless to say, it is highly improbable considering every shot has a chance of missing their target based on your defense value. On average, 30% of shots will miss, possibly higher depending on your build and skills. Even then, it is only that on single shot that will go through the shields, nothing else. A single Beam Overload should be insufficient to kill a player outright unless the target is a BoP, even if it crits. With the resistance that most PvPers have, it's rare to see any single crit that goes any higher than 45K. Sure some people like to boast about some 100K numbers, don't put much stock into that, that's highly unlikely against well spec PvPers. Furthermore, even a Romulan specializing in crit will have about 20% critical chance. So you do 2.5% X 70 % X 20% => approximately 0.35% chance of a super lucky critical Beam Overload from Elachi weapon assuming a shot from a Romulan with corresponding Boffs. For a Federation or Klingon without those Boffs, the probability will be even much lower.

Quote:
oh wait ...that's right it doesn't work anymore since bleedthrough is so bad..that those spikers will penetrate your heavily defended shields regardless..... take it from me, having over 10 defensive buffs readily when minimax used his spike on me....well it was a surprise when his attack ignored my shields and popped my 60k hull boat inside a second despite the fact i had rsp III + TSS II + TT II + and Rotate shield frequency with high auxiliary power active...much to my disgust
I spoke to Mini last night, he is still understandably quite upset with the BO nerf. There is one thing he said that needs to be repeated here because it is true - he is far from the worst abuser of the BO exploit. He may have invented the technique but it's some of those who copied him after that made builds entirely around it that wreck the boat. Mini actually tries to fight people, as opposed to ding them with a disgusting kaboom. That's part of the reason why he dies a lot. Once you get used to his tactics, which there aren't many variations, you get used to his ambushes in Kerrat. What's harder to evade is when you are in an Arena PvP and chaos everywhere, a cloaked T'Varo will snipe you first with BO I + 3 X BO doffs that give additional shield penetration for 4 sec at about 66% of the time, then immediately follow by HY Torpedos and a BO III. Not sure how anyone can survive that. Unlike the once in a blue moon occurrence described above, the BO double tap + 3 X BO doffs will kill any ship with a minimum of 66% of probability even without any critical hits, possibly higher because with so much burst, the BO doff proc may become redundant regardless. This kind of example is why there is not a shadow of doubt that the double tap is an exploit from top to bottom. With all the chaos that's going around you in an Arena PvP, it is not possible for a person to be able to watch out for a sniper like that, unlike in Kerrat.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,400
# 420
09-12-2013, 10:02 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by iskandus View Post
What's harder to evade is when you are in an Arena PvP and chaos everywhere,...With all the chaos that's going around you in an Arena PvP, it is not possible for a person to be able to watch out for a sniper like that,...

There are these things called "team mates".

They help keep you alive.


They watch out for decloakers.


I know this because I have them, and when we test our decloak builds on each other in 5v5 inter-fleet battles, there are ways to defend against the tactic, and ways to punish the opposing team or the decloaker.

So apparently we are doing something that is actually, truly, impossible?

Or is it just impossible for you?

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