Captain
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 13,674
# 21
09-12-2013, 07:13 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by z3ndor99 View Post
Which i didn't ( derp ).
No derp at all...like drow said, that could easily be read any sort of ways. The sigh wasn't to you...I'll edit my post to clear that up.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,161
# 22
09-12-2013, 07:18 AM
Hey that's ok virus just need to read and absorb info before i type! Anyway disruptors ( nanite, romulan and the rest ) are my main choice for my rommie.
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 13,592
# 23
09-12-2013, 07:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by khayuung View Post
Considering I saw Romulan Plasma and Elachi Immunity debuffs at once, I think the Elachi weapon immunity only applies to other Elachi weapons and therefore my plasma could land.
AFAIK that's what Bort meant. IIRC, He drew a comparison with the way the Phaser subsystem offline proc works.
HAIL HYDRA!

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Republic Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,451
# 24
09-12-2013, 08:29 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by z3ndor99 View Post
Yeah there was a thread the other day about the elachi weapons, someone asked how the proc works and, borticus explained that's how they work ( yeah not great huh ).
Makes my Idea of just using the single crescent cannon with elite disruptors even better.
Cryptic Studios Team
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,339
# 25
09-12-2013, 09:30 AM
Yeah, let's just clear this up so everyone's absolutely certain...

Elachi Procs only provide a 5-second lockout for other Elachi weapon procs. They have no effect on Plasma, Phaser, Tetryon, or anything else.

Phasers work the same way - being hit with a Phaser proc makes you immune to additional procs from Phasers for 5 seconds. Other weapon type procs are unaffected.

As for the original question: All disruptor debuffs stack, if they are duration-based. But keep in mind that they are a Resistance Rating debuff, so diminishing returns apply. You won't always get the same value of debuff from your proc.
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Jeremy Randall
Cryptic - Systems Design
"Play smart!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by Me
Kurland here...
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,919
# 26
09-12-2013, 09:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by borticuscryptic View Post
Yeah, let's just clear this up so everyone's absolutely certain...

Elachi Procs only provide a 5-second lockout for other Elachi weapon procs. They have no effect on Plasma, Phaser, Tetryon, or anything else.

Phasers work the same way - being hit with a Phaser proc makes you immune to additional procs from Phasers for 5 seconds. Other weapon type procs are unaffected.

As for the original question: All disruptor debuffs stack, if they are duration-based. But keep in mind that they are a Resistance Rating debuff, so diminishing returns apply. You won't always get the same value of debuff from your proc.
I've noticed how it works on an alt sci I have that uses a quad disruptor, elachi dhc, nanite disruptor dc and 3 polarized disruptor turrets on a kamarag with energy siphon build.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 3,598
# 27
09-12-2013, 10:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by borticuscryptic View Post
Yeah, let's just clear this up so everyone's absolutely certain...

Elachi Procs only provide a 5-second lockout for other Elachi weapon procs. They have no effect on Plasma, Phaser, Tetryon, or anything else.

Phasers work the same way - being hit with a Phaser proc makes you immune to additional procs from Phasers for 5 seconds. Other weapon type procs are unaffected.

As for the original question: All disruptor debuffs stack, if they are duration-based. But keep in mind that they are a Resistance Rating debuff, so diminishing returns apply. You won't always get the same value of debuff from your proc.

Thanks for the prompt clarification.

And please sing the Benny Hill tune to Taco for me.
Captain
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 13,674
# 28
09-12-2013, 10:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by borticuscryptic View Post
As for the original question: All disruptor debuffs stack, if they are duration-based. But keep in mind that they are a Resistance Rating debuff, so diminishing returns apply. You won't always get the same value of debuff from your proc.
Isn't it the inverse of that, though? Increasing returns rather than diminishing returns?

Doesn't the new DR/DRR affect subsequent debuffs?

(fictitious numbers)

Base DRR of 40 and DR of 28.3%
Hit by a -10 DRR debuff...resisted...-7.17 DRR debuff applied.
New DRR of 32.83 and DR of 24.5%
Hit by a -10 DRR debuff...resisted...-7.55 DRR debuff applied.
New DRR of 25.28 and DR of 20.1%
Hit by a -10 DRR debuff...resisted...-7.99 DRR debuff applied.
New DRR of 17.29 and DR of 14.7%

The first debuff reducing DR by 3.8%...
The second debuff reducing DR by 4.4%...
The third debuff reducing the DR by 5.4%...

So when one considers all the possible DR debuffs...it could get pretty heinous? It's tough, because we've only got the positive DRR/DRM formula. So can't really tell what happens to the damage - is it a case of ignoring the negative and treating it as a buff to damage?

Like the DRR of 40 above being DR of 28.3%...would a DRR of -40 be +28.3% damage instead of -28.3% damage? Thus maintaining diminishing returns? Or is it something else entirely?

If so, would that also apply to the DRR debuffs? That at a certain point, the stacked debuffs would no longer be resisted...but actually buffed?
Cryptic Studios Team
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,339
# 29
09-12-2013, 10:24 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by virusdancer View Post
Isn't it the inverse of that, though? Increasing returns rather than diminishing returns?

Doesn't the new DR/DRR affect subsequent debuffs?

(MATH)
This is partially right.

The fact that it ... well, for lack of a better term (and lack of coffee allowing me to think of one), anti-diminishes? That part is accurate.

If you apply a -10 DRR to a target that has 100 DRR, the effects are less noticed than they are on a target that only has 10 DRR. Because it diminishes upwards, only.

But that also means that, against that same target with 100 DRR, a second proc calculates to a larger effect than the first. The difference between 100 and 90 is less than the difference between 90 and 80. Again, because of the diminishing scale.

So, that much is right.

But we recently introduced a fix that made Disruptor Procs no longer affect themselves. So each subsequent proc no longer becomes more powerful than the previous one in terms of base magnitude. The amount of -DRR applied with each proc should be uniform now.

Oh... I'm not sure if that change has gone live yet, now that I think about it.
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Jeremy Randall
Cryptic - Systems Design
"Play smart!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by Me
Kurland here...
Captain
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 13,674
# 30
09-12-2013, 11:14 AM
Here's an example of what I meant about DRR going negative.

[Combat (Self)] Your Destabilized Plasma Torpedo deals 113031 (51321) Kinetic Damage to Tactical Cube.

That's ~220% damage...because of stacked debuffs.

The (X) number's within that typical range for the listed damage of 54.7k for the Beach Ball.
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