Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 387
# 111
09-15-2013, 01:30 PM
Jeez, @reyan01 you know that you play MMO and it means that you do 'raids' as a team, organized team, not as 5 individuals doing same mission at the same time. So yes STF's (all, not only Hive) should be almost unbeatable for PUGs. You don't need 10k DPS to do it if you and your teammates know how/when/what to do and help each other.
Sorry for any mistakes, english isn't my primary language.

"Dear players we have for you new useless event and only-one-map-use-divices, and much more new "content", but we can't repair glitch in chat system which make mutes on private channels permament. So deal with it and give us your remaining money."
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 161
# 112
10-09-2013, 08:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dkratasco View Post
Jeez, @reyan01 you know that you play MMO and it means that you do 'raids' as a team, organized team, not as 5 individuals doing same mission at the same time. So yes STF's (all, not only Hive) should be almost unbeatable for PUGs. You don't need 10k DPS to do it if you and your teammates know how/when/what to do and help each other.
While I agree that endgame content, aka elite STFs in STO, should be hard, and random groups with clueless players shouldn't be able to complete them without problems - I would never ever compare STFs with a proper raid.
Hell, it's even less content than one normal dungeon. It's basically one boss encounter with some trash. So let's not exaggerate. It's a grindfest. One completion is nothing.

Anyway, I'm puzzled as to how many players here find it difficult to acknowledge a problem when there is one - even if they are not affected.
A bug is a bug. It doesn't matter if you encounter it or not. Bugs are there to be fixed.
Lances hitting cloaked ships is a bug. Lances hitting outside their range is a bug. Etc.
If someone really and seriously wants to object this, he should be ignored and treated as the ignorant troll that he is.

Regarding the 'challenge' - creating or supporting artificial challenges that consist of not fixing defects is about as stupid as it gets.
If your group is fast enough, it's no additional challenge. If it's not, the additional challenge is disproportionate. Where's the middle ground? I rather get the impression some people like to feel elitist. Which is rather pathetic tbh.
There are enough ways to make STFs more challenging. Blatant bugs shouldn't be among them.

Apart from that this game surely doesn't need anymore incentives to min-max dps, fly escorts and kill fast. Yeah, even if you did it with carriers and a dread, most players will try to solve the 'kill unimatrixes before they bug' task with escorts and other dps oriented ships. Tough luck for anything else.

Imho STFs need more content, more duration and more tasks for specific roles. The amount of coordination and communication required for this endgame content is laughable.
To make this (creating/balancing) process possible, I think the devs should consider slashing most bonuses in half and get rid of massive stacking. Otherwise they'll find it difficult finding a middle ground for PvE or achieving balance in PvP with this min-max fest.

Last edited by arcjet; 10-09-2013 at 08:58 AM.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,763
# 113
10-09-2013, 09:09 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by arcjet View Post
Anyway, I'm puzzled as to how many players here find it difficult to acknowledge a problem when there is one - even if they are not affected.
A bug is a bug. It doesn't matter if you encounter it or not. Bugs are there to be fixed.
QFT.


Watch out, the Cryptic-Can-Do-No-Wrong fanbois will crucify you for speaking such truth!
Captain
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 2,425
# 114
10-09-2013, 07:46 PM
Still broken, coming up on 6 months since LoR. It is pretty sad.
Ensign
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 9
# 115
12-26-2013, 06:22 PM
Still broken, Lances now fire on you while within 5K of the queen, and both unimatrix' crap out unending probes while waiting to respawn. you have a field of probes you cant get thru and then the lancing begins. This doesnt count the bajillion plasma charges that spam you constantly.

This is on normal sadly.....
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,997
# 116
12-26-2013, 07:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by arcjet View Post
While I agree that endgame content, aka elite STFs in STO, should be hard, and random groups with clueless players shouldn't be able to complete them without problems - I would never ever compare STFs with a proper raid.
Hell, it's even less content than one normal dungeon. It's basically one boss encounter with some trash. So let's not exaggerate. It's a grindfest. One completion is nothing.

Anyway, I'm puzzled as to how many players here find it difficult to acknowledge a problem when there is one - even if they are not affected.
A bug is a bug. It doesn't matter if you encounter it or not. Bugs are there to be fixed.
Lances hitting cloaked ships is a bug. Lances hitting outside their range is a bug. Etc.
If someone really and seriously wants to object this, he should be ignored and treated as the ignorant troll that he is.

Regarding the 'challenge' - creating or supporting artificial challenges that consist of not fixing defects is about as stupid as it gets.
If your group is fast enough, it's no additional challenge. If it's not, the additional challenge is disproportionate. Where's the middle ground? I rather get the impression some people like to feel elitist. Which is rather pathetic tbh.
There are enough ways to make STFs more challenging. Blatant bugs shouldn't be among them.

Apart from that this game surely doesn't need anymore incentives to min-max dps, fly escorts and kill fast. Yeah, even if you did it with carriers and a dread, most players will try to solve the 'kill unimatrixes before they bug' task with escorts and other dps oriented ships. Tough luck for anything else.

Imho STFs need more content, more duration and more tasks for specific roles. The amount of coordination and communication required for this endgame content is laughable.
To make this (creating/balancing) process possible, I think the devs should consider slashing most bonuses in half and get rid of massive stacking. Otherwise they'll find it difficult finding a middle ground for PvE or achieving balance in PvP with this min-max fest.
Once upon many years ago, STF's WERE a lot more like what you describe-there were only three (well, four if you count Terradome), they actually had story content, etc.

Back upon those many storied years ago, there was "Infected", "Khitomer" and "Cure"-the ground and space missions were a single run, you had to do both to finish it, and it took more than five minutes.

But it was inconvenient to the mass of players, and they demanded the separation from having to endure Ground content, and so the STF's were divided into space, and ground, and if you wanted all the KHG armor, or MACO armor, or all the space equipment, you had to run everything, because you could not GET a full load of STF gear unless you DID.

But the players did wail and weep and moan, and the Developers heard their plaintive cries, and eventually, right around season 7, they made another change, and the Rep system was born. Now, players could run Infected space over and over and over and over and over and over and over andoveraandoverandoverandover without having to go do ground, and get everything.

But the players wailed at the cost, so the Devs made it cheaper-not by lowering the costs, but by making the NPC's softer, less capable. And some players they did bemoan the loss of that thing called 'challenge'...

so the Devs cooked up Hive.

In HIVE, specifically the space variant, they granted the NPC's a new thing-they would use Science Powers, like players did, instead of just relying on one-shot weapons and rickockulous levels of hit points. and IN TRIBBLE, it was GOOD.


This lasted about two weeks in Holodeck. People bitched and moaned because they couldn't faceroll Hive Space with five TacScorts. So, the Devs responded. They dumbed the AI down, and amped up the oneshot Kills, hit points, and shields to "Keep it competitive' while enabling teams with no sci (which in Tribble during testing was the difference between success and failure) to actually get past stage two.


Code gets broken when you futz too much with it, and between the time it was intro'ed in Tribble, and now, it's been reworked a half dozen or more times based on feedback from players, and that is why it's broken today.
"when you're out of Birds of Prey, you're out of ships."

Look into Vanilla PvP if you're tired of the endless pursuit of grind, utterly unbalanced selections of geardo-inspired traits, and generally unbalanced and careless 'development' made mostly to turn this game into a second job.
Career Officer
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 32
# 117 bottom line
12-28-2013, 09:50 AM
Hive? I tried that once, happy that I did, probably will never do it again.

You know why everyone runs infected conduit? Because it's fun, it's quick, it will most likely NOT frustrate you like Hive does.

I'd be more willing if it was overhauled, but both space and ground are way too ehhhhhh more me. I spend more time pulling my own hair out of my head in frustration that killing borgs.
Captain
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 5,157
# 118
12-28-2013, 10:01 AM
Hive elite needs a buff...ez mode.

I went in there expecting real content...my team tore through it like infected
Chive on and prosper, eh?

My PvE/PvP hybrid skill tree
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 841
# 119
12-28-2013, 11:17 AM
Agreed that hive on normal is way too dependant on dps. If you don't take down one of the unimatrix ships on the first attempt, the mission is a bust. However, it is possible to survive 1 lance. 2 is impossible. My galaxy retro can handle being hit by 1. The biggest problem I think is the number of probes that spawn, and the fact that, even once you're within 5k of the queens octahedron, you still get lanced. I can understand elite being this hard, but not normal.
Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,438
# 120
12-28-2013, 11:42 AM
Going by the posts here there is no point of even trying tp get the optional for my rommy char great work cyptic a other fine mess u got us in to
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