Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 215
# 41
10-14-2013, 10:41 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by nicha0 View Post
Isn't there a 20 mark completion bonus on this though?

Defera runs are better FM Farming if you get enough alts
first no they changed that a while back. you get the bonus after waves not at the end. all you get at the end is a tiny reward.

yes Defera is much better for FM farming...
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,247
# 42
10-14-2013, 10:43 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by paulyman View Post
first no they changed that a while back. you get the bonus after waves not at the end. all you get at the end is a tiny reward.

yes Defera is much better for FM farming...
NWS for Fleet Marks is the absolute best
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Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,502
# 43
10-14-2013, 11:23 AM
Yeah, I got all my siege ship accolades now on my accolade toon, but I never left a PUG as it's just rude... Well, I warped out once, but only because I happened to come out of red alert and the remaining ships had no way to fail killing the last couple smaller ships, was a matter of seconds, so I said to myself, "what the hell, might as well go... ".

I don't know how complicated it would be to change the random number generator a bit.

Only spawn siege ships that are missing on SOMEBODY's accolade list.

If only 2 different ships out of 15 or whatever are missing on all accolade lists on the map only one of those 2 can spawn.

That way it would be certain at least one player can score at the end and leaving early would most definitive screw one player over.

Only once ALL 5 players have completed their list it goes back to totally random again.

How about that? Too easy to complete everything that way?
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 382
# 44
10-14-2013, 01:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by timelord79 View Post
Only spawn siege ships that are missing on SOMEBODY's accolade list.

If only 2 different ships out of 15 or whatever are missing on all accolade lists on the map only one of those 2 can spawn.

That way it would be certain at least one player can score at the end and leaving early would most definitive screw one player over.

Only once ALL 5 players have completed their list it goes back to totally random again.

How about that? Too easy to complete everything that way?

5 people all wanting different capital ships and/or from different races...yeah I think that would require way too much effort. The concept of random generating is really only there to make people replay it, annoy those trying to get them and those affected by those trying to get them.


2 problems; fm farming and accolade hunting.

Solution: They're better off just giving an accolade for completion and scale the reward so the final wave gives the most.

Can't really be simpler than that.
Kirk's Protege - 19/11/2012
Kirk's Protege Jr - 30/05/2014
[1/5 5:35] Vessel Two of Two Unimatrix 01 deals 964780 (1581938) Kinetic Damage(Critical) to you with Plasma Energy Bolt Explosion.
Captain
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 3,158
# 45
10-15-2013, 04:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by timelord79 View Post
Only spawn siege ships that are missing on SOMEBODY's accolade list.
Won't help. If it spawns a ship that isn't on ANYONE's list, and everyone buggers, no one moans. But, if it spawns a ship that isn't on *MY* list, assuming I was actually an accolade hunter, why should I get banned for your sake?

If this is really the primary cause of bailing, then here are a few solutions that will actually help.
1. Remove the ban penalty for actually completing the mission: Then the incentive to ditch is greatly reduced.
2. Increase the completion pay to justify the drawback of being banned for doing so: This will populate the mission with mark farmers instead of accolade hunters, who don't care what they're destroying, and don't care much if the odd accolade hunters bails because that guy was useless to him anyway.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,003
# 46
10-15-2013, 04:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by doffingcomrade View Post
Won't help. If it spawns a ship that isn't on ANYONE's list, and everyone buggers, no one moans. But, if it spawns a ship that isn't on *MY* list, assuming I was actually an accolade hunter, why should I get banned for your sake?

If this is really the primary cause of bailing, then here are a few solutions that will actually help.
1. Remove the ban penalty for actually completing the mission: Then the incentive to ditch is greatly reduced.
2. Increase the completion pay to justify the drawback of being banned for doing so: This will populate the mission with mark farmers instead of accolade hunters, who don't care what they're destroying, and don't care much if the odd accolade hunters bails because that guy was useless to him anyway.
Or, 3: Just hand people the marks upon completion, like in pretty much all other queued missions except for NWS. /solved.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 1,196
# 47
10-16-2013, 08:04 PM
The biggest issue is handing marks out on completion is that I have PUGed this before and wound up with 4 <lvl 10 players before, so you need to give round rewards because they just can't beat it.

The accolades thing is just badly implemented, people think Defera was a grind to get all the bosses, this is 10x worse because of all the races and complete inability to dictate what you fight.. If you do the math, to get the last ship on that accolade, how many races and ships are there? Makes STF grinding look weak.
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Captain
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 3,158
# 48
10-16-2013, 08:49 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by twam View Post
Or, 3: Just hand people the marks upon completion, like in pretty much all other queued missions except for NWS. /solved.
Accolade Hunters do not care about marks. Their "pay" is in the accolade received, and they already ARE getting paid on completion...if they get the right one.

The problem is that the pay in marks is very BAD, especially at the end, but even in general, and so the mission is apparently being frequented heavily by Accolade Hunters, who, of course, bail when they realize the mission they're in isn't going to pay them in anything but a ban. The solution would be to pair these people with Mark Farmers, who don't care which boss they get and don't care if some random mutant who was leeching their paycheck anyway bails.
Career Officer
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 446
# 49
10-17-2013, 02:16 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by reyan01 View Post
It happens MUCH too frequently, and is the result of a flawed system that awards points following the completion of each wave, but sadly only awards five or six fleet marks for completion of the Dreadnought stage. This ACTIVELY ENCOURAGES players to warp out so that they miss the cooldown on the mission and can queue for another instance where they can repeat the process.
No group-finder mission should ever reward someone for completing a stage -- the reward should always be at the end. While I don't always agree with a cooldown timer, or at least if there must be one, you should have the access to vote someone out of the group -- I do agree the rewards shouldn't be awarded until the very last bosskill.

Sadly, I don't believe this will be something PWE will fix until it begins to hit them in the pocketbook -- players stop playing because of it. As long as people are farming the fleetmarks this means that they are making money from the dil and ec that goes along with it, and they wouldn't dare change this.
Said NO to Arc. Gets punished by not being given a free outfit, free lobi, and free shuttle. Now forced to use Arc's site when trying to get to STO site. Still not rewards for beta testing the Arc website by force. Bravo Cryptic.
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 938
# 50
10-17-2013, 03:45 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by nicha0 View Post
The biggest issue is handing marks out on completion is that I have PUGed this before and wound up with 4 <lvl 10 players before, so you need to give round rewards because they just can't beat it.
They don't need to beat it, just finish it. The reward would be the same, it would still reward waves completed, but you'd have to be there at the end to get it. Dodge the cooldown, dodge the reward. That's the way the other fleet mark missions work.
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