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Captain
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 1,745
# 21
10-19-2013, 07:22 AM
Quote:
Looking around, I've personally been rather impressed by the performance of the Romulan Vendor Only supplied Plasma Repeater Pistol and the corresponding Plasma Piercing Beam Rifle which for some reason can only be obtained from a single NPC Vendor in the Romulan Command Center on New Romulus. To add insult to injury, these Common Only weapons only extend their Mk # up through IX. There are no Mk X, XI or Mk XII versions of these uniquely ROMULAN weapons (or if there are, I haven't found them yet).
Check the C-Store.

Edit: My mistake. Dilithium Store.

Last edited by questerius; 10-19-2013 at 07:26 AM.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,886
# 22
10-19-2013, 07:49 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by autumnturning View Post
If there are Tactical Captains who can get to 60% Critical Chance indefinitely then that would be a balance problem with Tactical Captains then, wouldn't it?

But just for the sake of humor value ... please explain, in detail (meaning, Show Your Work), how a Tactical Captain achieves a 60% Critical Chance before adding in Weapon, Armor or Personal Shield.
Base Critical chance (2.5%), Gambling Device (10%), Romulan Tier I Passive (3%), Combat Specialist (2.5%), Lucky (5%), Strike Team Specialist (7.5%), Advanced Targeting Armor (~14%), Strike Team II (3%), Target Optics (+5%), Team Ambush Field (2.5 - 10), Weapon Mod (2.5 - 7.5). The player would be able to reach a maximum of 70% Critical chance with Tactical buffs and 63% Critical chance without buffs. With your proposed armor, that Critical chance could easily jump up another 20%.

Quote:
Originally Posted by autumnturning View Post
Uh ... you do know that every Captain in the game has access to the Romulan Reputation system, right? Meaning that every faction in the game would have access to these items equally ... meaning you wouldn't need to be a Romulan (or Reman) race Captain in order to access them. In what way would that be "conveniently limited to Romulans" ...?

And just for the sake of argument, I have no problem with putting a limiter on how often the Ambush Cloak can proc, should it be necessary for game balance because Tactical Captains are as overpowered as you assert when it comes to Critical Chance. Something on the order of "Effect can only happen once every {X} seconds" on the Ambush Cloak, with values of 10 sec for Mk X, 8 sec for Mk XI and 6 sec for Mk XII perhaps ... should it PROVE necessary for game balance. Mind you, I'm just tossing out numbers here for illustration purposes, rather than as a demand or insistence that I'm "right" and everyone else is "wrong" somehow. I could just as easily go with 10/9/8 instead of 10/8/6 or some other variation for the progression of the "proc limiter" on the Ambush Cloak should it PROVE necessary for game balance.
You are asking for a "distinctly Romulan" set, which implied you wanted it for the Romulan faction only, my mistake.

Quote:
Originally Posted by autumnturning View Post
You say that as if Ground PvP isn't "ruined" already by Tactical Captains (much like they do to Space PvP too, but that's a whole other plate of Gagh).

Ah. So you're going to play the "I'm pulling rank on you!" card. Got it.
Tactical captains on the ground do not ruin ground PvP. Also, no, I'm saying that you need to play ground to understand the implications of adding the set pieces that you suggest.

Quote:
Originally Posted by autumnturning View Post
Excuse me. Did I *SAY* that my armor buff stacks 3 times? Let's look, shall we?

Hmmm. There appears to be a DISTINCT LACK of anything saying "stacks 3 times" there. That means that your ASSUMPTION that the buff would "stack 3 times" is just you imagining things (again!). Coincidence? At this point you have enough of a track record in this thread to suggest the answer is "No."

Indeed, even if you are correct in that "all the other set armors let their special stack 3 times" when their long form tooltips don't contain mention of that (and I LOOKED), then that sounds like a "bug" that ought to be corrected so that they don't stack and instead work as advertised ... wouldn't you agree?

For what it's worth, even if other armor buffs "stack 3 times" like you say, I was operating under the assumption that the buff on my proposed armor would only "stack ONCE" ... instead of 3 times ... as advertised. Is that a problem for you?

Furthermore, in order for the special effect buff to stack 3 times, you'd need to take damage (at least) 3 times in 6 seconds. Being hit by damage often enough to make the proc "likely" to stack 3 times within that span of time ought to be enough to kill you before the proc can stack 3 times. I mean, the odds of the proc happening 3 times in succession is literally 1000 to 1. How many times can you get hit by damage within a 6 second time span and not be killed? What are the odds that getting hit LESS THAN that many times will proc a 10% chance 3 times within that time span so that you can live long enough to use it?

In other words, I don't look at a 10% chance when receiving All Damage and immediately conclude "this will be triple stacked EASILY, IN PERPETUITY" like you apparently do.
All percent chance to apply buff stats on armor stack three times, they need to be balanced around that fact. Cryptic would never allow for a bonus +Critical chance stat on armor that already has +5% critical chance. Even if they did add a +Critical chance proc to armor, it would be a 10% chance to add +2.5% for 6 seconds, stacks 3 times for a total of +7.5% critical chance. Then in active combat, this proc activates very frequently. Players stay alive a lot longer than you would think in ground PvP, it's not hard at all to get 3 procs on the armor.

Quote:
Originally Posted by autumnturning View Post

So it's Tactical Captains who have ridiculously overpowered skills and need to be nerfed then so that they stop "ruining" Ground PvP for everyone else then ... yes?

By this point, the only thing I'm missing is a good reason to continue taking your complaints seriously.
No, Tactical officer skills are balanced around a cooldown. What you are proposing would create imbalance, as +100% all energy damage would be the same as giving someone an Ambush III with no cooldown. If Cryptic were ever to create such a proc, although unlikely, it would need a 30 second cooldown and stacking with ambush would need to be prohibited, as the proc would give players at least +250% all damage. There used to be a bug where tactical officers could kit switch to stack Ambush I, II, and III for basically 350% all damage instead of 150%. A proc with +100% damage would be starting to get close to that buggy level of damage again.
Captain
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 3,553
# 23
10-19-2013, 03:13 PM
Hm... well my only input on this would be if there was a Romulan ground set, I'd want there to be a Reman variant. Reman coloration, and more focus on stealth and damage output with a large sacrifice in durability. Or something like that.
It is said the best weapon is one that is never fired. I disagree. The best weapon is one you only have to fire... once.
Tired of Wasting EC and Time trying to get Superior Romulan Operative BOffs? Here's a cheap and easy way to get them, with an almost 100% chance of success.
Why the Devs can't make PvE content harder.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 207
# 24
10-19-2013, 04:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by majortiraomega View Post
Base Critical chance (2.5%), Gambling Device (10%), Romulan Tier I Passive (3%), Combat Specialist (2.5%), Lucky (5%), Strike Team Specialist (7.5%), Advanced Targeting Armor (~14%), Strike Team II (3%), Target Optics (+5%), Team Ambush Field (2.5 - 10), Weapon Mod (2.5 - 7.5). The player would be able to reach a maximum of 70% Critical chance with Tactical buffs and 63% Critical chance without buffs. With your proposed armor, that Critical chance could easily jump up another 20%.
Let me see if I've got this added up right:

2.5% (x2) Base Critical Chance, Combat Specialist
3% (x2) Romulan Tier I Trait, Strike Team II
5% (x2) Lucky, Target Optics
7.5% (x1) Strike Team Specialist
10% (x1) Gambling Device
= 43.5% Critical Chance from Traits, Skills and Devices only

You then claim:

2.5-7.5% Weapon modifiers
2.5-10% Team Ambush Field (set 3 bonus)
14% Advanced Targeting Armor
= +19% to +31.5% Critical Chance from Armor, Personal Shield and Weapon

43.5 + 19 = 62.5%
43.5 + 31.5 = 75%

So 62.5-75% is YOUR base expectation.

Quote:
Originally Posted by majortiraomega View Post
With your proposed armor, that Critical chance could easily jump up another 20%.
This is why I asked you to Show Your Work.

Please explain to me how it is possible to wear Advanced Targeting Armor *AND* the Romulan Intrusion Armor that I detailed in my first post (or an Omega Force Armor) AT THE SAME TIME. Wouldn't this be a case of EITHER/OR instead of BOTH/AND like you're assuming? Bearing in mind, that if you're wearing the Advanced Targeting Armor like you specified instead of the Romulan Intrustion Armor as I've designed it (or the Omega Force Armor) ... you won't be getting the Set 3 bonus, meaning no Team Ambush Field (generated by you) either.

Also ... doesn't this analysis demonstrate that pretty convincingly that the Romulan Intrusion Armor (alone) as I've designed it could offer up to +14% Critical Chance and have NO GAME BALANCE IMPACT simply because there's *ALREADY* an item available for that slot that does that much in the game? And haven't I already shown that 2.5+5=7.5 enough times already for you to realize that 7.5 does not equal 14 ... even when you add ONE +5 to the 7.5 to make it 12.5%? Heck, the only way to make the Romulan Intrusion Armor (alone) as I've designed it better than the 14% Critical Chance that you cite for Advanced Targeting Armor is to have the "special" on the Romulan Intrusion Armor stack twice so as to reach a total of +17.5%. You keep saying that "every armor stacks its proc 3 times" so therefore the Romulan Intrusion Armor as I've designed it would HAVE TO be able to stack its proc 3 times ... even though I've already come right out and *proven* that you have no grounds upon which to make that assertion or even to necessarily believe that it would HAVE TO BE true.

/em facepalm

So, thanks for the input and opinion, but at this point I think it's pretty safe to say ... you really haven't thought this through sufficiently well to be taken seriously. Thank you for playing.

Last edited by autumnturning; 10-19-2013 at 04:48 PM.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 1,000
# 25
10-19-2013, 05:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hereticknight085 View Post
Hm... well my only input on this would be if there was a Romulan ground set, I'd want there to be a Reman variant. Reman coloration, and more focus on stealth and damage output with a large sacrifice in durability. Or something like that.
Ohh Reman styles. . .
Based on the uniforms shown for Nemesis throw backs and the modern equivalents I am thinking that if you made Reman armour styled differently than Romulan armour, and not certain D'tan and crew really should, Then we should look at similar body styling but. Darker colouring, all the way to black with purple highlights. Those seem the be the dark and moody colours used classically for them.

Have not checked recently. But are Reman's locked into the reman factional uniform or do they have the option of regular romulan faction uniform as well?
Meaning the Federation and KDF uniforms for allied romulan/remans. I know RRW uniforms they can wear either romulan or reman clothes.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,886
# 26
10-19-2013, 09:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by autumnturning View Post

Please explain to me how it is possible to wear Advanced Targeting Armor *AND* the Romulan Intrusion Armor that I detailed in my first post (or an Omega Force Armor) AT THE SAME TIME. Wouldn't this be a case of EITHER/OR instead of BOTH/AND like you're assuming? Bearing in mind, that if you're wearing the Advanced Targeting Armor like you specified instead of the Romulan Intrustion Armor as I've designed it (or the Omega Force Armor) ... you won't be getting the Set 3 bonus, meaning no Team Ambush Field (generated by you) either.

Also ... doesn't this analysis demonstrate that pretty convincingly that the Romulan Intrusion Armor (alone) as I've designed it could offer up to +14% Critical Chance and have NO GAME BALANCE IMPACT simply because there's *ALREADY* an item available for that slot that does that much in the game? And haven't I already shown that 2.5+5=7.5 enough times already for you to realize that 7.5 does not equal 14 ... even when you add ONE +5 to the 7.5 to make it 12.5%? Heck, the only way to make the Romulan Intrusion Armor (alone) as I've designed it better than the 14% Critical Chance that you cite for Advanced Targeting Armor is to have the "special" on the Romulan Intrusion Armor stack twice so as to reach a total of +17.5%. You keep saying that "every armor stacks its proc 3 times" so therefore the Romulan Intrusion Armor as I've designed it would HAVE TO be able to stack its proc 3 times ... even though I've already come right out and *proven* that you have no grounds upon which to make that assertion or even to necessarily believe that it would HAVE TO BE true.
There was a reason I had a tide by the Advanced Targeting Armor's percentage. It's base +10%, enhanced about 42% by combat armor skill points.

Quote:
Originally Posted by autumnturning View Post
+5% Critical Chance
+{X} Physical Damage Resistance Rating (scaled by Mk # and Rarity)
+{X} Kinetic Damage Resistance Rating (scaled by Mk # and Rarity)
+{X} All Energy Damage Resistance Rating (scaled by Mk # and Rarity)
+2.5% Critical Chance
+20% Critical Severity
When receiving All Damage, 10% chance of applying Target Analysis
  • +5% Critical Chance for 6 sec
Your armor would be affected by combat armor skill points as well. +5% Critical chance would turn into +7.4%ish critical chance. The extra +2.5% would become 3.6%ish. The proc would also be affected, pushing it up to 7.4%ish critical chance. Even for your sake of "only one stack on the proc", which is something Cryptic has never done with armor, you'd still be at 18.4% critical chance and +20% Critical severity. If the proc stacked three times, which is how Cryptic has made such procs in the past, that would be 33.2% critical chance, 19.4% more over Advanced Targeting armor. Now do you see how the armor will be overpowered?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 207
# 27
10-20-2013, 04:16 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by majortiraomega View Post
There was a reason I had a tide by the Advanced Targeting Armor's percentage. It's base +10%, enhanced about 42% by combat armor skill points.
Oh, so NOW you come clean about what you meant.

Quote:
Originally Posted by majortiraomega View Post
Your armor would be affected by combat armor skill points as well. +5% Critical chance would turn into +7.4%ish critical chance. The extra +2.5% would become 3.6%ish. The proc would also be affected, pushing it up to 7.4%ish critical chance. Even for your sake of "only one stack on the proc", which is something Cryptic has never done with armor, you'd still be at 18.4% critical chance and +20% Critical severity. If the proc stacked three times, which is how Cryptic has made such procs in the past, that would be 33.2% critical chance, 19.4% more over Advanced Targeting armor.
So Advanced Targeting Armor is +10% Critical Chance (base armor, no skills) ... and is NOT destructive to game balance, because it's already in the game.

My construction for Romulan Intrusion Armor adds +7.5% Critical Chance (base armor, no skills, no proc(s)) ... which can go as high as +10% Critical Chance if wearing the Full Set (thanks to the Set 3 bonus) ... and IS destructive to game balance because it offers that buff "full time" ... just like Advanced Targeting Armor.

But then(!) ... it also comes with a proc to add an additional +5% Critical Chance on top of that ... what's the word I'm looking for here ... oh yes ... PARITY ... and you get all bent out of shape over it, ranting and raving that this would permanently destroy Ground PvP game balance for all eternity!

Yeah ... no ... I'm not buying what you're selling. Thank you for playing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by majortiraomega View Post
Now do you see how the armor will be overpowered?
I see a min/max PvPer whining a lot. I see champagne glasses filling with QQ because it becomes theoretically possible for fleetingly brief TRANSITORY moments to stack Critical Chance very high with the formulation I've put forwards.

However, I see NO APPRECIATION on your part that such theoretical maximums are anything BUT frequent, let alone that the baseline performance level of what I've designed, absent situational factors, is very much in line with the already established game balance performance levels and norms. Therefore I see no compelling reason to continue lending your complaints the credence they might otherwise have deserved.

Thank you for playing. Good day, sir.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,886
# 28
10-20-2013, 09:09 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by autumnturning View Post
Oh, so NOW you come clean about what you meant.
Any Ground player worth their salt is going to have enough points in combat armor to boost the stat up to 14%. There is no "coming clean" about that statement.

Quote:
Originally Posted by autumnturning View Post
So Advanced Targeting Armor is +10% Critical Chance (base armor, no skills) ... and is NOT destructive to game balance, because it's already in the game.

My construction for Romulan Intrusion Armor adds +7.5% Critical Chance (base armor, no skills, no proc(s)) ... which can go as high as +10% Critical Chance if wearing the Full Set (thanks to the Set 3 bonus) ... and IS destructive to game balance because it offers that buff "full time" ... just like Advanced Targeting Armor.

But then(!) ... it also comes with a proc to add an additional +5% Critical Chance on top of that ... what's the word I'm looking for here ... oh yes ... PARITY ... and you get all bent out of shape over it, ranting and raving that this would permanently destroy Ground PvP game balance for all eternity!
There is far too many +stat bonuses provided by your theoretical set. I've been attempting to have a civil conversation with you in this thread, yet you have demonstrated that you have no desire to even attempt to do so. I've taken time to sit down and present a sound argument as to why the set would be imbalanced. You've merely responded to my arguments with a condescending and heavily sarcastic tone. I didn't just start writing what I wrote without thinking. I took the time to analyze everything that you presented as a core set and I noticed an imbalance.

Quote:
Originally Posted by autumnturning View Post
Yeah ... no ... I'm not buying what you're selling. Thank you for playing.

I see a min/max PvPer whining a lot. I see champagne glasses filling with QQ because it becomes theoretically possible for fleetingly brief TRANSITORY moments to stack Critical Chance very high with the formulation I've put forwards.

However, I see NO APPRECIATION on your part that such theoretical maximums are anything BUT frequent, let alone that the baseline performance level of what I've designed, absent situational factors, is very much in line with the already established game balance performance levels and norms. Therefore I see no compelling reason to continue lending your complaints the credence they might otherwise have deserved.

Thank you for playing. Good day, sir.
Yeah...you may not take me seriously, but with your actions in this thread and with the arguments I present, no dev wandering by the thread will take you seriously either. I highly doubt we will ever see a reputation set with +12.5 critical chance and +20% Critical severity on just one piece of armor. The Omega force set is designed to be the damage dealing set, yet we don't see more than +7.5 Critical chance when the full set is slotted. Advanced Targeting armor is designed to sacrifice about 40 damage resistance rating for an extra +10 Critical chance, which is why it is balanced.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 215
# 29
10-20-2013, 10:13 AM
love love love all of this.. my only wish is to incorporate a split beam as the weapon. personaly I think two of the best ground weapons are pulsewaves and split beams.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 887
# 30
10-20-2013, 10:17 AM
I was generally curious about the claim that combat armor skill boosted crit chance and crit severity since if is not mentioned in the skill tool tip or on wiki just that it provided increased damage resistance. So after some digging I found:

http://starfleetprotectors.guildlaun....php?t=9300290


Wow, sometimes the dedication of STO fans to test things impresses me.

Maybe it would be simpler since this is only a theoretical discussion anyway to use the base stats of the Fleet advanced targeted armor if you really want the crit chance and think of another bonus like khg adrenal booster which is a heal + melee damage enhancement which would work well with both romulan/reman ground damage in the racial trait?

After all we want a good looking armor and undoubtedly some players would get it just for the looks, so anyone looked in the foundry's art assets for potential ideas? maybe mix match some screen shots in a graphics program?

ps- majortiraomega your knowledge of the ground pvp mechanics has always impressed even when you were killing me


Enjoy the game
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