Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 11,860
# 21
02-16-2014, 12:17 PM
If I had to choose a character for a doff pack I'd go with Enliss, Liojor, or Riodal.
HAIL HYDRA!

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
I can haz joystick!
MMOs aren't charities. Corporations are supposed to make a profit. It's what they do.
Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,397
# 22
02-16-2014, 01:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by markhawkman View Post
If I had to choose a character for a doff pack I'd go with Enliss, Liojor, or Riodal.
Foundry Doff Pack? Maybe with a limkited time Deferi / Gekli / Whoever freighter?
Commander
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 307
# 23
02-16-2014, 01:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by thay8472 View Post
Foundry Doff Pack? Maybe with a limkited time Deferi / Gekli / Whoever freighter?
Shouldn't this, "Looky, I made a cool race - now make it a Doff Pack" discussion be in a thread of it's own?

The Foundry has some serious issues - let's concentrate on that subject in this thread please.
Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,397
# 24
02-16-2014, 01:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by newplayerguy7 View Post
Shouldn't this, "Looky, I made a cool race - now make it a Doff Pack" discussion be in a thread of it's own?

The Foundry has some serious issues - let's concentrate on that subject in this thread please.
Doff packs could bring some $$$
Commander
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 307
# 25
02-16-2014, 08:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by thay8472 View Post
Doff packs could bring some $$$
Which, while good for our PWE overlords, in no way fixes the problems with the Foundry.

And if you think Doff Packs made from Foundry races (which Cryptic can, themselves, at anytime create) be used to pay for Foundry fixes, I have a bridge in Brooklyn for sale that will do the same thing.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,534
# 26
02-16-2014, 10:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by newplayerguy7 View Post
Which, while good for our PWE overlords, in no way fixes the problems with the Foundry.
I agree. The foundry have a lot of issues more important than not having DOFFs pack.
----

STO, featuring Admiral Turok.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 141
# 27
02-17-2014, 02:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by donrah View Post
Hold on, do you realize how incredibly simple scaling in 3D is? You take the vertex coordinates and you multiply them on any or all of their axes. Take a coordinate of 2,2,2 (x,y,z respectively) and multiply them by 4. Now the vertex coordinates are 8,8,8. If you had four vertices (a cube), each 2 units from their respective axes (-2,2,-2 for example) and multiply them by 4, the cube would be 4 times larger (-8,8,-8). To scale down, you divide (or multiply by values between 1 and 0). Chances are, this is already in the engine (Scaling is an old and basic function of 3D, the first cards did transform and lighting calculations. It's a mandatory function.) and just needs an interface to allow the user to manipulate it.
You would think it is that easy, but it isn't. There are several reasons.

1) The physical size is easy to scale up or down, but scaling the texture on the object is not trivial. For example, scaling up a texture 10 times just results in blocky surfaces like the type you see in minecraft.

2) The database table holding records for each object placed in a foundry map will need to have a new scale-factor field (possibly more than one field given issue #1 above). Given the number of foundry maps multiply by the number of objects in each map, the addition of one single field implies at least 10 to 100+ GB of extra database space required. The database administrators will need to make a determination as to whether this extra usage of disk space is justified.

3) The foundry editor UI will need to be updated to support scaling of objects. This will take at least a week's worth of work for a single developer. And this is just my crude estimate as an outsider who have no information on how Cryptic's internal tools work. Very likely, this change will take much longer than a week.

4) Management will need to determine how adding this feature will result in more revenue for Cryptic. Chances are, it won't result in any significant or even measurable increase in revenue. So the only time such a feature will be added is as part of a whole suite of foundry changes designed to increase player interest in the foundry and foundry missions.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,796
# 28
02-17-2014, 05:19 AM
They have said in the past that their engine does not handle scaling well. It would probably be impossible to see it in the Foundry.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,344
# 29
02-17-2014, 05:14 PM
The question I see is "How do we get the most "bang" for the least "buck"?

We, being the Foundry Community here, the answer for me is as simple as open, honest, respectful, communication with the Dev Team.

"What is possible to accomplish?"

"You can get 5 or 10 items into the details next time a Dev can spare a little time."

Make the List

Yes, we are still waiting on any response to that last list we all voted on and everything, but to actually get anything, our requests have to be in line with what can actually be accomplished. Thankfully the Devs are being what to me is seemingly more open about the state of things, and if the community can keep our requests reasonable, it's possible someone is actually listening.

*shrug*
"... I really don't care if you try to make money, Cryptic. I do care when you have to insult my intelligence by saying it isn't about money, and use a hot button issue like 'content quality' in order to push that narrative." -Iconians
Commander
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 347
# 30
02-17-2014, 07:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by intrinsical View Post
You would think it is that easy, but it isn't. There are several reasons.

1) The physical size is easy to scale up or down, but scaling the texture on the object is not trivial. For example, scaling up a texture 10 times just results in blocky surfaces like the type you see in minecraft.
Scaling the texture is accomplished with an interpolation method (e.g. bilinear, trilinear, cubic, etc.). I learned this in the first few weeks of a course on graphics programming.

Quote:
Originally Posted by intrinsical View Post
2) The database table holding records for each object placed in a foundry map will need to have a new scale-factor field (possibly more than one field given issue #1 above). Given the number of foundry maps multiply by the number of objects in each map, the addition of one single field implies at least 10 to 100+ GB of extra database space required. The database administrators will need to make a determination as to whether this extra usage of disk space is justified.
No, not even. When you add an asset to a game engine, it becomes its own object with its own properties, but the common properties are usually stored as a parent class. Using such hierarchies reduces overhead. Only changes from the source are stored in new records.

Quote:
Originally Posted by intrinsical View Post
3) The foundry editor UI will need to be updated to support scaling of objects. This will take at least a week's worth of work for a single developer. And this is just my crude estimate as an outsider who have no information on how Cryptic's internal tools work. Very likely, this change will take much longer than a week.
It all depends on their code libraries; programmers don't do anything from scratch that they can find a premade solution for. Any programmer worth his salt has a code library of solutions they or their peers have created for a number of problems.

Quote:
Originally Posted by intrinsical View Post
4) Management will need to determine how adding this feature will result in more revenue for Cryptic. Chances are, it won't result in any significant or even measurable increase in revenue. So the only time such a feature will be added is as part of a whole suite of foundry changes designed to increase player interest in the foundry and foundry missions.
This. This is the real barrier.
Go here and show your support for a better Foundry!
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 03:17 PM.