Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 1 Cruiser Turn Rates
01-30-2010, 05:32 AM
I know there are something like 60+ pages on this topic in the archived files, but I thought we should maybe give it a fresh start.

Personally i fell the cruisers turn rate needs to be about 2 or 3 points higher because.
Currently we cant turn fast enough or balance power between all shields fast enough to make our shields very effective. more often than not we loose 1 shield and then hull with the other 3 still mostly full even though we develop the nervous twitch of spamming the balance power button with every thing we do.
We, at present have a hard time even picking up loot after mission. the turn rate on a t4 Cruiser is honestly so bad that at balanced power levels it takes 61+ seconds to turn 360!!!
The turn rate items in the game now do little in the way of helping us because 10% of 0 is still 0. Or more realistically using 2 eng consoles add only 1 point of turn rate.
Other Cruisers and big ships in the game all have faster turn rates. I.E. the Klingon's.

Even tho i do not believe we should have too for 2 or 3 points in turning, I'm sure all cruiser captains would agree that wed trade almost anything for this. a gun slot, some max speed, some shields or hull, anything.

Other possible fix ideas could be a cruiser specific turn rate boost while at 1/4 speed or full stop. Or maybe, boost all ships turn rate by 2 or 3 if needed to keep things balanced. Possible even adding a skill in the game that raises turn rate by a number rather than a percentage that any captain could Learn. Maybe even with each rank add 1 point to turn rate.

At any rate I feel this is severely compromising the fun factor. And, I have tried other ships, but Cruisers have the enterprise so plz give us a hand here. at least do it for the fun!
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 2
01-30-2010, 05:51 AM
I was looking at the basic captain skill, the tier 1 one that improves maneuverability and all that nice stuff, and I saw that it increases turning rate by 18%. That's awesome for an escort with a turn rate of 15, you get 3 more points! but it sucks for a cruiser with 5... You get 1....

I would suggest that the higher level ship specific skills (which are apparently useless since they only affect one tier), I recommend those are changed to affect all ships of the tier, and improve some of the weaknesses of the other ships. For example another cruiser skill that increases turning rate, for escorts you could get a skill that gives them the ability to dodge weapon fire, science vessels... Well, not sure what their weakness is, but could be abilities to boost science skills even more.

There are many ways to fix this, but yeah, I agree that if the ship takes a full minute to turn and even out of combat, that does not affect anyone, then there is definitely something wrong there.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 3
01-30-2010, 06:00 AM
I disagree..

Flying a cruiser *should* be like flying a block of lead, in atmosphere.

The shields are an issue, but Id suggest an increase in the rate with which you reinforce a shield quadrant with power from the other 3 shield quadrants.

Its like saying a BB needs to "get" better manouvrebility because a DD can run circles around it.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 4
01-30-2010, 06:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MelineAaele View Post
I disagree..

Flying a cruiser *should* be like flying a block of lead, in atmosphere.

The shields are an issue, but Id suggest an increase in the rate with which you reinforce a shield quadrant with power from the other 3 shield quadrants.

Its like saying a BB needs to "get" better manouvrebility because a DD can run circles around it.
That's fine in combat, but should a player suffer a 1 minute turn rate every time they want to get an anomaly? Does it add to the fun of the game? Nope. There is a problem if a ship is too slow and unwieldy, and can detracts from the game. Remember gameplay always trumps realism or anything else.

No one is saying to increase the turn rate of cruisers so it matches escorts or science vessels. That would be stupid. However, the current rate is far below escorts and science. Escorts gets 15 at tier 5 I think, science gets 13, and cruisers gets 6... That's a huge difference. If cuisers could get 8 on all tiers, that's 1 point more than the current lower tier cruiser and it would be a lot more comfortable to fly. And 8 is not game breaking, it's still 1/2 of what the escorts get.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 5
01-30-2010, 06:10 AM
I disagree to a point. Only the Galaxy needs to have its turn rate adjusted upwards, two points.

Quote:
Flying a cruiser *should* be like flying a block of lead, in atmosphere.
Yes, but should it also be alot less fun as you advance? Cruisers are the only ship that suffer a drop in enjoyment level because of the tier 4 turning rate.

A turn rate of 7 on the Galaxy still makes it a brick for turning, but alleviates the headaches of non combat flying in it. Combat, flying is rarely an issue- its everything else you have to do while flying.


Likewise, I think the VoQuv should be a turn rate of 6. No one should be straddled with the lack of fun a hideously low turn rate brings to flying (which also accounts for at least 3/4 of the gameplay).
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 6
01-30-2010, 06:13 AM
Another option would be to increase its turn rate out of combat. Like the full impulse option, but ships just get a turn rate bonus when not in combat. That would also help, create no balance issues, and just remove the headache of trying to move that brick. Imagine if you had to manually park that ship in sol station! man... good thing we have valet parking :S
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 7
01-30-2010, 06:21 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Raximillian
Another option would be to increase its turn rate out of combat. Like the full impulse option, but ships just get a turn rate bonus when not in combat. That would also help, create no balance issues, and just remove the headache of trying to move that brick. Imagine if you had to manually park that ship in sol station! man... good thing we have valet parking :S
This would also be acceptable.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 8
01-30-2010, 06:22 AM
Or maybe make those turn rate consoles boost by a fixed amount rather than a percentage. So +2 on a base of 5 or 6 would make a good difference to a cruiser, but not so much on a 15 escort. Not that an escort is likely to use one of these anyway.

The only ship class that needs them are cruisers, and the EPS are nearly always more useful depending on set-up. So putting a couple of them for say total +4 could make a viable strat to turn quicker and put more narrow arc weapons on front with maybe turrets to rear for example. Instead of loading up EPS and being broadside beam boats with the odd torp. It's never going to out turn an escort by a long shot, but gives you more options..
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 9
01-30-2010, 06:22 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Visual-Echo View Post
I know there are something like 60+ pages on this topic in the archived files, but I thought we should maybe give it a fresh start.

Personally i fell the cruisers turn rate needs to be about 2 or 3 points higher because.
Currently we cant turn fast enough or balance power between all shields fast enough to make our shields very effective. more often than not we loose 1 shield and then hull with the other 3 still mostly full even though we develop the nervous twitch of spamming the balance power button with every thing we do.
We, at present have a hard time even picking up loot after mission. the turn rate on a t4 Cruiser is honestly so bad that at balanced power levels it takes 61+ seconds to turn 360!!!
The turn rate items in the game now do little in the way of helping us because 10% of 0 is still 0. Or more realistically using 2 eng consoles add only 1 point of turn rate.
Other Cruisers and big ships in the game all have faster turn rates. I.E. the Klingon's.

Even tho i do not believe we should have too for 2 or 3 points in turning, I'm sure all cruiser captains would agree that wed trade almost anything for this. a gun slot, some max speed, some shields or hull, anything.

Other possible fix ideas could be a cruiser specific turn rate boost while at 1/4 speed or full stop. Or maybe, boost all ships turn rate by 2 or 3 if needed to keep things balanced. Possible even adding a skill in the game that raises turn rate by a number rather than a percentage that any captain could Learn. Maybe even with each rank add 1 point to turn rate.

At any rate I feel this is severely compromising the fun factor. And, I have tried other ships, but Cruisers have the enterprise so plz give us a hand here. at least do it for the fun!
I flew a cruiser in beta and i think its balanced. If your looking for turn rate fly an escort. If you want shields fly a science ship. The cruiser has its own advantages.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 10
01-30-2010, 06:24 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Raximillian
Imagine if you had to manually park that ship in sol station! man... good thing we have valet parking :S
i think most cruiser captains would simply yell " RAMMING SPEED! " crash it into a wall and be done with it.
Sure you'll get a few redshirts sucked out into space in the process and you'll probably annoy the guy who has to repair all the holes you make. But hey. thats what they get for not giving you autopilot.

besides the stations take control in the cannon do they not?
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