Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 11
02-02-2010, 06:19 AM
this game does need threat abilities, cruisers have no way to keep threat.

would be easy.

"number one, open a line to the enemy vessel!"

"line open sir!"

"your mother boinks ferengi's, klingon!"

RAAAAAAAAWR *all ships pew pew cruiser*
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 12
02-02-2010, 06:22 AM
haha tell me about it, I just came from the Laurentian system fleet action, and at the last boss I was trying everything I could do to keep threat, but every so often he would just swap to another escort and I'd have to watch as their shields dropped and then their hull went in about 5-10 seconds, and I just felt helpless. At the character select screen I picked everything I could do boost surviveability and I notice the difference compared to OB & CB when I wasn't sure what to do, but they aren't any good when nobody is attacking you.

I love tanking when the concept works, and it probably will in an actual group that works together, but for the time being, in public groups it's just not feasible

I suppose I could try ramming them to get their attention.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 13
02-02-2010, 06:22 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redwind55
Try using the feedback BO skill, it might help a bit with holding agro.

I play an escort and i have noticed that when i pop all my cooldowns and really peg dps, I tend to get focused on by some of the group.
For escorts i would recommend getting jam sensors. it takes you out of the targetting list of the mob for a few seconds giving you time to:
get away, stop dps, push dps to the limit and recharge shields.
pick an option
Yes I agree, threat generation for the cruiser certainly seems like a "team effort" rather than just the cruiser doing it. Like you say, as an escort, its wise to hold back and let the cruiser run in first to generate its aggro, and THEN aim for the same target rather than picking your own.

in my opinion the engineering "Jam Sensors" ability is very important for an escort to lose aggro.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Duskwood
this game does need threat abilities, cruisers have no way to keep threat.

would be easy.

"number one, open a line to the enemy vessel!"

"line open sir!"

"your mother boinks ferengi's, klingon!"

RAAAAAAAAWR *all ships pew pew cruiser*
Sounds like a space parody of Monty Pythons: The Holy Grail

" You're mother was a Tribble, and your father smelt of Stem Bolts!
Now go away before I taunt you a second time!
"
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 14
02-02-2010, 06:23 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duskwood
this game does need threat abilities, cruisers have no way to keep threat.

would be easy.

"number one, open a line to the enemy vessel!"

"line open sir!"

"your mother boinks ferengi's, klingon!"

RAAAAAAAAWR *all ships pew pew cruiser*
haha, love it!
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 15
02-02-2010, 06:26 AM
As a side question, if cruisers are 'tanks' and escorts are 'dps' what do science vessels do?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 16
02-02-2010, 06:27 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by technotica View Post
As a side question, if cruisers are 'tanks' and escorts are 'dps' what do science vessels do?
Heal, buff/debuff and support dps I believe.

http://www.startrekonline.com/ship_overview

Quote:
Science Ships
Although Science ships lack the massive firepower of other classes, their technology grants them distinct advantages in combat. Their advanced deflector and sensors can easily identify and exploit weaknesses in enemy ships and target their subsystems, or even detect cloaked ships. Their deflectors can also be used to aid and repair ally ships, as well as control the pace of battle.

These abilities allow them to provide superior fleet support, yet they are more than capable to complete missions on their own.

Primary Role: Fleet support, ally aid, battle control. Specializes in buffs, debuffs and control.
Special: Advanced shields, innate subsystem targeting, innate cloak detection; bonus to Auxiliary power.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 17
02-02-2010, 06:39 AM
Ships inherently lock into the first thing that comes at them - so as a Cruiser, you should be first one in.

After the initial target threat, however, ships will then proceed to lock onto things that do the most damage. First, to them directly, and then to things around them.

Example:
If you see six ships, and you fly in, they will all fire on you. You focus on the biggest ship (we'll call it ship 1), and fire on it. All six ships continue to fire at you.

Escort A flies in, and starts pounding on a ship. Some arbitrary unit - we'll call it ship 2. Ship 2 will turn around and start firing on Escort A. There is a *very* high probability that ships 3-6 will now also start firing on Escort A, because he is grossly out damaging you.

If, in the same scenario, you come in, and you fire off and strike all six ships, the probability of the other ships attacking Escort A diminishes significantly. He will, however, likely still pull ship 2 off you, if you are not actively targeting him. This encourages Escorts to fire to assist, or to only pick on small targets or targets they know they can actively tank. Since all ships can basically handle a certain degree of damage incoming, this is still okay, since you're doing your main job by taking the fire from stuff that exceeds their damage threshold.


The problem with this model of threat, however, is that Cruisers rapidly lose damage power. This is because cruisers are limited to specifically beam weapons, and people have a very high tendency to 'broadside fire' in many situations - the more beams you have firing, the more energy you drain, the less damage you do over time and over all. This requires you to either adjust your positioning/facing, or start consuming weapon batteries at an alarming rate.

In this system, then, you should consider your 'tank' job as a cruiser being one specifically focusing on two primary tasks: A) pull initial alpha strike salvo and B) holding the attention of the biggest baddest guy there

At the same time, your DPSers should be looking at A) Holding back a few seconds before jumping into the fray and B) cutting through the weaker enemies initially to cut out as many damage sources as quickly as possible.

Ultimately, this requires everyone to be intelligent in how they play, or when playing with a group, having an established general attack strategy in place.


As for fleet actions - they are currently rated for damage done. You will not win them unless there are no escorts, really bad escorts, or you are grossly over gearing the encounter. The only situation where you stand a possible chance of out DPSing escorts occurs in the Crystalline Entity, where you could potentially get a high initial damage with mines, and somehow outlast the Escorts for sustained DPS. This is very unlikely, and also, mines (in my mind) are a cheap way to do that encounter. But that encounter as a whole is very conducive to farming.
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