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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 21
02-08-2010, 12:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZeroNavigator
STOs PvP requires for people to change the way thy think. They think that they will jump into cruiser like a glorious captain Kirk, equip beams and couple torpedo launchers and will be as unstoppable as USS Enerprise killing blowing up everything that moves in sight.

Give me 3 Klinks face to face with 1 properly slotted fed cruiser tank, fed science support ship and a fed loaded escort ship and we will tear those klinks apart one by one.

PvP in STO is GROUP-BASED. Not 1v1... And in any group based PvP its all about ganking. If klinks play right they will first kill support, then escort, while probably losing 1 ship and have heavily dmged the other and in the end it will be all about 1 klink v 1 fed cruiser and all about who knows better how to play their ship properly.

PvP abilities are also different from PvE, while in PvE pure DPS can be good enough, in PvP you supposed to be more versatile.. etc.
QFT. This.

In STO PvP, it's all about who plays better as a a team. If the Klinks play as a team and the feds don't, the Klinks win. If the feds play as a team and the Klinks don't, the Feds win.

And if the Feds play equally well as a team as the Klinks do, the Feds win. Because of the Fed advantage in ships, Feds win all ties. Klinks HAVE to play better than Feds to win. Feds only need to play as well as Klinks to win.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 22
02-08-2010, 12:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gaglug View Post
I posted my source for data, I'll have to check if Suricata updated the hull numbers at any point.


I've flown the T3/4 Klink cruisers. .

Then you should have realised how off the chart you were referencing was before making the statement "KDF cruisers have less hull than all the Fed ships in their tier".


Quote:
I don't see why fed cruisers can't equip cannons.
Because the game doesn't let cruisers equip cannons. Or are you stating you don't see anything wrong with letting Cruisers equip cannons? (in which case, there still isn't any point to it, due to turn rate)

In any case, the VorCha is better than the Galaxy (yes, I have flown both)- I'd sacrifice 6.25% effective hit points for 100% more base turn rate on the Galaxy. Wouldn't even care about using cannons.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 23
02-08-2010, 12:42 PM
It's a little disengenious that people come on here and complain , when obviously the really issue is layout's and Boff buffs and teamwork buff's that are the real issues. People not understanding how the game mechanics works doesn't entitle them to complain . I've seen Fed cruisers hit upward of 200k in damage in combat at T-3 . So OP go back do you homework and read , study and learn .
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 24
02-08-2010, 12:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vuk View Post
It's a little disengenious that people come on here and complain , when obviously the really issue is layout's and Boff buffs and teamwork buff's that are the real issues. People not understanding how the game mechanics works doesn't entitle them to complain . I've seen Fed cruisers hit upward of 200k in damage in combat at T-3 . So OP go back do you homework and read , study and learn .
I would like to point out how disengenious you are not admitting that there really is a huge gap in the performance of these ships in question. You say others should go and learn, how about you do the same.

Lets recap what we have learned:
Federation cruiser, 2k more hull
Klingon cruiser, Cannons
Klingon cruiser, Cloak
Klingon cruiser, More turning speed

The real issue IS NOT the skills, as everyone can get them, it is the ships themselves. Additionally you say people dont know game mechanics, based upon your ridiculous statements it is you who dont know jack or just feign ignorance because you want to have better ships than others.

Edit: I have seen klingon cruisers do 300k damage, it is all about how long the game lasts and who heals what.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 25
02-08-2010, 12:57 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bos22
Read the part about energy.... It's the energy problem, my energy goes down 50 in few seconds with 4 beams and 2 eng consoles - 2.2 transfer rate and 1.5 transfer rate. Cannons > Beams any time, and rapid fire simply owns beam overload.

Also there are cannons with 180' arc.
So you want your Fed cruiser to play like a warship. Play it like a Fed Cruiser. Who has the higher DPS arrays or cannons? Who has the potentially higher engagement time? Perhaps the key is investing in more skills, consoles and BO skills to improve the weapons power...but thats a specialization choice for the generic Cruiser design role.

You guys Fed ball for a reason, it suites your design roles. These arent warships...escorts are the closest you have. This whole 1 vs 1 comparison for balance isnt the way war works out. War is a team sport...fight as such. Embrace your hull's role and play to its max.

Everytime I see Feds play as a cohernet team of role oriented positions, my Klingons lose...everytime.

But you have play the ship to it strengths...thats not a 1 vs 1 trade-off(which is good for the Fed and its Fed ball) As a group, your omni-directional fire is withering and mutually supportive form all attack vectors.

For us Klingons, the Fed ball is like a wing of German interceptors diving into a well maintaned formation of B-17 heavy bombers...its devastating and resource intensive.

Just like you shouldnt try to turn a ***** into a house wife or a trade into a long term investment(or vice-versa)...dont try to turn a cruiser or a science vessel into a warship.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 26
02-08-2010, 01:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bos22
Simply because it's Battle Cruiser, not a Cruiser. Only turrets can be equipped.
One of the two of us is being an idiot. Maybe both.

Look, I'm american - and we speak ambiguously and abuse the language badly.

What I mean is :

"I am aware that federation cruisers cannot mount nonturret cannons. I think the game should instead allow them to use cannons. Excluding them from using a situationally beneficial weapon is too limiting."

Is that clear enough?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 27
02-08-2010, 01:03 PM
@cocoa-jin

Fed balls because klingons are cloaked. I won't respond to yours posts anymore, too long to read.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 28
02-08-2010, 01:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Meat_Machine
One of the two of us is being an idiot. Maybe both.

Look, I'm american - and we speak ambiguously and abuse the language badly.

What I mean is :

"I am aware that federation cruisers cannot mount nonturret cannons. I think the game should instead allow them to use cannons. Excluding them from using a situationally beneficial weapon is too limiting."

Is that clear enough?
unfortunately even if they could equip cannons, the turn rate is so abysmal for fed cruisers that 90% of the time they would be wasted slots
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 29
02-08-2010, 01:07 PM
The reason people think of Battlecruisers dishing out tonnes of damage is quite simply due to Cannon Rapid Fire not having a counterpart for beams. Without Rapid Fire the cannons don't do particularly astonishing damage just as beams don't, when overload beams gets fixed/changed as has been promised then i doubt there will be as many queries, complaints etc.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 30
02-08-2010, 01:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by faithborn
unfortunately even if they could equip cannons, the turn rate is so abysmal for fed cruisers that 90% of the time they would be wasted slots
Don't know I always wanted to experiment with 180' arc cannons, and you cannot put turrets infront neither or at least I tried.. I wanted to see 6 turrets rapid fire performance.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KabaalGen
The reason people think of Battlecruisers dishing out tonnes of damage is quite simply due to Cannon Rapid Fire not having a counterpart for beams. Without Rapid Fire the cannons don't do particularly astonishing damage just as beams don't, when overload beams gets fixed/changed as has been promised then i doubt there will be as many queries, complaints etc.
True, I am not calling for nerfs. I am calling for fixes. BO, MES needs to be fixed a bit after way too much nerf. I will be RA5 probably in 2 days, already captain 9. And next I will roll an eng klingon.
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