Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 21
11-11-2010, 10:49 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MustrumRidcully View Post
The current self-heals avaialbe to Escorts are not sufficient to keep them alive. How should nerfing support healing help them in any way? Not that your suggestion 1) even changes anything for the Escorts.
Support healing would still work on escorts as for obvious reasons they have less chance of their own self heals putting the would-be support heal on external cool down... ergo comparative advantage to escorts vis a vis ships with more self healing. Indeed it means escorts specced for pre-mades would probably not carry any self hull heals, just shield heals, making their shield healing more effective than now.

Quote:
Cruisers "trick" is that they can keep themselves alive against moderate damage against enemy fire and still use their active heals on others.
No, not really. It is the ability to get heals from multiple sources that is the key to team healing. Someone is always going to have a heal available and the best teams make sure it always goes where it is needed. This is great team work but it actually works too damn well

Quote:
So, my suggestion would be to nerf the higher level versions of the self-heals. Emergency Power to shields should simply grant less resistance bonuses at higher tiers. Suddenly a Cruiser can't keep up +50 % resistances all the time.
I am very leery of nerfing heals rather than decoupling self and support heals (or more accurately, putting them on a more equal basis by making them depend on the target's cool down timer rather than the caster).
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 22
11-11-2010, 10:51 AM
i feel that the resist of some of the team heal's should be looked at 30 seconds with 45% reduced shields damge with extend shields 3 at 71/50 power setting shields or 52% at power setting 125/100 seems a bit over kill. Coupled that with the self heal EPtS and even TSS thats alot of reduced damge to shields

edit: as a idea may be only the best heal effect (not the healing part) like reduced damage or resist effect is applied to the ship so say someone uses extend shields 3 and the one targeted puts on EPtS only the better reduced damage to shields works and when that effect wears off then the lesser one goes on.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 23
11-11-2010, 11:20 AM
I'll just quote myself from another thread:

Quote:
Go watch some of the DS9 fights. The only reason you don't see ships instantly die is because the main characters have Plot Armor. Everyone non-essential to the plot gets destroyed as quickly as possible.

If Shinzon wasn't trying to capture Picard he would have instagibbed the Enterprise, what with his vastly superior firepower. Battle in the Mutara nebula? They were fighting blind, it took all of maybe 5 shots MAX to kill the miranda class deathtrap that Khan was flying. Sure, ships should be able to stand for great, long, and vast fights where they wear each other down. It takes all of 1 lucky beam to score a hit on one lucky system to kill everyone in the entire ship.

---

As for cruisers. If you want to go invulnerable for long durations (which is what all the DPS does) then you rotate 2 copies of EPtS2/3 and maintain a permanent 50-60% shield resistance. Add in a single TSS and you've already hit the cap of 75% shield resistance and an asston of regeneration.

Cruisers can tank through active heals, but taking maintaining the shield resistances is significantly easier and more reliable. Add to that the fact that cruisers can produce similar damage numbers to escorts and you have a recipe for failure.

Cruiser's tank through the shields off EPtS, TSS, and HE. The large burst heals of ET3 are unnecessary when they're burning off 95% of the damage automatically. The same cannot be said for escorts.

Dedicated premades bring escorts to a fight because they know that they can heal them. Backline cruisers generally have to dedicate themselves to watching the escort(s) because the escorts are a lightning rod for the opponents. High damage, and absolute **** survivability against focus fire - compared to the brick wall of a cruiser and the equally tough wall of a good science ship. In a pug match, you cannot rely on anyone to heal you. That is why people move towards cruisers, they are significantly more self sustainable.

s it is not uncommon to see 6-10 cruisers in a pug fight (when most of them are tacticals). Sure, people like the high burst damage of escorts. The high sustained damage and sheer unkillability of a shield stacked cruiser makes them significantly more preferable to players though.

A nerf to active healing only serves to further push escorts into the margin. Escorts are playable in premades because they get constant healing from other players.
Quote:
Originally Posted by faithborn
I still say the "balance problems" comes from cruisers encroaching on the escort's specialty. Nerfing the active heals only makes people less likely to move into escorts and pushes people farther into cruisers. All the cruiser tanking comes from double EPtS and near maxed out shield resists. That is what makes them impossible to kill, not active heals.

Escorts need more survivability, cruisers need less dps.

nerf:
DEM (all ranks) - this is where cruisers get alot of their sustained damage from, DEM 3 can easily add significant amounts of sustained, and armor ignoring, damage on a target.

EPtS (2&3) - and by that note, shield resistances. Double rotation of near max shield resistances and enhanced regeneration makes cruisers significantly more appealing given their nearly impossible to kill nature.

Beam: overload (all ranks) - how do you think cruisers (and to a lesser degree, escorts) do burst damage? this skill.

Buff:
innate escort hull resistance (not evade chance, hull resistance). - take the glass out of the glass cannon. People are tired of flying a ship with little incentive other than "I go fast... WEEE"
TL;DR -

active heals are exactly that, active. As Inktomi said, trying to put air in a tire full of holes is a fruitless effort. Resistances are responsible for 90% of what keeps people alive.

Even at the minimum rank, 1 TSS + 1 ES + 1 EPtS = maxed out resistance. That 75% resistance is going to break significantly more than any ET3 will heal for over the course of 15 seconds. And then when your on shields you don't have to worry about the inordinately high spike that 4 quantum torpedos can produce.

Constant active heals with little resistance makes for a dynamic gameplay. Everyone stacked to the cap on shield resists makes for a boring as hell cruiserfest.
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