Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 1 Shield Resist De-buff
11-09-2010, 09:39 AM
We have lots of options to de-buff hull resists...FoMM, APB, APD, Sensor Scan...

They all work very well but don't do squat while the target's shields are still up.

If there anything that de-buffs shield resists in a similar way? I can't find a single ability that'll debuff a shield wall short of sub-nuking the buffs off.

Am I missing something?

I suggest that Tachyon Beam (somewhat useless IMO) be changed to be a sheild buff remover. It wouldn't damage the shields per-say, but remove shield resist buffs and would amplify damage to shields if it pulls the resists into the negatives (the same way the hull debuffs do now). It would then work like a polar opposite to "extend shields". You could make the effect scale with aux and be clearable by packing Science Team.

I think that would make it a worthy skill to carry. If it had those effects I would have a hard time chosing between that and TSS.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 2
11-09-2010, 11:25 AM
sub nuc will debuff everything however its a sci captain skill only.

including an alpha striking tatical escort who pop'd all his buff's to kill you.

Viral Matrix 3, might also work, by taking the system down.

Target shield sub systems..
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 3
11-09-2010, 12:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Naekuh View Post
sub nuc will debuff everything however its a sci captain skill only.

including an alpha striking tatical escort who pop'd all his buff's to kill you.

Viral Matrix 3, might also work, by taking the system down.

Target shield sub systems..
I mentioned sub-nuke, though that's not a de-buff per-say...more of a buff-remover.

Target systems and Viral Matrix both have random chances of dropping sheilds but strictly speaking any shield buffs that are present will still have full effect...so they are not de-buffs either. The phaser system proc also falls in with these abilities. (none are very reliable)

I know there are ways to deal with a shield tank...but the fact that there's no ability that puts something like a good old fashioned "-25% shield damage resistance" on a target seems odd to me. Especially when we have so many that do that against hull resists.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 4
11-16-2010, 01:27 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TimelyAbyss View Post
Target systems and Viral Matrix both have random chances of dropping sheilds but strictly speaking any shield buffs that are present will still have full effect...so they are not de-buffs either. The phaser system proc also falls in with these abilities. (none are very reliable)
target subs also reduce the allocated power to the specific system. since you get a little shield resistance (and regen) bonus by allocating power to shields, tss should debuff the shield resists. on the other hand it's only around 10% or so, and if the target is far beyond the cap, it wont even change anything.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 5
11-17-2010, 08:47 PM
I would be interested in trying out an Attack Pattern that specifically debuffs shields for dealing with shield tankers.. Maybe cryptic could just add that affect to existing APs to give us escort pilots a little more incentive to ride these little escorts hehe.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 6
11-17-2010, 09:53 PM
I'll throw in my support for the OP... seriously, why not have any kind of good debuff vs. shields when there are so many vs. hull?

And this is coming from a a guy who is a complete shield tank. My build will suffer from any anti-shield changes, so I'll change my build. In the end the game will be more balanced and fun. No sense whining about someone requesting my build to get nerfed when he's right.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 7
11-17-2010, 10:48 PM
There already is a resist debuff, its target subsystem: shields. Tachyon beam and charged particle burst are also extremely effective against shields.

Another shield debuff risks serious gameplay issues, especially for escorts and science ships for different reasons.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 8
11-18-2010, 12:02 AM
BTSS is an indirect resist debuff, in that the only way it decreases resistance is by lowering shield power. Shield tanks like me will have chained EPtS in order to maintain huge shield power all the time (as well as repair facings and the subsystem when needed). BTTS is weak sause against shield tanks, it's only really good against people with low shield power.

Tachyon beam is a sucky skill that nobody uses.

CPB is a very nice skill, but it still does not lower resistance. I do believe it ignores resistance for the amount of shields it takes off, but by itself it's not a cure for shield tanking.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 9
11-18-2010, 01:59 AM
I don't think shield resist debuffs are a good idea, to be honest. I don't really like the entire negative resistance stacking thing in the first place. I'd prefer if attackers would get damage bonuses all the time, and defenders get resistances all the time. No strange mixes.

Shield resistances are ignored by Tachyon Beam and Charged Particle Burst, and if you are fighting a resistance-stacking enemy, they are your best chance to get some progress (assuming you can't find a better target). Chaining CPBs or TBs with multiple ships can be very powerful - only straight shield heals can help you against that, and the ships most likely to use CPB or TB are also the very same ships that can stun you so you can't use your heals.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 10
11-18-2010, 02:34 AM
what.

WHAT?!


So your idea is to give tactical ships a method of breaking down the ONLY defense other ships really have (since as you so clearly mentioned hull can easily get de-buffed into oblivion) and also make it a tactical boff power.

So that all those other ships who already have trouble breaking a EPTS 1/2 + TSS1/22 escort down are further penalized?



???
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