Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 151
11-30-2010, 06:04 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DogsBody
I would assume (I don't have a programmable keyboard so don't know for sure) that if your Logitec lets you program multiple key presses to a single key, you could setup similar commands to the key binds mentioned in this thread. If you can make it have a small pause between sending each one of the multiple key commands then you could avoid the problems people have where binding multiple commands to a key results in some of those actions not firing reliably and thus having to spam the same keypress.

Additionally, if you can set up a key to auto repeat, you could for instance set up a re-distribute shields key, so that once you press it it sends that command every second or two until you press it again = auto re-distributing shields.
Yes this is what I'm doing. I have one auto - shield heal, and one auto-hull heal. I've inserted pauses in the up and down pressing of the keys, and also am careful to stagger activation of the cycles, so I don't run into a bottle neck. If I select a team mate, they will benefit from the heals depending on where I am in the cycle.

I'm just wondering if there are any latency issues doing it through a keyboard as opposed to using key binds.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 152
12-01-2010, 10:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cocoa-jin View Post
I figured it was the norm, but I had some people say they dont know what Im talking about.

Its not much of a problem when I use them offensivly....but when I'm trying to use them defensivly, it would sometimes be critical which command popped first. Perhaps not so much now, bu in the days of uber burst(1.5 -2 secs from first weapon impact to death), it meant the difference between gettinga shield arc up and re-gened before thw HYT salvo salmmed into my hull, or having the other skills going, but with a dead shield arc...I coul dalmost see my hull fold in around the impacts, right before I popped.

EDIT:
Now that I'm back in BoP, Its even more critical that my defense pop as intended...because whatever I have is designed to last just long enough to get me out of a pinch.
I have found that on large-ish keybinds (4 or more commands) that you may have to juggle the abilities in use around abit within the slots being used in the KB to get a near perfect use.

example: (old KB)
/bind space "+TrayExecByTray 1 0 $$ +TrayExecByTray 1 1 $$ +TrayExecByTray 1 2 $$ +TrayExecByTray 0 6 $$ +TrayExecByTray 0 7 $$ GenSendMessage HUD_Root FireAll $$ +Power_Exec Distribute_Shields "

I found that even though I set the keybind up to cycle through tray 2 / slots 1 thru 3 and slots 7 & 8, when used the KB would activate slot 1 then slot 3 and skip slot 2 until about the 5th keypress of the spacebar. I switched the powers in slot 3 with slot 2 and suffered no more miss-use of abilities.
Evidently the cooldown system in STO can wreck havoc with keybinding and make some powers not respond as needed. Also I found that if you keep the keybinds shorter (1-4 abilities) it can help with miss-used abilities as well.

Unfortunately keybinding is not a exact science or works perfectly at all times.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DogsBody
snipped.
Sorry, not that I'm aware of. I don't think its possible to keybind other keys into a keybind in STO.
Not an expert KB'er though, so maybe someone has figured it out.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 153
12-01-2010, 03:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roach View Post


Sorry, not that I'm aware of. I don't think its possible to keybind other keys into a keybind in STO.
Not an expert KB'er though, so maybe someone has figured it out.

Surprisingly you can, that's what I learnt when trying to work out the keybind for DogsBody the only issue I had was $target was saved as $target in the second key rather than the name.

/bind . bind m Target Combat Medic

for example if you enter than and straight away him m it does nothing, when you press the . it then hit m is targets combat medic

The only thing stopping the bind wanted working is there's no way (that I have found) to bind a name/target without manually putting it in as $target only changes to a name when used in chat, if it's a bind to another bind it gets saved as $target.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 154
12-01-2010, 03:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DogsBody
Firstly, thanks to all who have contributed to this thread, I have found it very useful.

Onto a question if I may. I would like to bind a key (say F10), so that when I press it, it binds another key (say F9) to target whoever is currently targeted when I pressed the F10 key..
No, you can't do what you are seeking to do and you wouldn't want to do it that way any way.

Use this syntax:

/bind <key> targetteammate <#> $$ TrayExecByTray <tray> <slot>

So, let's say you have ET1 in the first tray at the fifth slot and you want to use the H-key to make sure you heal you fleetie who is in the first team position:

/bind H targetteammate 1 $$ +TrayExecByTray 0 4

I have 30 keys bound in a similar fashion. With the above, I am able to target any teammate, including myself (target_self), and send them a heal. Best thing I can tell you about reacquiring your target is to know which of your teammate has your target and target them after you send the heal. In most cases the target you are heal in probably has the same target and you will begin firing the foe right away.

Another option is to use the Target_Enemy_Next & Target_Enemy_Prev commands. You could bind the Target_Enemy_Near to the E-key. Put Next on the R-key and Prev on the W-key (Yeah, I know i just killed it for WASDers ... you really need to use the mouse.) Use (or something like it):

/bind e Target_Enemy_Near
/bind r Target_Enemy_Next
/bind w Target_Enemy_Prev

Now, after you throw that heal you can quickly cycle through the enemies.


Quote:
Originally Posted by cocoa-jin
What is the benefit of the "+" sign in front of "TrayExecByTray x y"

Simple answer : it won't work if you don't use it.

Complex answer : There are different types of commands. This command is an executable command. These are commands executed when there is a '+' before them. The '+' activates the command.

Others are toggle commands which allow you to turn them on/off; just as if you pressed a button and released. There are special toggle commands that allow you to turn them on until you turn them off. In these cases you use '++' to turn the command on. By example, to make your ship turn left (or right) without you having to hold a key down you would bind ++left (++right) to whichever key you like (I use my numpad). When you tap the left-key, your ship will begin a left-hand turn and continue until you tap the left-key again.

Now wait, some of you are gonna say "Oh goodie, goodie. I can use this to distribute my shields while in battle and I won't have to worry about them." .... WRONG. The distribute shields command (+power_exec Distribtue_Shields) is not a toggle command it is an execute command (i.e., the 'exec' in the name is a dead giveaway) and therefore this toggling method will not work. HOWEVER, you can get around it by binding this command to your fire button. At some point while you are spamming your fire button your shields will distribute.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cocoa-jin
What is the benefit of "TrayexecByTray x y" over "TraySlot x y"(I think thats the command, I need to heck when I get home)

The command is UseTraySlot.

Edit: See SimonPicard's response below

Quote:
Originally Posted by cocoa-jin
My biggest problem, is that I can't trust formore than 1 or 2 fo my functions to activate while I'm pulling the trigger in my cannon boat.

If I perfectlystill and quiet, I can get 4 to go off pretty routinly...is there a command that insures they all go off or any way is as good as the other?

There is a reason for this, it's called the "I win button". Cryptic has graciously prevented this button by requiring that a bound key be pressed as many times as there are commands attached to it. Generally, you can get one or two (sometimes three) commands to fire of at the same time, but mostly you won't because of activation timing. Many powers have a .5s activation time and if you try to activate another power during that time ... it ain't happenin'.


Quote:
Originally Posted by BDCasolari
I've mapped most of my tray abilities/items to specific keys, now using this keyboard it seems I'm able to create key combinations and tell them to happen at different times or in combinations, or repeat, etc. Is this the same effect as key binding? Is there any advantage of doing it with keybinds instead of a gaming keyboard?

Please excuse the sophomoric nature of this questions; I'm relatively new to computer gaming...but a long-time lover of Trek.

Thanks in advance for your responses.
Yes it is the same. However, one thing you can do with a gaming keyboard that you cannot do with ingame keybinding is timing. The advantage of a gaming keyboard is that you and insert delays to allow for activation.

P.S. There are no dumb questions ... just smartass answers. :p


Quote:
Originally Posted by Roach
example: (old KB)
/bind space "+TrayExecByTray 1 0 $$ +TrayExecByTray 1 1 $$ +TrayExecByTray 1 2 $$ +TrayExecByTray 0 6 $$ +TrayExecByTray 0 7 $$ GenSendMessage HUD_Root FireAll $$ +Power_Exec Distribute_Shields "

I found that even though I set the keybind up to cycle through tray 2 / slots 1 thru 3 and slots 7 & 8, when used the KB would activate slot 1 then slot 3 and skip slot 2 until about the 5th keypress of the spacebar. I switched the powers in slot 3 with slot 2 and suffered no more miss-use of abilities.
Evidently the cooldown system in STO can wreck havoc with keybinding and make some powers not respond as needed. Also I found that if you keep the keybinds shorter (1-4 abilities) it can help with miss-used abilities as well.

Unfortunately keybinding is not a exact science or works perfectly at all times.
You are soooooo right; keybinding is not exact at all.

I have a button that has a dozen powers bound to it. I have to press that button 12x to get each power to light off. When you get into the longer binds you have to reverse the order. Generally you will add powers from left to right. Well, with my 12 power button, I've had to do it backwards and have the first command activated last in the sequence.

As far as commands going off in order. This goes back to the activation times for the commands. Best way around this it to slooooooooowdown for the first round. Press..pause..Press..pause... Make each pause about a .5s and you'll be fine. (This will have the added benefit of relaxing you during battle.) After that you can go back to having your mash-party on your keyboard.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 155
12-01-2010, 04:11 PM
UseTraySlot still works...it's just ANNOYING since it plays a failed to activate sound so if you press it and a key is on cooldown or whatnot it's going to make that noise, if you're button mashing it gets annoying quickly *had fleet support in my space bar along with distrubute shields, every other second BZZZZZZZT*
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 156
12-01-2010, 08:48 PM
tranceaddict - I appreciate the time and effort you put into your keybind training! Most of that last post I already knew (from your's and others' posts earlier in this thread, mostly), but you're kind and patient, and at the same time detailed. It's awesome good work.

Thank you!
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 157
12-02-2010, 06:19 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tranceaddict View Post
Many powers have a .5s activation time and if you try to activate another power during that time ... it ain't happenin'.[/color]
This I did not know exactly (the 5 sec rule on powers) but perfectly explains the power use issues that will arise in a keybind.




I have a button that has a dozen powers bound to it. I have to press that button 12x to get each power to light off. When you get into the longer binds you have to reverse the order. Generally you will add powers from left to right. Well, with my 12 power button, I've had to do it backwards and have the first command activated last in the sequence.

As far as commands going off in order. This goes back to the activation times for the commands. Best way around this it to slooooooooowdown for the first round. Press..pause..Press..pause... Make each pause about a .5s and you'll be fine. (This will have the added benefit of relaxing you during battle.) After that you can go back to having your mash-party on your keyboard.[/color]
I will give your " backwards to front" suggestion a use on my KB's, though I don't have nay long ones that equal 12 commands. Yes learning a pace or rythim to your key pressing is crucial to good keybind. I have been joked over my use of a spacebar firing KB, but with a good 3-5second pace to my firing- it works very well.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 158
12-02-2010, 07:55 AM
Does anyone know how I can set up a bind that lets me fire my 3 Forward cannons but not my DBB?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 159
12-02-2010, 01:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnthonyMidnight View Post
Does anyone know how I can set up a bind that lets me fire my 3 Forward cannons but not my DBB?
you could do that. you can (not 100% sure of this one but should do) set up the cannons on auto fire and set one of them to a keybind by dragging it from the powers window into the tray and using the usual +TrayExecByTray so drop them into the 4th tray and left click them to get the green auto fire button

/bind KEY "+TrayExecByTray 3 0"

The other option (if that doesn't work or isn't working like you want, should though) would be setting them all into a keybind

/bind KEY "+TrayExecByTray 3 0 $$ +TrayExecByTray 3 1 $$ +TrayExecByTray 3 2"
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 160
12-03-2010, 01:44 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnthonyMidnight View Post
Does anyone know how I can set up a bind that lets me fire my 3 Forward cannons but not my DBB?
Quote:
Originally Posted by simon_picard
/bind KEY "+TrayExecByTray 3 0 $$ +TrayExecByTray 3 1 $$ +TrayExecByTray 3 2"
I would go with that. Those are your 4th tray and slots 1, 2, 3 (or which ever you choose). Since you are seeking to only fire your forward cannons, I assume, you probably have some alpha strike powers that you should also bind to another key so you can activate them with one button as well.

PatricianVetinari, thank you for your kind words. This is one area I have found were I can excel and I enjoy sharing my insights.

Simon_Picard, thank you for the correction; there is always something to learn. It is a good thing I never got that aspect to work ... I would have ended up very annoyed with keybinding. :p
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