Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 61 On a different but similar track
01-07-2011, 10:00 AM
The KDF vs. Fed debate. I think there is a good reason to make KDF as compelling an experience as playing Fed, though I have to agree with some that there will never be balance in this regard. Simply put, Star Trek is about Starfleet. No series put the Klingons as the main protagonists; all Trek films and series have been fundamentally about a group of Starfleet officers and their encounters with other races, the Klingons being the most important among them. But, just as WoW has Horde and Alliance, the Klingons need to be an actual fully-fledged faction and not a pvp-only afterthought like they essentially were at launch. KDF needs a dedicated mission maker on staff so that KDF has a complete levelling path independent of the Feds. The Foundry will help in this regard, but I'll bet the ratio of KDF Foundry missions vs. Feds wlll be lopsided in favor of the feds just like the player populations are.

There is an interim option: I think the Klingons need a civil war. There needs to be a way for Klingons to team up with Feds in most campaigns. Playing against the Romulans, Borg, and Undine (and possibly other antagonists to come like the Tholians and Iconians) are a natural fit for this. This way the KDF gets a lot more missions for levelling up almost instantly, they have an avenue for more KDF missions concerning the civil war, and maybe we find a way to resolve the war and put it back into the Cold War analog that they were in TOS. Once the Feds are on-board about the Undine threat, much of the reason for the Klingon-Fed war goes away, but they will never see eye to eye on everything.

Another option to help the KDF would be for the Foundry missions limit per account be made by faction. You get a certain number of Fed missions but also an equal amount for KDF. This will help address the imbalance between the two factions in Foundry missions available.

I want both sides to flourish. The Feds will always be the dominant faction in terms of numbers, but unless there is a good path for the KDF there will never be a true two faction situation like other games have. I think it's important that they have that.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 62
01-07-2011, 10:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shakkar View Post
Let me speculate for a moment and see if dstahl can either clarify or give us a "warmer/colder" guide to see if I'm on the right track.
Remastering episodes is being done for many reasons, some of which aren't even player facing and have more to do with how parts of the mission system on the back end works.

I'm not going to go into details other than to say, we are a professional development company and at the end of the day, I'm juggling hundreds of priorities and scheduling manpower down to the hour. We have very lengthy schedules and backlogs and I spend quite a bit of time working with our production staff to ensure the dominos are in the right order. I suggest going and picking up a book on video game software production if you'd like to learn more about all the considerations that come into play during development. Even though most are out dated, I still think this one paints a pretty good picture: http://www.amazon.com/Game-Producers...4423720&sr=8-1 of all the moving parts in a typical video game. Now multiply that by 10 for an MMO and you're getting close.

In other words, remastered episodes are being made for a very good reason and I'm not going to go into every detail why.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 63
01-07-2011, 10:12 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shakkar View Post
I want both sides to flourish. The Feds will always be the dominant faction in terms of numbers, but unless there is a good path for the KDF there will never be a true two faction situation like other games have. I think it's important that they have that.
And this is and always has been essentially my point. They chose to make a two faction (potentially multi-faction) game and they can't go back on that now without some major repercussions. If you are going to make a faction based game, all factions need to be compelling game experiences for the game as a whole to thrive. We are getting closer to that point, but if we as a community or the devs ignore that this game has more than one faction, then there is a huge failure and ultimately STO fails.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 64
01-07-2011, 10:15 AM
well personally im looking forward to checking them out what ever happens.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 65
01-07-2011, 10:32 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Varrangian View Post
And this is and always has been essentially my point. They chose to make a two faction (potentially multi-faction) game and they can't go back on that now without some major repercussions. If you are going to make a faction based game, all factions need to be compelling game experiences for the game as a whole to thrive. We are getting closer to that point, but if we as a community or the devs ignore that this game has more than one faction, then there is a huge failure and ultimately STO fails.
It is getting a bit old with the "when is Cryptic going to stop ignoring the KDF"...

Not to single you out personally Varrangian, but in general there is a perception that the STO dev team is ignoring the KDF and I'd like to call bullcrap on that. Every update including and since Season 2 has had KDF goodness in it.

Will remastered episodes be only for the faction they were intended for? YES. Feds are NOT going to be replaying Gates of Grethor, and vice versa.

We all want two viable factions and more in STO, and as I've said repeatedly - it will take time - the KDF will never have as many episodes as the Feds in the short term, but we will continually make it better. Overnight armchair quarterbacks aside, the dev team is constantly improving the KDF for the 12% of our player base who play them.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 66
01-07-2011, 10:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dstahl View Post
Overnight armchair quarterbacks aside, the dev team is constantly improving the KDF for the 12% of our player base who play them.
Thank you for that information. I had always guessed it was around 1 in 4 players of the game. Nice to officially see that the KDF is really around 1 in 8.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 67
01-07-2011, 10:42 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dstahl View Post
It is getting a bit old with the "when is Cryptic going to stop ignoring the KDF"...

Not to single you out personally Varrangian, but in general there is a perception that the STO dev team is ignoring the KDF and I'd like to call bullcrap on that. Every update including and since Season 2 has had KDF goodness in it.

Will remastered episodes be only for the faction they were intended for? YES. Feds are NOT going to be replaying Gates of Grethor, and vice versa.

We all want two viable factions and more in STO, and as I've said repeatedly - it will take time - the KDF will never have as many episodes as the Feds in the short term, but we will continually make it better. Overnight armchair quarterbacks aside, the dev team is constantly improving the KDF for the 12% of our player base who play them.
Nicely said Dstahl.


It only makes sense that Feds will play Fed missions, and Klingons will play Klingon Missions. And to reiterate, nothing to COMPLAIN about.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 68
01-07-2011, 10:43 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dstahl View Post
It is getting a bit old with the "when is Cryptic going to stop ignoring the KDF"...

Not to single you out personally Varrangian, but in general there is a perception that the STO dev team is ignoring the KDF and I'd like to call bullcrap on that. Every update including and since Season 2 has had KDF goodness in it.

Will remastered episodes be only for the faction they were intended for? YES. Feds are NOT going to be replaying Gates of Grethor, and vice versa.

We all want two viable factions and more in STO, and as I've said repeatedly - it will take time - the KDF will never have as many episodes as the Feds in the short term, but we will continually make it better. Overnight armchair quarterbacks aside, the dev team is constantly improving the KDF for the 12% of our player base who play them.

I don't think I said, that at all. If that is the impression you got, I apologize. I know you are not singling me out, but I feel I should clarify all the same. As I said things are getting better. My references to remembering that this is a multi-faction game are not about the current state of the game (well perhaps about the current state of the community hence my inclusion of them), but about the dangers of forgetting what it was like.

If I think there is a failing it is not with the work that is being done, but with the lack of proper communication - this goes both ways too the community (be they KDF or Fed) tends to communicate their displeasure in threats or rants.

My participation in this thread was because the question of "us vs. them" has been brought up. This thinking (by the community) is a terrible path to follow because the isolation of one faction, any faction in a multi-faction game, would ultimately lead to failure. Even if the Dev team recognizes this the community too needs to understand that as long as their is a modicum of balance then work done on one faction should help the other to a degree by making the game stronger.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 69
01-07-2011, 10:45 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dstahl View Post
It is getting a bit old with the "when is Cryptic going to stop ignoring the KDF"...

Not to single you out personally Varrangian, but in general there is a perception that the STO dev team is ignoring the KDF and I'd like to call bullcrap on that. Every update including and since Season 2 has had KDF goodness in it.

Will remastered episodes be only for the faction they were intended for? YES. Feds are NOT going to be replaying Gates of Grethor, and vice versa.

We all want two viable factions and more in STO, and as I've said repeatedly - it will take time - the KDF will never have as many episodes as the Feds in the short term, but we will continually make it better. Overnight armchair quarterbacks aside, the dev team is constantly improving the KDF for the 12% of our player base who play them.
And you know now that you gave out a 12% number it's going to be used EVERYWHERE :p
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 70
01-07-2011, 10:45 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dstahl View Post
Overnight armchair quarterbacks aside, the dev team is constantly improving the KDF for the 12% of our player base who play them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marble_Tiger View Post
Thank you for that information. I had always guessed it was around 1 in 4 players of the game. Nice to officially see that the KDF is really around 1 in 8.
And that's the Pandora's box I am afraid such a number opens. Now some will see KDFers as a simple minority rather than seeing the role that a second (or third when/if the Romulans are introduced) play in the over all scheme of the games success.
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