Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 21
02-22-2011, 10:38 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by WishStone
Aye. :\
It's just that stickies get so MESSY, and so quickly. Myself, I am not a fan of many stickies in any forum. We shall see. For now, I am happy to answer questions on the topic and hope folks talk about it.
I'm actually for keeping this one up for a while, unless something more efficient comes along. This message against trolling will never get old and will always be relevant on the internet.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 22
02-22-2011, 10:40 AM
Well, I know I am guilty of engaging the trolls more than I should. Its actually really frustrating when they derail a very good thread with their shenanigans, especially since a lot of the time its hours before a report is processed.

I think there needs to be a little more effort to track problem users. I don't mean people who are simply "critical" or even highly negative in their opinions of the game. Those people we can debate properly.

I specifically mean the people who come into any positive thread and dump on it, or come into a thread with a legitimate complaint and start mocking "fanboys" or Cryptic or whatever.

I've noticed those reports don't seem to be followed up on, and that for an edit to occur they need to actually directly harass someone who use foul language or something.

There is a point when someone is so unhappy they really harm the forums, and they do so without directly "breaking" the rules.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 23
02-22-2011, 10:43 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kobayashi Maru
Using the steps you provided, I see no information on infractions whatsoever on my profile. I've never been contacted for a forum admin as well. Should I take this to mean I have no infractions / warnings?

In other words, how will I know if I acquired an infraction?
It's possible to have a post edited without receiving an infraction.

It's also possible to receive an infraction without any penalty points.

When you get an infraction, you'll receive a Private Message that tells you the wheres and whys, along with the number of points you've received.

You can always check your Infractions by clicking 'MY ACCOUNT' on the grey bar just under the thread title. These will be listed under the 'New Subscribed Threads' panel. Most of them will never expire.


Hmm... Does this technically count as 'discussing moderation'? And if so, is this thread a honeypot for removing undesirables?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 24
02-22-2011, 11:17 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by HeathenStorm View Post
Hmm... Does this technically count as 'discussing moderation'?
Since we're talking in general, no, this does not count. If I had written "Now, take me as an example, Rekhan gave me a 1-point infraction for trolling, which was also totally undeserved..." <- we'd have a problem. *hopes everyone will keep on not commenting on their infractions, because else she will have to be mean and smack people* If you get an infraction, you'll also be told in your PM to not PM the moderators about it but instead open a Community Ticket. If you, say, then try to PM me, you'll get an automated reply in German and English again asking you to submit a Community Ticket.


Tiberion1701: Ignoring them empowers you.
So what if they made a bad posting? Report it, ignore it, move on. Talk about what you wanted to talk about. If folks would do THAT instead of replying (or, worse, QUOTING and replying) the thread would not even be derailed and the fishing attempt be burried.

Not only that, but trying to give payback will increase the chances of getting smacked instead of the poster who attempted to troll. And "I was only defending you guys", while nice and all, still breaks the rules.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 25
02-22-2011, 11:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by WishStone
Since we're talking in general, no, this does not count. If I had written "Now, take me as an example, Rekhan gave me a 1-point infraction for trolling, which was also totally undeserved..." <- we'd have a problem. *hopes everyone will keep on not commenting on their infractions, because else she will have to be mean and smack people*
If you get an infraction, you'll also be told in your PM to not PM the moderators about it but instead open a Community Ticket. If you, say, then try to PM me, you'll get an automated reply in German and English again asking you to submit a Community Ticket.


Tiberion1701: Ignoring them empowers you.
So what if they made a bad posting? Report it, ignore it, move on. Talk about what you wanted to talk about. If folks would do THAT instead of replying (or, worse, QUOTING and replying) the thread would not even be derailed and the fishing attempt be burried.

Not only that, but trying to give payback will increase the chances of getting smacked instead of the poster who attempted to troll. And "I was only defending you guys", while nice and all, still breaks the rules.
Where did I defend engaging trolls? I didn't.

I am saying:

Trolls almost always "win" in that they will always get people to respond (even if this was stickied in every forum, and required reading before you post a reply every time) and that many times their trolling isn't dealt with for hours, and by that time the perfectly useful feedback or bug report thread is buried under the efforts of the troll.

And that the definition of "troll" sometimes seems to be a bit narrow, since the same offenders keep doing them same thing for weeks until they get bored (and their posts go unedited) and thus people are given the impression that what they're doing is okay, and thus respond in kind.

So I applaud this effort to inform posters how to handle trolls, if we all make an effort to follow this, things would be better.

But if its bad enough to warrant this reminder, it might also mean a little more effort on the other end is required, that the repeat offenders who have learned to "toe the line" without crossing it get a little more scrutiny;

That's all I am saying.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 26
02-22-2011, 11:50 AM
Quote:
You lost the game.
The game is like cake; a lie.

Joking aside, thank you for making this thread. =] Haven't stumbled upon trolling yet, but will notify ya all through a report when I find some.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 27
02-22-2011, 12:15 PM
I've gone ahead and deleted a few posts here (yes, harsh). I want this thread to stay´on-topic without it being the next chatter-centre. If you're looking for that, please head into the threads made for this in 10 Forward. Thankies.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 28
02-22-2011, 12:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by WishStone
I've gone ahead and deleted a few posts here (yes, harsh). I want this thread to stay´on-topic without it being the next chatter-centre.
That's another reason I suggested the lock in addition to sticky. Most threads invariably stray long from their intended target because x person introduces y tangent. Unfortunately, the more people that comment, the more tangents appear and further away from the original intent the thread gets.

It's not a perfect solution, I truly understand that. On the other hand, frequently discussed issues within a forum certainly should be stickied. And, from all appearances, this is one of them. In 6 days, or a month, or x undefined period of time, without the sticky, you'll have to post it all over again. Or necro this thread in order to remind folks. Unfortunately, that wouldn't work either.

In this particular case, you've got a Kobayashi Maru. You're not going to win no matter what you do. The solution here is in making the best of an impossible scenario and hoping most folks understand your intentions.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 29
02-22-2011, 01:18 PM
Hiya WishStone, et al!

Thanks for posting this. I've noticed a bit too much... ahem... bad etiquette... myself lately. I fear The.Grand.Nagus may be right (again/as usual ) about the following rules Catch-22 of this post, but it can only help.

Seriously, and with all due respect, why doesn't Cryptic tell when Joe Troll gets infracted/banned? Or have each user's infraction record visible on their public profile (including date(s)). Sort of like in Ye Olde Days offenders would be put on public display in the stocks for Public Humiliation. Wouldn't this set an example of This Behavior == Bad?

Please mind that STO is my first MMO and these forums are my first MMO Game Forum, really they're my first forum that I've frequented so, uh... frequently... So I'm ignorant to the potential pitfalls of such a policy, but... well... uhm, what's the negative to that sort of thing? I'm curious about that...
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 30
02-22-2011, 01:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PatricianVetinari
Seriously, and with all due respect, why doesn't Cryptic tell when Joe Troll gets infracted/banned? Or have each user's infraction record visible on their public profile (including date(s)). Sort of like in Ye Olde Days offenders would be put on public display in the stocks for Public Humiliation. Wouldn't this set an example of This Behavior == Bad?

Please mind that STO is my first MMO and these forums are my first MMO Game Forum, really they're my first forum that I've frequented so, uh... frequently... So I'm ignorant to the potential pitfalls of such a policy, but... well... uhm, what's the negative to that sort of thing? I'm curious about that...
The downside to a display of bad behaviour would be the attention. Trolls and other malcontents feed off attention and fame, and a system where their name would be spread would only encourage them.
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