Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 11
06-07-2011, 02:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MajorFury View Post
I think you bring up a valid point but I have to admit I don't like it. What I really think they should do is simply get rid of FvF or at least eliminate any rewards earned through FvF. If people get stuck waiting in ques that are too long then perhaps some of those long time KDF who are playing feds now might actually return to help balance the numbers. Another idea that is incorporated in many MMO's that have different factions is to increase XP bonuses to the side that is short on population. There are plenty of things they can do to fix the game population balance except it would take the management to be somewhat competent.....I know that might be asking for too much. Perfect World really just needs to fire a few of the bozos.
FvF was the last nail in the coffin for the KDF. It wouldn't be such a big deal if FvK had priority over FvF, but the way things are if I log on my KDF toons that were designed for PvP, leveled exclusively through PvP, and have next to no content outside of PvP, I need to wait longer for a PvP queue to pop than if I log on a PvE Fed.

FvF was a stupid, stupid, stupid idea. I didn't like how slow queues were for my fed toons, but I solved that problem by rolling some klinks. But the Klinks don't generally have enough population for KvK, so killing KvF killed the faction.

The simple fix would be to eliminate the separate FvF, FvK, and KvK queues, and give FvK matches priority over all other types. It would also help a lot if PvP granted more experience than PvE (to get PvP going in the lower levels again) and gear could be earned through PvP alone (3 Emblems a day is pretty lame).

The Klingons can be a healthy faction if the PvP game is healthy.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 12
06-07-2011, 02:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveHale View Post
Sounds a little like throwing our hands in the air and calling it quits. What a way to end a war, right? lol

I personally feel like Klinks don't need all of the PvE attention that some have been clamoring for. With the huge disparity that already exists, Devs are continuing to push out Fed content (even redoing existing Fed content - reruns, really? Who crapped that gem out?) with no regard for the Klinks. Give greater rewards (and more missions with rewards) to make leveling through PvP more appealing (or at least doable anymore). I'm also with Blackjack about FvF not counting for anything. You should only be rewarded for FvK and there should be a larger gap between what the winning side gets over the losing side (still no winner take all).
I this is the way to go. Leveling up through PvP that has a nice ring to it and maybe it would get more people playing Klingons. And as a casual player for my pvp fix to actualy be helping me level up would be great.

And that is what I like to role-play. A FED hunting Klingon. Although I'm gonna give the FED side a try.

I don't know much about FvF play yet as I am just starting a FED PvP character but I would think that warGAMES are just that - Games to prepare you for the real battles. And should not be worth as much as a real battle in terms of rewards.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 13
06-07-2011, 02:32 PM
KDF makes better cookies, from the tears of the QQ of KDF op'edness.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 14
06-07-2011, 02:32 PM
My feelings on FvF mirror all of yours. It was the nail in the coffin of the KDF.

However where beyond the point where Cryptic will EVER delete the FvF que. Bottom line is at this point according to Cryptics math 80% min of the pop is playing as fed.

By the same math there is no chance they would consider giving FvK Ques any kind of priority.

Could Extra Rewards on the klink side help... perhaps. However I doubt any of us believe that.

I wish it was not so, however the Klink side of things is not going anywhere but down. More missions will be coming and they will not be coming for the klinks. The ones that do will be preceded by 4 Federation ones. Your right WHO cares about PvE missions, I don't however with out Players to fill the ques your right the FvF pops, its just the way of things.

I would love to see some new klink ships... its not going to happen. Again Cryptic math says theres no market. Lets be honest they can make more money releasing a new jump suit.

I think we pretty much have to let go, let the Klingons Sing there songs in Federation Space... we are NEVER going to be allowed to go there to do battle.

Make the Klinks a unique way to play the game... when they release weekly missions sure there can be little Klink version changes with out them having to design new areas so they can still keep us caged. When they remaster missions, we won't have to wait months to acquire the same broken toys. We can stop feeling like Cryptics second class citizens... because I don't think I'm breaking news when I say we are and always will be. Its economics... Fold us into the STO PvE game... and allow our players to PvP again.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
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# 15
06-07-2011, 02:40 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by inktomi19d View Post
FvF was the last nail in the coffin for the KDF. It wouldn't be such a big deal if FvK had priority over FvF, but the way things are if I log on my KDF toons that were designed for PvP, leveled exclusively through PvP, and have next to no content outside of PvP, I need to wait longer for a PvP queue to pop than if I log on a PvE Fed.
But it might also have been what kept PvP alive? Too many people, even to this day, complain about the Klingons OPness. Unless they really nerfed the Klingon ships to be signifcantly worse than all Fed ships so that even player skill can't make the difference, that won't change.

I don't know. Maybe without FvF, people would have just gotten better and everything would be wonderful today.

While I never wanted a Fed/KDF conflict warmup again, I kinda don't want to lose the war right now. Without a war, PvP is weakly justified.

What we might need is a change of the war. Maybe the KDF actually needs to become split apart, perhaps over the conflict of the houses Martok and Duras. One side wants to continue a war, the other wants to end it to focus on the Undine and other threats looming at the horizon.
A split inside the Empire could lead to a Cold War, with joint missions between Feds and Klingons, but also with offensives done by the warmonger side. The Empire expends what token effort is required to appeased the Federation diplomats, ultimately both sides know that while it costs a lot of lives, the real important threats have to be focused on.

I don't really like the idea of splitting Starfleet or the Federation (it's harder to justify and removing the game even further from the Startrek ideals), but if there is no other way, that could also be done.

Quote:
I was just saying how it should have been K&F vs the Romulans from the beginning, and there should be "team bonuses" that you get if you fly a fluffy setup. So if for example, you flew an all Klingon team, youd get a damage bonus. If you flew all feds, youd get a defense bonus. Or you can take advantage of both side and have mixed teams, but no bonus.
This is an idea I really like.
Lt. Commander
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# 16
06-07-2011, 02:48 PM
Good idea... pretty much I don't care how they want to spin the story. The idea of 100% separate factions is just not going to work anymore. I mean with the weekly missions Cryptic have already been laying the ground work for this. We all do the same weekly missions, just the mission giver dialog changes. Why not write new dialogs for all the fed missions already in game.

It can be anywhere from full out peace... to warring factions... how they get there doesn't matter. The point is ALLOW Klinks to team with feds and enter the FvF que....

They could even keep the FvK que, of course I would say this move would 100% kill it anyway.

We have Klink players playing fed because this is still a game and its not much fun not playing. I mean I can sit there and like some people watch TV while I wait for a pop... Or play something else on my Xbox. Really why don't we just demand that Cryptic takes what players this game still has for PvP and let them play. Man I sound cantankerous today.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
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# 17
06-07-2011, 03:05 PM
In my opinion, Klingons never should have received any PvE content beyond what we had at launch. As a PVP faction with a distinct and different flavour of gameplay Klingons could have been a valuable addition to the game. But that would have required some kind of PVP development. Now they are just a bad and incomplete copy of the federation.

My idea: Merge them with the federation and have the renewed F+K alliance fight a new threat in form of a Romulan PVP faction, and get the PVP right this time. Advantage: no complaints about op romulan (battle)cloak, because the feds can use klingon-built BoPs if they want.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 18
06-07-2011, 03:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mancom
In my opinion, Klingons never should have received any PvE content beyond what we had at launch. As a PVP faction with a distinct and different flavour of gameplay Klingons could have been a valuable addition to the game. But that would have required some kind of PVP development. Now they are just a bad and incomplete copy of the federation.

My idea: Merge them with the federation and have the renewed F+K alliance fight a new threat in form of a Romulan PVP faction, and get the PVP right this time. Advantage: no complaints about op romulan (battle)cloak, because the feds can use klingon-built BoPs if they want.

I like this but we know the Rommies are just going to be re-skinned KDF ships
Lt. Commander
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Posts: 120
# 19
06-07-2011, 03:38 PM
The real problem is low population on the KDF side simple as that. Instead of breaking out the love beads why not maybe do a few things to encourage people to play on their KDF? In fact if even a few of you who started KDF and then went Fed would come back we probably would be in much better shape. It's amazing how often I'm waiting in the que because we are 1-2 KDF short of launching an arena. Again, I listed easy fixes to help encourage KDF play but Craptic sucks.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 20
06-07-2011, 03:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MustrumRidcully View Post
But it might also have been what kept PvP alive? Too many people, even to this day, complain about the Klingons OPness. Unless they really nerfed the Klingon ships to be signifcantly worse than all Fed ships so that even player skill can't make the difference, that won't change.

I don't know. Maybe without FvF, people would have just gotten better and everything would be wonderful today.
FvF doesn't need to completely go away though. There are a lot of ways to deemphasize it while leaving it as an option. If FvK just had priority that would go a long way (so that when a player is queued for both and both queues fill up, FvK is always preferred.)

One of my general gripes with PvP is that once you've done your daily mission there are no rewards -- adding extra emblems for victory in FvK with no cap on how many you get (or a cap that allowed as many emblems through PvP as through PvE) might go a long way both towards helping PvP in general and helping the KDF in particular.

And lower level PvP really needs much faster experience. The queues below endgame are dead because everyone rushes to level cap, and PvP is the slow way to get there. Since Klingons have almost no PvE content, they get a double-whammy, because leveling up to the cap via exploration mission after exploration mission is too dull for most players to handle, no matter how much they want to play Klingons.

Basically Cryptic needs to get serious about PvP. If they do that then playing a PvP-centric faction wouldn't be so bad.
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