Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 21
06-20-2011, 05:27 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ebeneezergoode
I think it's pretty misleading to paint this as a Klingon issue with the ammount of Sci fleet/MVAM/fleet support I see in PVP. Starfleet spams too.
Not to mention mines and scorpions. Neither of those have much effect other than making targeting difficult, so you can be pretty sure that when someone bothers to equip scorpions or is circling around in a cloud of mines, they are doing it specifically for the spam.

I wouldn't mind a general reduction in spam (even if numbers are reduced but power is increased), but it's definitely not just Klingons doing it. I'm a bit more tolerant of carriers doing it, since it's not possible to have a carrier without having it carry something.

I kind of think this is one of those divisions between PvE-players and PvP-players -- PvE players seem to love combat pets. If you've played other PvP games, think about how many really did a good job of balancing pet classes. As a rule, pet classes are always either too strong or too weak in PvP, because either the player is good without the pets so the pets make them too strong, or the player is balanced around having the pets most of the time so they are too weak when the pets get killed. The other problem is that either the pets are too vulnerable so players kill them a lot, or they are nearly as tough as another player so they don't get killed at all. I can't think of an MMO where they got PvP pets right, they *always* alternate between being underpowered and overpowered. Combat pets are one of those things that really ought to be left out if you design a PvP game -- no one has ever done them well.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 22
06-20-2011, 05:39 AM
Time to fix torpedo spread. Full aoe, great spread, full dmg to shields. Enough to clear the ****, but less burst than HYT.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 23 Best Idea since Oct. 2009
06-20-2011, 06:09 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveHale View Post
I'd admit that it would be really nice to see them tweak the targeting option and UI to help us better deal with the amount of spam that we face at times. I do, however, take issue with the suggestion that this is specifically a Klink problem.
Wow this is a really god idea Hale, If only someone had thought about that before. Klinks are always a sepcific problem, but the targeting idea sounds great.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 24
06-20-2011, 08:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by havam
Wow this is a really god idea Hale, If only someone had thought about that before. Klinks are always a sepcific problem, but the targeting idea sounds great.
Yes, its klinks that are the problem, not the MVAM Sci Spammers with mines and scorpions. No thats fine, but if they got ridged foreheads its bad ju-ju.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 25
06-20-2011, 09:29 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ardept View Post
But.......no wait what the hell, when ur rite ur rite, you tell um tiger.

AFK for a popcorn run
Truer words were never posted on an internet forum, do you perchance know this player:


http://www.burningsea.com/forums/sho...ight=pitchfork

From my viewpoint, make friends with a good Tac, learn a few basic combo's and watch the carriers go pop pop pop!

But I'm very new and an extremely average player.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 26
06-20-2011, 10:38 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alastor_Forthright View Post
Yes, its klinks that are the problem, not the MVAM Sci Spammers with mines and scorpions. No thats fine, but if they got ridged foreheads its bad ju-ju.
wow sarcasm translates poorly, thank god that some honorable warrior will start the QQ and make sure that irony won't get lost in this quadrant
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 27
06-20-2011, 03:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alastor_Forthright View Post
What game you playing? Carriers are far from the undefeatable mammoths you guys make them out to be. They've been nerfed so hard from release and now with FAW and C:SV as it is they're pets die within seconds. If they're not, you're either not using FAW/C:SV or got something wrong with your power output. Honestly, since launch the number of pets they can launch has been lowered, their shields have been nerfed, and they only have six total weapons despite being the biggest ship in the game. Even the Kar'fi carrier with its extra weapon slot is more than kill-able.
Well you're right, I don't run FAW in PVP, because when I do, people complain about how it's OP. And I generally do well enough with Overloads and Quantums. But as for PVE like Klingon Scout Force, sure, I use FAW quite a bit.

And considering Klingon PVP is now a PVE fest, maybe I should run FAW in there, as I am a beam-boat, and can't use C:SV. Or I could spec into cannons and be a turret boat

But I don't understand how Birds of Prey are supposed to be coming out of those carriers. I mean, BoPs are not THAT small of a ship. Fighters I could see, but BoPs? It just seems kinda ridiculous.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 28
06-20-2011, 04:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by inktomi19d View Post
Not to mention mines and scorpions. Neither of those have much effect other than making targeting difficult, so you can be pretty sure that when someone bothers to equip scorpions or is circling around in a cloud of mines, they are doing it specifically for the spam.

I wouldn't mind a general reduction in spam (even if numbers are reduced but power is increased), but it's definitely not just Klingons doing it. I'm a bit more tolerant of carriers doing it, since it's not possible to have a carrier without having it carry something.
Mines are a weapon, albeit a stationary one. An easy solution to this is not to limit how many mines can be placed, but to allow targeting beyond 10km for weapons like torpedoes where this would be realistic. This would also help to solve the issue of people fleeing just beyond the 10km targetin range when they're almost dead.

Even in the 1980s, air-to-air missiles had more of a range than 10km -- and that's with a projectile that requires continuous propulsion. 1980s cruise missiles can fly for 1700km. Spam like this would be less relevant with better targeting and longer-range weaponry.

Quote:
I kind of think this is one of those divisions between PvE-players and PvP-players -- PvE players seem to love combat pets. If you've played other PvP games, think about how many really did a good job of balancing pet classes. As a rule, pet classes are always either too strong or too weak in PvP, because either the player is good without the pets so the pets make them too strong, or the player is balanced around having the pets most of the time so they are too weak when the pets get killed. The other problem is that either the pets are too vulnerable so players kill them a lot, or they are nearly as tough as another player so they don't get killed at all. I can't think of an MMO where they got PvP pets right, they *always* alternate between being underpowered and overpowered. Combat pets are one of those things that really ought to be left out if you design a PvP game -- no one has ever done them well.
I know "pets" is a term from fantasy/magic MMOs like WoW, and I know Cryptic is copying a lot od those mechanics into STO... that's where I think they've gone wrong. It's not that I blame them for copying a winning formula, but I just think that it's stupid within the science fiction concept of Star Trek. I really think the whole model of PVP needs a complete overhaul, from the game types to the relation of the outcome to the ongoing game story. But anyways.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 29
06-20-2011, 05:10 PM

Grabs popcorn.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 30
06-20-2011, 05:14 PM
just for your information the runners are using evasive manuvers and ramming speed.
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