Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 11
06-21-2011, 02:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jermbot View Post
I'm not sure they would operate on the same procedures as Klingon ships. I recall quite distinctly an episode of DS9 where Worf was serving on General Martok's ship and General Martok was refusing to enter Dominion territory to retrieve a damaged Klingon ship and it's survivors. If you don't recall the episode, Worf called Martok a coward and challenged him right then and there for the captaincy of hi ship. Martok won the fight and was so invigorated by classic Klingon combat that he pushed his newly moralized men into Dominion territory, into the ambush he knew was waiting for them and out the other side victorious.

Now imagine that same situation, but replace Martok with an orion female. Do you really see her rising with hot blood and righteous anger at the accusations of cowardice being leveled at her by her first officer? Do you really see her giving him a fair fight? No, it wouldn't work.
I have a female Orion captain. Due to her background, having been adopted into a Klingon house, her outlook is just a bit more Klingon. While she wouldn't necessarily relish a fight, she would at least understand it and respond appropriately. She does have her own version of honor.

But she doesn't have to command by the 'Law of the Jungle'. You know why? Because she's still a full-blooded Orion female, and a right canny one. A good part of her crew is either in love with her or infatuated with her, and she knows it. They are all bent to her will one way or the other. Her biggest problem is really preventing her male crew from fighting over her (which is one reason why she does not allow herself to have relations with any of them). Few of them would actually challenge her, and those that would are either quietly transferred to other ships or taken care of by the rest of her crew.

The only thing she'd ever have to fear is another Orion female. You can be sure that she does NOT allow any other Orion women on her ship!
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 12
06-21-2011, 03:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jermbot View Post
Now imagine that same situation, but replace Martok with an orion female. Do you really see her rising with hot blood and righteous anger at the accusations of cowardice being leveled at her by her first officer? Do you really see her giving him a fair fight? No, it wouldn't work.
I have to give a similar response as bluegeek. My Orion girl, "Blayyde", earned her nickname when she was found, as a child, as the only survivor of a raid against Syndicate insurgent forces. She was holding a bloody dagger, and surrounded by bodies from both sides of the conflict.

Blayyde would likely laugh at accusations of cowardice, on the inside, but she's also aware of the importance of outside appearance, especially to Klingons. If one were to challenge her, she would meet the challenge head on. (And in keeping with her name, there is NO bladed weapon she is not an expert with, including the Bat'leth) She's actually not a seductive Orion female in the traditional sense, but she knows how to manipulate people, and can play the part of either Slave Girl or bloodthirsty KDF captain with equal skill.

The Timeline pretty much makes it clear that all of the Orions pretty much decided to blend in with Klingon culture when they migrated from their homeworld. Most of them probably see themselves as infiltrators and spies, but they can play the part. The same probably goes for the Gorn and Naussicans as well. And the mission text can only go so far, while I'd like to see some "backstabbing" or alternate choices for KDF missions that give you the chance to role play a more self serving type of character, I don't think it's that important.

Heck, even the Klingons have their version of Section 31, Klingon Intelligence, which is known for acting "dishonorably". Meaning, they are willing to stab their superiors in the back if needed to protect the Empire as a whole.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 13
06-22-2011, 10:30 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blayyde
I have to give a similar response as bluegeek. My Orion girl, "Blayyde", earned her nickname when she was found, as a child, as the only survivor of a raid against Syndicate insurgent forces. She was holding a bloody dagger, and surrounded by bodies from both sides of the conflict.

Blayyde would likely laugh at accusations of cowardice, on the inside, but she's also aware of the importance of outside appearance, especially to Klingons. If one were to challenge her, she would meet the challenge head on. (And in keeping with her name, there is NO bladed weapon she is not an expert with, including the Bat'leth) She's actually not a seductive Orion female in the traditional sense, but she knows how to manipulate people, and can play the part of either Slave Girl or bloodthirsty KDF captain with equal skill.

The Timeline pretty much makes it clear that all of the Orions pretty much decided to blend in with Klingon culture when they migrated from their homeworld. Most of them probably see themselves as infiltrators and spies, but they can play the part. The same probably goes for the Gorn and Naussicans as well. And the mission text can only go so far, while I'd like to see some "backstabbing" or alternate choices for KDF missions that give you the chance to role play a more self serving type of character, I don't think it's that important.

Heck, even the Klingons have their version of Section 31, Klingon Intelligence, which is known for acting "dishonorably". Meaning, they are willing to stab their superiors in the back if needed to protect the Empire as a whole.
You put alot of thought into your toon I see...and to tell you the truth I do the same thing...put alot of though tinto the name of my toons and such....
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 14
06-22-2011, 02:13 PM
So basically we can safely expect that non-Klingon officers in the KDF serve according to their own agendas and loyalty is going to vary from officer to officer.

Klingons not being stupid and being equally capable of manipulative behavior, it's also safe to say that these non-Klingon officers are:

a) Under close observation (read: you got a spy on your ship, and probably more than one)

b) Kept in line with rewards and punishments

c) Played against each other as necessary to maintain an acceptable status quo
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 15
06-22-2011, 03:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluegeek View Post
So basically we can safely expect that non-Klingon officers in the KDF serve according to their own agendas and loyalty is going to vary from officer to officer.

Klingons not being stupid and being equally capable of manipulative behavior, it's also safe to say that these non-Klingon officers are:

a) Under close observation (read: you got a spy on your ship, and probably more than one)

b) Kept in line with rewards and punishments

c) Played against each other as necessary to maintain an acceptable status quo
That's exactly my point. The carrot and stick they offer my Nausicaan pirate would be totally different from the carrot and stick used on a Klingon, Orion or Gorn. My Nausicaan would deal with NPC's in ways different from the standard Klingon, Orion, or Gorn reactions, sometimes in subtly different ways sometimes in dramatically different ways.

We all agree that they haven't written a Featured Episode that fits for both the Federation and KDF. They've come close but invariably you reach a problem and the solution involves apologizing, bartering or performing some mundane task that is a waste of time that destroys any KDF feel. But I'm saying it's even worse than that if you try to set a featured episode to that unique Klingon feel because that featured episode would not only destroy any Federation feel, it also would be some degree alien to the Trill, Orion, Nausicaan, Gorn and maybe even Lethean players in the KDF.

Not that it still isn't worth the effort of them to try. Put the Federation players in a "klingon costume" and have section 31 impress upon them the importance of 'maintaining their cover.' It wouldn't be any more aggravating for me to have my Nausicaan extolling the virtues of honor and dying in battle this time than it was when he was on the galley of the dead and it certainly wouldn't be any more aggravating than the task of fixing a lady a warm, medium strength drink in a little stemmed glass with a drop of honey but with a sour taste to it.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 16
06-23-2011, 07:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jermbot View Post
That's exactly my point. The carrot and stick they offer my Nausicaan pirate would be totally different from the carrot and stick used on a Klingon, Orion or Gorn. My Nausicaan would deal with NPC's in ways different from the standard Klingon, Orion, or Gorn reactions, sometimes in subtly different ways sometimes in dramatically different ways.

We all agree that they haven't written a Featured Episode that fits for both the Federation and KDF. They've come close but invariably you reach a problem and the solution involves apologizing, bartering or performing some mundane task that is a waste of time that destroys any KDF feel. But I'm saying it's even worse than that if you try to set a featured episode to that unique Klingon feel because that featured episode would not only destroy any Federation feel, it also would be some degree alien to the Trill, Orion, Nausicaan, Gorn and maybe even Lethean players in the KDF.

Not that it still isn't worth the effort of them to try. Put the Federation players in a "klingon costume" and have section 31 impress upon them the importance of 'maintaining their cover.' It wouldn't be any more aggravating for me to have my Nausicaan extolling the virtues of honor and dying in battle this time than it was when he was on the galley of the dead and it certainly wouldn't be any more aggravating than the task of fixing a lady a warm, medium strength drink in a little stemmed glass with a drop of honey but with a sour taste to it.
This one made me laugh...imagine the Naussican drinking from a stemmed glass with fuzzy slippers on...lol.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 17
06-23-2011, 11:01 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jermbot View Post
That's exactly my point. The carrot and stick they offer my Nausicaan pirate would be totally different from the carrot and stick used on a Klingon, Orion or Gorn. My Nausicaan would deal with NPC's in ways different from the standard Klingon, Orion, or Gorn reactions, sometimes in subtly different ways sometimes in dramatically different ways.

We all agree that they haven't written a Featured Episode that fits for both the Federation and KDF. They've come close but invariably you reach a problem and the solution involves apologizing, bartering or performing some mundane task that is a waste of time that destroys any KDF feel. But I'm saying it's even worse than that if you try to set a featured episode to that unique Klingon feel because that featured episode would not only destroy any Federation feel, it also would be some degree alien to the Trill, Orion, Nausicaan, Gorn and maybe even Lethean players in the KDF.

Not that it still isn't worth the effort of them to try. Put the Federation players in a "klingon costume" and have section 31 impress upon them the importance of 'maintaining their cover.' It wouldn't be any more aggravating for me to have my Nausicaan extolling the virtues of honor and dying in battle this time than it was when he was on the galley of the dead and it certainly wouldn't be any more aggravating than the task of fixing a lady a warm, medium strength drink in a little stemmed glass with a drop of honey but with a sour taste to it.
I totally agree with you.

But, the primary form of new content coming into the game right now are these faction-agnostic FE's. So that's the vehicle we have to educate players as to the "Klingon Way" and the "Gorn Way" and so on.

Hopefully we can get even more of those kinds of missions in the First City and when the Klingon Academy is released.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 18
06-27-2011, 06:59 PM
I'll say this about the KDF... it does allow for a *much* wider range of backgrounds. With the Federation, everybody is (pretty much) Starfleet personnel. it's much harder to come up with backgrounds like Kasensal's.

I do have a couple of 'oddity' Fed backgrounds (one from the MU, another couple from a planet that's applying for Fed membership and is in an 'officer exchange program' with Starfleet), but for the most part, everybody's mostly regular ol' Starfleet personnel.

On the KDF side, I have a bounty hunter, a privateer, a 'normal' KDF captain, a Federation dissident who feels more comfortable with Klingon 'honesty' in actions, and a couple others. It's just much easier to come up with a wider variety, it seems.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 19
06-27-2011, 08:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Destinii
I'll say this about the KDF... it does allow for a *much* wider range of backgrounds. With the Federation, everybody is (pretty much) Starfleet personnel. it's much harder to come up with backgrounds like Kasensal's.

I do have a couple of 'oddity' Fed backgrounds (one from the MU, another couple from a planet that's applying for Fed membership and is in an 'officer exchange program' with Starfleet), but for the most part, everybody's mostly regular ol' Starfleet personnel.

On the KDF side, I have a bounty hunter, a privateer, a 'normal' KDF captain, a Federation dissident who feels more comfortable with Klingon 'honesty' in actions, and a couple others. It's just much easier to come up with a wider variety, it seems.
I agree. I like my Feds but my KDF officers tend to be more interesting to me, there's more freedom.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 20
06-27-2011, 10:47 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Destinii
I'll say this about the KDF... it does allow for a *much* wider range of backgrounds. With the Federation, everybody is (pretty much) Starfleet personnel. it's much harder to come up with backgrounds like Kasensal's.

I do have a couple of 'oddity' Fed backgrounds (one from the MU, another couple from a planet that's applying for Fed membership and is in an 'officer exchange program' with Starfleet), but for the most part, everybody's mostly regular ol' Starfleet personnel.

On the KDF side, I have a bounty hunter, a privateer, a 'normal' KDF captain, a Federation dissident who feels more comfortable with Klingon 'honesty' in actions, and a couple others. It's just much easier to come up with a wider variety, it seems.
I never actually realized the KDF just let anyone waltz in and have a ship...no wonder they can't beat the federation training VS...random person with a BOP drinking Bloodwine
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