Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 21
06-10-2011, 01:28 AM
The devs have clarified to say you can reference characters but not show them... and have expanded that out to ships, bizarrely enough.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 22 The foundry
07-02-2011, 12:00 PM
I can't make a Character on the foundry does it have some thing with having a Demo account?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 23
07-02-2011, 03:16 PM
Quote:
If you sign up to be a Reviewer then you have another EULA that you must agree to as well:


Community Authored Content Reviewer - End User License Agreement

By signing up to be a Reviewer for the Star Trek Online Foundry, you are agreeing to be exposed to unreviewed community authored content. Such content will likely include offensive and distasteful information. Do not accept unless you are willing to view such content. Reviewers must be over 18 years of age or older.

You agree to review content in the context of appropriateness for all ages, and for violation of the End User License Agreement (EULA) for author that can be found on the Star Trek Online web site. The other players of the game are relying on your judgment to help identify inappropriate content.

You can revoke your reviewer status at any time.

I am over 18 and wish to accept Reviewer status.


I see two problems with this:

1) A typo. It should say; "...Agreement for authors that can be found..."

2) The Foundry EULA actually isn't on the Star Trek Online website.
the thing about this *ahem* 'agreement' is that its asking for trouble from parents. the reason is simple: the agreement states that you have to be 18+ to enter into it. if the player is not 18 or over the player cannot legally agree to that agreement or any other - including the games EULA and tos, technically. this is because according to US law a minor cannot enter into a contract or any other form of legal agreement without the express written permission of the parents of that minor. since cryptic doesn't actually confirm a persons age when they play the game and anybody of any age can sign up (even a 10 year old can get ahold of a prepaid visa) one day cryptic could get a headache from an annoyed parent or parents (who possibly don't even know their child is playing this game) when they try to enforce one of these agreements.

therefore my suggestion is to improve upon these agreements and make it so there is an actual age verification before agreeing.

Quote:
If we cannot use historical figures or names, isn't the agreement in violation of the law? And if the ships name's are not owned buy any person or any corporation, then how can that be in violation of the EULA since none of the entities in the agreement own those names.
well....yeah if you want to get really into it theres a way around almost everything. technically you're correct, but it would be a headache to take it up with cryptic

Quote:
Also, I see people using the named USS Arizona in the game. The ship is still a commissioned as a US warship. I thought it was against the law to use the name USS Arizona and USS Maine to represent any ship because it is a war memorial for the people who died on the ship
yes this is true. but like many laws, few people know about things like that and fewer care to enforce it

Quote:
According to the EULA you cannot have any characters from Star Trek appear in your missions. Nor can you have 'historical figures.' I interpret historical figures to mean "real people from history that are famous." I do not guarantee that the GMs will agree with that interpretation however.
it doesn't matter what a GM agrees or doesn't agree with. they can only enforce a rule, not expand on it themselves, or they violate the agreement. as long as you don't push it or make a major direct reference there isn't very much anybody can do about it

Quote:
And, legal or not, if you violate these rules, and someone reports you, you may lose access to the Foundry
this is blatantly untrue. people can report you for anything. if it is legal it is legal. nobody can stop you from using the foundry in a legal manner. if they attempt to do so they have violated your rights and are asking for trouble.

the moral of the story is don't do anything stupid and don't give cryptic a reason to do anything stupid and we won't have to worry about issues like these.

Quote:
I can't make a Character on the foundry does it have some thing with having a Demo account?
if you are using a demo account I would think so. makes sense that the foundry would be restricted to full accounts.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 24
07-02-2011, 04:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhodes85 View Post
the thing about this *ahem* 'agreement' is that its asking for trouble from parents.
The actual reason for this is that it protects Cryptic Studios from legal action by said parents.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhodes85
therefore my suggestion is to improve upon these agreements and make it so there is an actual age verification before agreeing.
The EULA was written by their corporate lawyers. It's unlikely that they're going to change this agreement unless you call Cryptic Studios and give them your Bar Number.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhodes85
yes this is true. but like many laws, few people know about things like that and fewer care to enforce it
This is not true. There is no US law that covers what you can name an imaginary space ship in a video game.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhodes85
this is blatantly untrue. people can report you for anything. if it is legal it is legal. nobody can stop you from using the foundry in a legal manner. if they attempt to do so they have violated your rights and are asking for trouble.
This is completely true. People have already had their Foundry access revoked for violating these rules. I'm not guessing on this, StormShade (a Cryptic employee) has confirmed that this has happened.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 25
07-02-2011, 06:20 PM
Quote:
The actual reason for this is that it protects Cryptic Studios from legal action by said parents.
No it doesn't. re-read what I said. To simplify: the player is a 10 year old kid, he signs up to use the foundry. in this situation the parents have agreed to nothing, the child has also agreed to nothing because according to US law a minor can't enter into such an agreement with any company. So in short, Cryptic would not be protected from said parents because no consent was given and nothing is binding on a minor. Is it likely to happen here? probably not. But theres no reason it can't happen, which is why it is important to be careful about age verification. It is also the same reason several porn companies have been screwed over royally by parents over the years for using 'models' who were underage at the time. Not all that uncommon with some seedier companies like that.

Quote:
The EULA was written by their corporate lawyers. It's unlikely that they're going to change this agreement unless you call Cryptic Studios and give them your Bar Number.
it is very likely it would be changed if a very annoyed parent started causing trouble. Just because its written by a lawyer doesn't mean its legal. Have you watched the news recently? All kinds of companies get sued all the time. drug companies especially. The agreements, tos's, EULAs, notices of non responsibility, etc.. are all done up by corporate lawyers. That doesn't mean they are legal, or that said lawyers are even competent. You would be amazed at what some companies try to get away with

Quote:
This is not true. There is no US law that covers what you can name an imaginary space ship in a video game.
who said anything about a space ship in a video game? as far as those types of laws are concerned this is a commercial interest - in the case of the foundry it is copyrighted material that is developed by people for a company, which makes it their responsibility to keep stuff like that out of it. the medium it is created in is irrelevant. Such things are just as serious regardless of its a video game or not. No different than what the copyright nazis would do to cryptic if dstahl suddenly added shatners license to the game as kirk without his permission (before jumping on that one on the basis of mccoy and scotty being in the game, those were much easier to use given the fact that at the time they were added to the game both actors were dead)

Quote:
This is completely true. People have already had their Foundry access revoked for violating these rules. I'm not guessing on this, StormShade (a Cryptic employee) has confirmed that this has happened.
I didn't say for violating rules. I said they can't punish or revoke access to a service you are paying for, for doing something that is legal.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 26
07-05-2011, 08:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhodes85 View Post
I didn't say for violating rules. I said they can't punish or revoke access to a service you are paying for, for doing something that is legal.
Yes; and PF told you, correctly, that they have in fact done exactly this, and it's perfectly legal for them to do so, because when you payed them your money you AGREED THEY COULD. In writing.

And yes, clicking "accept" counts as a signature in the US, since 1998.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 27
07-08-2011, 02:33 AM
Personally I am a bit dubious about some of the "clarifications" we've been given regarding the Foundry ToS. I'm not entirely convinced they are actually valid based on what we agreed to (nothing in the actual text says anything even close).

However, it's easier just to abide by the expanded rules than argue about them, especially since Cryptic are the ones who are enforcing them. If they believe the Terms mean one thing, even if they are flat out wrong, there's no way you can really win that battle unless you're going to go way beyond reasonable bounds and resort to legal action or something along those lines.

Just use the Foundry the way they say to. It's simply not worth making a fuss about it.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 28
07-10-2011, 12:42 AM
Quote:
  • You may not use copyrighted content from the Properties, including but not limited to web content, promotional materials (posters, advertisements) or existing licensed merchandise (novels, trading cards, figurines).
Does this apply to "Needs of the Many" as well?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 29
02-12-2012, 12:58 PM
I was hoping to create a mission that has Hugh and Worf in it, looks like I'll have to scrub that idea now. Dang. The Foundry EULA is a wash-out, makes creating real content with people we aint seen for ever impossible.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 30
02-26-2012, 12:23 PM
Two questions.

1: Can I depict planets from episodes, such as Talos IV?

2: I am considering an episode with Soong type androids, (which always look like Data, Lore, B4, etc...)
Would this episode follow the EULA?
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