Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 1 meaningful pvp system
07-08-2011, 02:47 PM
now that season 4 is out i have to say i love the new combat system they have come out with.Now it is time to have some meaningful pvp system aswell.As a former SWG and EVE player what i would like to see is game play that has alittle of both games.I love base take down in swg and i loved the risk that pvp had in eve.I feel that pvp needs to be meaningfull it should have some cost and some risk to it.If i want to play king of the hill or capture the flag or just death match i would play on my ps3 or Xbox 360.this being an mmo i feel we need more depth and risk and a just reward for pvping.so here is a small out line of what i was thinking would be fun.
1-fleet makes a shipyard
2-fleet places shipyard and fuels it and gives it resourse so that the shipyard can then make npc ship to protect it self.
3-diffrent combos of resourse makes diffrent type of npc ships
4-opposing faction has to kill npc ships then land on base with eng,tack,science officers to do some sort of mini game to start a timer that would make the shipyard selfdestructed.
5-shipyard owner have to protect the shipyard aswell so you could have space and ground pvp going on at the same time.
6-fleets that have alot of shipyards out can get a bouns to the fleets better damage or better speed or better tank bounes.
7-fleets that have the most take downs could get bounes aswell.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 2 I would support this
07-08-2011, 03:52 PM
I have longed for this since beta - meaningful engagement with the sectors so they are not just large vacant parking lots Resource gathering and some form of contruction is the next evolution. I'm certain its on the horizon.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 3
07-10-2011, 09:48 AM
i would have hoped the dev could give us some insight on this subject by now or atlest have read this threed.i hope more player get behind this threed and put in some good iders.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 4 This is what I would do
07-11-2011, 02:16 PM
This is how I would do it.

See Reference map.

Players could if they want to pick up the persistent PvP as a mission. As part of the mission they get a roster of available postings and they then send through their assignment. When they have has enough they can remove themselves from active duty. Fleet could assign teams of five to an active duty roster. No matter where the players are, they would receive a “Message from Starfleet” or “Klingon High Command” warning them of an incursion into their sector and they would warp to the location.

Each planet on the map could be broken into smaller 5 x 5 “quadrants”, with the planet positioned at the center. The outer quadrants could be regarded as the sector’s “frontier” while the central ring would be the “colonial” zone.

Planets could be remodeled to represent their standing either within the U.F.P or the Klingon Empire. They would have point assigned to them based on allegiance, technology, natural resources based on class of planet and culture based on socio-political factors, and economy.

Allegiance

Planets allegiance is scaled from 1 – 10, one being rebellious to 10 loyal. The sectors are thriving socio-political undertakings each requiring needs to be fulfilled. This could tie in closely with the current diplomacy aspect of the game and the upcoming DOFF system. Planets and their citizens have needs, and grievances that need to be addressed by the parent faction. Should these needs or wants not be met within a certain time period, the allegiance rating would fall. A faction unable to provide protection against attacks would also be frowned upon. These attacks could take the following forms.

Frontier zones could suffer from periodic pirate & marauder activities in the form of PvE Fleet episodes, team episodes and single-player mission.

The Federation could use Diplomacy to undermine the Klingon planet allegiances through means of escorting diplomatic missions – these can be intercepted and related to the Klingon High Council. How this would work is that through the DOFF system ambassadors would be assigned to team ships in the fleet. These ambassadors’, players would transport to worlds to engage in talks. The Klingon Faction would as a direct counter be assigning DOFFS to counter espionage, and when success is achieved in the rating between the diplomacy vs. espionage fails, the Klingon Faction would receive a communiqué of the intended meeting, and thus be able to dispatch a group to intercept. This would result in a PvP instance on ground or in space. The opposite of this could be something like the Klingons engaging on sabotage or assassination in U.F.P planets.

As I said, planets have needs. They will produce a quota of harvest goods required from the parent faction in control of the sector. These could include data, commodities and the introduction of the harvesting of minerals, mining and farming on the planet’s surface.

Technology

Planets are each assigned a technological rating from 1 – 20, 1 being pre-warp and 20 being extremely advanced. As a planet grows and develops “developmental slots” are opened-up on the planet. These can range from areas where farms could be build (by the players themselves through planting etc) to the research/ construction of shipyards, outposts, and other useful structures.

Each planet is known for something special related to that culture. These rewards could be unlocked when certain milestones are reached and special abilities, etc. could be accessible to the controlling faction.

Natural Resources

The frontier zone is the area where resources could be harvested. Players could do mining duty whereby they equip their ships with special harvesting gear (minimal return/ combat), or captain a freighter (high return/ small combat capability) which would require an armed escort possibly from mates. The frontier is violent and unpredictable, and is constantly under threat of attack.

Resources would consist of nebulas, gas pockets, asteroids, anomalies, and on the surface of the planet mineral outcrops, mines and farms.

Culture

Culture would play an important role in determining what benefits the sector could bestow on the controlling faction, as well as the possible unique rewards of each. Entire storylines could be built around this, and the foundry could provide rich content for each!

Persistence PvP

Each sector would have a point allocation for the zone-of-control e.g. 500. This could be determined by its proximity to Sol or Qo’noS. The first faction to capture the sector gains control of the sector, resources and its benefits. The losers are expelled and received a negative modifier against the allegiance rating the next time they retake the area. So the more you lose a region, the more hostile the citizens become. Rebellious sectors can spawn violent uprisings in terms of Space PvE and Ground PvE where installation are attack and must be defended.

The first faction to gain control through a PPvP (persistence PvP) match ie. wins the 90% majorty of the points, gains the title to construct a starbase. The first Starbase will always be within the Colonial Zone. Once constructed this will serve as an outpost for the faction, and if the frontier is to be breached it must be captured by the opposing side in the form of 20/20 PvP majority wins in space over any period of time, in additional to the majority wins in the allocation of the zone-of-control points. The starbase therefore adds an extra layer of defense against attack, in fact raising the number of points required to capture the sector. This is a mammoth undertaking. Resources have to be gathered and the starbase then needs to be constructed. It must be something where the players can really stand back, saying we made that!

What do you think?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 5
07-11-2011, 02:53 PM
that sould like fun aslong as there some risk and gaine i am all for it
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 6
07-11-2011, 03:14 PM
Small incremental steps.

Step 1:

Have the S4 PvP system fixed and implemented.

There is a system that was briefly activated, whereby KDF players got missions to attack Fed assets in Fed Space. This generated an Open PvP object, rather like the Deep Space Encounter things.

Yeah, this isn't all inclusive. I would like to see starbase construction and operation, fleet assets, territory control, etc. However, these things must be build one layer at a time, in small increments.

So, for right now, we need to see that initial step implemented. If it works well and is popular, then Cryptic will be able to move forward with more detailed and comprehensive aspects.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 7
07-14-2011, 03:40 PM
way back before the nge my bountyhunter guild <TH> Tharwn Hammer on the bria server placed pvp and pve bases around a reb city called Mos Nilhil.We cause so much lag that some of the player could not even get out of there house and you could see all the bases on the space map.We called it Operation Maw.And from what i here some of the bases still stand today and more than likely will be up till the servers shut down.Yeah Good Times .I would like to have that same feeling in sto.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 8
07-14-2011, 09:04 PM
Whilst ideas like this are good and all, you have to be careful. The system the OP has described is very close to the POS system control mechanic that Eve Online got rid of late last year.

It was an extremely tedious system for several reasons:

- supplying the towers with materials required grinding and farming - either for money to buy them or by harvesting
- taking down the towers was a PITA - high HP values, plus the inevitable lag the battles caused
- also, taking down towers could be manipulated by alarm clock operations - the attackers all got online at a certain time (usually their opponent's sleep time) to ensure no resistance. This was fixed by adding in the multi-stage attack, but that just caused alarm clock ops for all sides

I also do not like the idea of bonuses for fleets with more bases. This would mean that the more "hardcore" and larger fleets would have an inherent advantage in PvP. And that would just force out the little guys and independents who know they can't compete against the bigger fleets.

The mechanic also allows for griefing of smaller/more casual fleets by larger/more hardcore ones, who simply overwhelm their opponents by weight of numbers. Why should smaller fleets not be able to enjoy the fruits of their own labour, simply because some fat cat decides they want an easy kill.

Ultimately, STO is a fun game, not a full sandbox like Eve. Mechanics that mean you have to play a certain way are a bad move in this respect. We have to have a freedom of choice and balance between those choices.

However, dkfrontier's idea does show a bit more promise. But again, you have to be careful about building a starbase - Eve has a mechanic which allow for players to build their own stations, and space is starting to get a bit cluttered because of this.

Now, negatives out of the way...

The instances allowing PvPvE with the Klingon raids is a good first step in this direction. As long as the standard PvE option remains for those who don't want PvP (choice, remember), I support it.

The next step would be to introduce a similar mechanic in a dedicated space area, allowing players to patrol and intercept. Add in a few NPC patrols and convoys as catalysts. Not the current neutral zone, as some of the lower-level missions, three dalies, and not to mention the entire Dividian series, are set there, and you don't want to alienate lower-level players (who many not want to get ganked by admirals looking for a cheap thrill).

Maybe set up the gap between Granalda and K-7 as a new sector block entirely, specifically for OPvP. It still allows those who don't want PvP to avoid it, and doesn't cut off the dalies and force the KDF through 5 sector blocks simply to get to the Orellius sector (as opposed to the Feds 2). Also, setting it up in the KDF-Fed Neutral zone would leave out the Romulans once they're introduced, and the Cardassians (if they ever get in).

Third step would be to introduce objectives, much like dkfrontier set out. Let it end up as a three-way RvR (Fed, KDF, Romulan) or even 5-way (add in Cardassian and Dominion) fight, with Borg, Undine and Iconian raiders to add to the mayhem.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 9
07-14-2011, 09:30 PM
Flash idea - new OPvP sector could be a real frontier.

Put it in the Gamma Quadrant, accessible via the Bajoran Wormhole to begin with, and then the feds build a Transwarp to it that the KDF and Romulans hack into. Perfect setting for OPvP.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 10
07-15-2011, 08:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by draco84oz View Post
Flash idea - new OPvP sector could be a real frontier.

Put it in the Gamma Quadrant, accessible via the Bajoran Wormhole to begin with, and then the feds build a Transwarp to it that the KDF and Romulans hack into. Perfect setting for OPvP.
I like this idea. If I were to tack this on to my idea in another thread....

Transwarp gateway gets built around sol base and qu'nos.

Gateway leads to an emprty zone with a few trader ships etc etc.

Zone is open to KDF and feds who start "deep space encounters" as OPEN PvP.

Zone has clusters that can be explored.

At the end of a certain period of time, calculate the win/loss ratio of either side. This turns into a percentage that gives the winning faction a larger probability to explore new worlds in clusters that are "hidden content". This hidden content can change every PvP period like episodes. these exploration missions can vary and be very hard and yeild good end game equipment.

So this system provides

1. Open PvP
2. The new frontier that everyone wants to explore
3. End Game
4.Easy way to introduce additional content
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