Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 21
10-06-2011, 03:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Data
Roach, after playing World of Tanks that is how it is set up. You have different classes Tank killers, general tanks, artillery you start off in small weak tanks and work your way up. a Tier 1 tank stands no chance against a tier 10 tank of course the general tank is broken into 3 categories like light, heavy, and medium tanks. While there is a little rock, paper scissors the game relies on tactics and innate abilities of the tanks. Arty hits from a distance, tank destroyers kill tanks but do not have manuvuerabilty and do not have 360 turrets where as light tanks move fast and hit softly and die quickly, mediums are a little slower but hit harder and are harder to kill and heavies move slow, hit really hard, and are hard to kill. To kill arty get in close, to kill a tank destroyer stay out of its frontal arc, to kill a general tank kill its tracks and make it stationary.
+1 this post

I agree with you there Cap, the checks and balances in this other game are very clear and the match making is..ok as a straight up pvp expereinces..its pretty ..prime.

Would it be interesting to see similar weighting issues in STO? Yes. Have the ability to go up against a mess of 'ighter' ships while having a few 'heavies' on your side? and having those ships actually be able to contribute to a fight? yes and yes
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 22
10-06-2011, 06:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wcnighthawk View Post

But really, why do healing classes complain they can't do damage, I don't understand. It's like a Holy Paladin or Priest complaining they can't kill anything. I would hope they aren't trying to begin with. You're right though, some powers are over the top.
Engineers are really not a healing class. If you were talking about protecting others, science is actually way better for it due to Science Fleet and the dampening field.

The only thing engineers have going for them as healers is that they might be able to put all of their heals on cool down helping someone else, and still have MW and RSF to protect themselves. In space, Engineers lack both offense and defense (except for defending their own ship).
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 23
10-07-2011, 04:08 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by admneal View Post
If you bothered to read the post, the main point was - what good is it that my best heal buys a person a few extra secs of life before they are blown up anyway?
Because instant heals don't keep people alive, resists do. If you are expecting engineering team to "keep someone alive", politely, you are doing it wrong. Not that eng team has anything to do with being an eng captain anyway. Are you criticizing engineers, or engineering team?

Quote:
As far, as your rant on beams, I yet to see a half decent escort not have the ability to keep targets in their arcs. From what I see most just follow a target and just keep blasting until they get the kill. Damage output have zero restrictions on how high you can push them, and escorts having far too good of defenses is one of the main sources of imbalance. Sub Nub in another overused and exploited power, that while counter-able, effects game play in a way no other class gets.

At this point, with nothing new to do in the game, pvp was something I could turn to have some fun. Not really anymore....12/20 cant get here fast enough!
I wasn't aware it was a rant, you seem to be the only one getting worked up. Projecting much?

Escort vs escort is is VERY common for there to be a period when the target is not in your direct arc, and half decent escort pilot can abuse firing arcs and get out of the firing line. You cannot "just follow" another escort. It is in this role, as escort neutraliser, that beams can be very effective on an escort by getting above or below them and broadsiding.
That aside, beams are fine on other ships, better suited in fact. I honestly don't know where you are coming from, because you suggest the majority of decent non-escort setups in this game are in fact useless, which is bunk.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 24
10-07-2011, 07:43 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artificialx
Because instant heals don't keep people alive, resists do. If you are expecting engineering team to "keep someone alive", politely, you are doing it wrong. Not that eng team has anything to do with being an eng captain anyway. Are you criticizing engineers, or engineering team?



I wasn't aware it was a rant, you seem to be the only one getting worked up. Projecting much?

Escort vs escort is is VERY common for there to be a period when the target is not in your direct arc, and half decent escort pilot can abuse firing arcs and get out of the firing line. You cannot "just follow" another escort. It is in this role, as escort neutraliser, that beams can be very effective on an escort by getting above or below them and broadsiding.
That aside, beams are fine on other ships, better suited in fact. I honestly don't know where you are coming from, because you suggest the majority of decent non-escort setups in this game are in fact useless, which is bunk.
What your talking about and what I'm talking about are two different things. You are mixing beams with cannons, I'm talking just a straight beam build on any ship. And no, beams aren't fine. Awhile ago, some person named like 11 of 29 was ranting on how he quit OPVP and how unbalanced the game was because some escort tanked 4 ships. Guess who was piloting that escort ship And guess what all those ships were using...all lame beams. He accused me of double shielding, I politely told him beams don't do jack for dps and I stand by it.

It's not because I have super shields or double shield or any other lame excuse he can think of, it's simply because beams don't have any punch to them. Sorry, just the way the cookie crumble's. Using beams to just straight dps doesn't work.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 25
10-07-2011, 08:15 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wcnighthawk View Post
It's not because I have super shields or double shield or any other lame excuse he can think of, it's simply because beams don't have any punch to them. Sorry, just the way the cookie crumble's. Using beams to just straight dps doesn't work.
your statement is still not accurate. For "straight" dps, beams do fine. theyre a consistant form of dps that adds up quickly for "straight" dps. "burst" dps on the other hand is better covered by cannons. Sure a BO3 is powerful every 15-30 seconds, but a bank of DHC's and turrets constantly firing on a target with a CRF every 15-30 seconds will produce better burst results.

FYI, in a 4v1 situation, if the 4 cant kill 1 escort (unless the escort is running which isnt considered tanking) the 4 are doing it wrong.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 26
10-07-2011, 11:01 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wcnighthawk View Post
What your talking about and what I'm talking about are two different things. You are mixing beams with cannons, I'm talking just a straight beam build on any ship.
No that was just an example of one of my builds. I also have an "all beam" escort which I referred to earlier. He runs Target Engines3, Target Weapons3 and Target Shields 2 on 6 single beams. His burst comes from TS2 or HY2 depending on how cheesy I feel from 1 launcher up front. He still manages very well against all classes of ships, including other escorts. As I said before you don't have to hit as hard when your target is a sitting duck with broken shields and peanuts for damage (I will usually pre-buff one target subs so I can fire another off straight after). Again, it is all about play style. If beams aren't working for someone it is because their expectations do not match reality. That does not make them useless. And on non-escort ships they provide invaluable constant DPS.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fallout23 View Post
y

FYI, in a 4v1 situation, if the 4 cant kill 1 escort (unless the escort is running which isnt considered tanking) the 4 are doing it wrong.
This is the straight truth. The fact you tanked 4 ships does not mean beams are crap, it means the players are crap. I have nearly burst out laughing at my AE tanking 5 ships, yet I have also encountered single cruisers with beams that made me sweat.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 27
10-07-2011, 02:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by fallout23 View Post
FYI, in a 4v1 situation, if the 4 cant kill 1 escort (unless the escort is running which isnt considered tanking) the 4 are doing it wrong.
So what does that say about 8 that couldn't kill my raptor in a CnH one night. IF it wasn't for respawn I would have killed all eight
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 28
10-07-2011, 06:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artificialx
Because instant heals don't keep people alive, resists do. If you are expecting engineering team to "keep someone alive", politely, you are doing it wrong. Not that eng team has anything to do with being an eng captain anyway. Are you criticizing engineers, or engineering team?



I wasn't aware it was a rant, you seem to be the only one getting worked up. Projecting much?

Escort vs escort is is VERY common for there to be a period when the target is not in your direct arc, and half decent escort pilot can abuse firing arcs and get out of the firing line. You cannot "just follow" another escort. It is in this role, as escort neutraliser, that beams can be very effective on an escort by getting above or below them and broadsiding.
That aside, beams are fine on other ships, better suited in fact. I honestly don't know where you are coming from, because you suggest the majority of decent non-escort setups in this game are in fact useless, which is bunk.
Hull Resists caps at what? 50% while damage caps at... oh there is no cap. My problem lies in the fact that healing and damage are both at an extreme. There is zero point in tossing heals to a person and still have them die. All the bonus sets and powers just exaggerates the problems of a flawed system.

I never stated that other ships are useless... the title of the tread is Too Unbalanced. Sorry, if I think that some sci powers are overpowered, or that escorts can tank too well. You only support the status quo because it benefits you. Once again everyone is an expert...
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 29
10-07-2011, 07:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Data
So what does that say about 8 that couldn't kill my raptor in a CnH one night. IF it wasn't for respawn I would have killed all eight
It says that Im glad I wasnt one of the 8...how embarrasing....
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 30
10-07-2011, 07:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by admneal View Post
Hull Resists caps at what? 50% while damage caps at... oh there is no cap. My problem lies in the fact that healing and damage are both at an extreme. There is zero point in tossing heals to a person and still have them die.
Are you saying that a Engyteam3 heal should grant immunity to your target? Of course ppl can still die if they're healed...
If your point is that heal resistance isn't keeping up with damage output in this game...then....well...Im not sure what else we can tell you...
wait...try playing as an escort and seeing how hard it is to get around all the mitigation there is right now?

Quote:
Originally Posted by admneal View Post
Once again everyone is an expert...
yeah opinions are like buttholes, everyone has one and they usually stink. Who started this thread anyhow...?
lol...jk
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