Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 61
11-29-2011, 01:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aelfwin View Post
In short , their answer to potential bugs in the system is to allow us to sail through missions by making them easy ... -- heck they even ask for recommendations for missions that they can make easier .

After I re-read that post to make sure I did not misunderstand (I was hoping I did ...) , my response was :
"Were this a phone call to a service provider , this would be the point I would ask to talk with a supervisor ."

As I said in the beginning , this is I believe a partial reason for the quote from D'Angelo .
I also agree with a previous poster who said that one of the reasons they may think that VA's are a minority is because so many players have quit at lower levels .
We have to remember... they want this game to be entertaining for the casual player. Having missions that are "unbeatable" for casual gamers who have zero understanding of the more advanced mechanics and are honestly just here for a good time isn't exactly a great way to make sure those people stick around.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 62
11-29-2011, 01:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by breakout View Post
Can I posit a possible motive and get some feedback?
What is the possibility Cryptic is creating the fast low level pace to create a false expectation in the higher ranks? new players zoom through low levels and upon hitting commander their progress slows considerably. Thus making them feel as if they need better ships, and gear to compete and get through high end content, so off to the c-store they go to buy ships and c points then to the dilithium exchange to start buying high end weapons? ..... Nah they wouldn't be doing that would they
Despite having a fairly shortleveling curve, the first 10-20 levels of STO feel much slower than other games. Most MMOs as far as I know have lightning fast low levels (as in, kill five enemies and ding a level) and much slower high levels, regardless of whether they have cash shops or a sub model.

New players require insane amounts of encouragement or they quit.

I know more than one person who quit or nearly quit because the low levels took more than 10 minutes a piece, even though they'd be more comfortable with high levels taking an hour a piece.

MMO players expect a steep curve. If low levels take too long, they will believe that the high levels do as well.

Plus, again, new players need a pat on the back every 10-20 minutes or so for the first few hours of play or they will assume that they're bad at the game (I know some experienced gamers who felt like they were bad at STO) or that effort isn't adequately rewarded. Even moreso with people who've played lots of other contemporary MMOs andoperate under the assumption that new players will be showered with 10x the rate of congratulation and reward as endgame players will, making them assume endgame will be a grind of 200 hours for a single root beer or shield consumable and 1,000 hours of playtime for green gear -- because they expect the exponential reward slowdown.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 63
11-29-2011, 02:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leviathan99
Despite having a fairly shortleveling curve, the first 10-20 levels of STO feel much slower than other games. Most MMOs as far as I know have lightning fast low levels (as in, kill five enemies and ding a level) and much slower high levels, regardless of whether they have cash shops or a sub model.
I wouldn't say "most". When MMOs mature it's natural that they increase the leveling speed especially when they increase the level cap and add new endgame, but there are still games that have a LOT slower leveling speed than STO. **** and Perfect World for example. It only feels slow when you compare it to WoW that's had 3 expansions already. Of course the illusion of slow leveling is perpetuated by the fact that Miranda is just plain horrible to fly and unless you pick an escort (or C-Store ship) at Lt Commander you won't see much improvement.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 64
11-29-2011, 03:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LordOfPit View Post
You do realize that what you just said means that anyone can just download the STO client, play the entire game and level up their character from Lv1 to max-level without actually grinding or buying anything from the C-Store and then either decide to put some coin in the box, or just leave?

That's a wonderful proposition Cryptic is putting on the table for any casual gamer!
Who said I didn't grind, even with accelerated learning. I spent from a Friday to a Wednesday to get to VA1 on Tribble. I have a job and a wife and kids, and I still spent most my free time during those days getting to VA1. Of course, this was before they actually made doff's work right. The initial release was kinda stinko.

I finished from 43 to 51 between Sunday to Wednesday..using the doff system which I spent $90 on, in order to stress test and report issues with the system.

Of COURSE we don't have to grind or buy from the cstore.

We can always choose to have sucky low end equipment.

That is what you use, right? Of course you do, I bet you defeat elite STFs using level II stuff.


But that isn't the point. The point is that Cryptic ramped up training so that people can't EARN loot at the rate at which they progress. Which means when they hit VA1 that if they want the high end gear, they have to pay for it, or spend time grinding out the currency.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 65
11-29-2011, 03:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by breakout View Post
Can I posit a possible motive and get some feedback?
What is the possibility Cryptic is creating the fast low level pace to create a false expectation in the higher ranks? new players zoom through low levels and upon hitting commander their progress slows considerably. Thus making them feel as if they need better ships, and gear to compete and get through high end content, so off to the c-store they go to buy ships and c points then to the dilithium exchange to start buying high end weapons? ..... Nah they wouldn't be doing that would they
I surmise that this is close to the truth.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 66
11-29-2011, 05:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by The.Grand.Nagus View Post
Yes, this a direct contradiction of what we were previously told about leveling being too fast.
Not quite. Cryptic really borked the leveling progression as I remember nearly universal complaints about how fast Captain goes by during the early days of the games while the lowest tier was a worse grind.

The quote in the OP is saying that leveling in the lower ranges is speeding up. This doesn't mean the entire game is--just a rank. The net (to--level-cap) time might be longer still. These concepts are not incompatible.

The leveling experience after that is going to still slow down, particularly since appropriate tiered ships and gear are soft-locked behind higher costs via dilithium. thus both what D'Angelo said (speaking generally) and what the quote says (speaking specifically about the lowest tier) can be true at once. They're not mutually exclusive.

This actually seems like a good idea as the early game was always too slow (especially till LtCmdr--when content opened) but the rest of the game flew by too quickly.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 67
11-29-2011, 05:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LordOfPit View Post
I speculate that Cryptic is speeding up leveling to increase the frequency with which players are encouraged to interact with the Dilithium/CP Exchange (not to mention buy CP's), which I think they must do to speed up the point where they would start making money again after the loss of subscription fees.
I think this is exactly why they are doing this. Then they add on the dilithium tax to existing subs so that they will hopefully be forced to do the same.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 68
11-29-2011, 05:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darren_Kitlor
The quote in the OP is saying that leveling in the lower ranges is speeding up. This doesn't mean the entire game is--just a rank. The net (to--level-cap) time might be longer still. These concepts are not incompatible.
Faster Leveling The leveling curve has been adjusted through the game, particularly at the earlier levels.

No matter how many times I read that I don't get the feeling they are slowing the game down from commander-captain up.

Adjusted Leveling Speed - The leveling curve has been adjusted through the game, faster for early levels, slower near the end.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 69
11-29-2011, 05:35 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leviathan99
Very few STO players run out of content. Most give up well before that.

Haha! That describes me.

Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 70
11-29-2011, 05:35 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darren_Kitlor
The quote in the OP is saying that leveling in the lower ranges is speeding up.
Actually, it says "through the game, particularly at the earlier levels." Yes, I see the "earlier levels" part, but I also see the "through the game" part too. What I'm wondering is why are you ignoring that part?
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