Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 31
12-14-2011, 05:36 PM
[quote]
Quote:
Originally Posted by dvsaris View Post
You can have KDF to LG in a day... maybe two. KDF PvP below LG level is pointless... and nobody cares what ships you use while leveling. So that point is kinda moot.
Looking at it strictly from PvP standpoint - sure.
Except the Devs didn't design these consoles froma strictly PvP standpoint.
The consoles can go on the BoP more than anything else because within the KDF fleet the BoP is the most common vessel. Existing in numbers far beyond the other vessel classes.
SO not moot- your vision was too narrow in thinking on it.

Quote:
Sure you could shoot the guy. If you could move, if you could target him, oops you're dead.
lol- 1 vs 1 any spam pushing build is gonna hurt - tis why you don't see people 1 vs 1 carriers.
In a team setting like any pvp que or Ker'rat, that BoP is a tissue target easily destroyed or likewise crippled as easily as what it has done to you with those 4 consoles because your buddies should be targeting him as well. You may die if not healed but it will definatley die due to lack of "toughness".

Don't think 1 vs 1.
1 vs 1 up against the right build or if you are unprepared, a Science, tactical or even better engineer always has the chance to get the upperhand with or without consoles and really just by the normal powers alone when played right.
Don't think 1 vs 1 becuase locking somebody down is easy enough 1 vs 1 without consoles for the experienced player.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 32
12-15-2011, 01:25 AM
Many thanks, DVSaris, you were straight as an arrow, it couldn't be said better! Pretend that our friendly () klis are right, that is toy consoles are really useless toys counting for nothing in a dogfight, but then something weird is happening!
Suddenly all the feds are become bad players and instead all the klis "uber alles" champions.
Eh no, you klis have at your disposal powerful consoles that can be accumulated in the bops and now you have the edge over us feds.
It's so simple, you just have to say so...

Nice signature Roach, you've followed my suggestion, but I also have a new one!

Oh, I nearly forgot...Cryptic, launch that f...ing Enterprise F!
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 33
12-15-2011, 05:14 AM
[quote]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starwrath
Pretend that our friendly () klis are right, that is toy consoles are really useless toys counting for nothing in a dogfight, but then something weird is happening!
Suddenly all the feds are become bad players and instead all the klis "uber alles" champions.
Funny, Nobody said the consoles had no effect in a dogfight or that suddenly the feds are all bad players and we klinks are uber out of the blue.
What we are doing is enjoying the consoles before they are nerfed into fed acceptance of how they wish to see them work.

Also what I said was that if someone is stacking 4+ consoles on thier BoP then they are crippling themselves in a fight. Not 1 vs 1 since they can use the consoles to lock an opponent down as efectively as it can be done without the consoles by any experienced PvP'er in a Science based build.

Yes, if you got 1 vs 1 against a cheese BoP (as you feddies say) you may die easily and thats a real shame.
In an open fight of multiple ships against multiple ships, that same BoP is going to be the easy target to kill due to the weakening of having a bunch of console powers - even if it kills you or someone else on the your team in the process.
One death for One kill is not an effective way to win and your buddies should be targeting that BoP to both get the easy kill and prevent it from being able to use those consoles as quickly as possible.
You may as well complain that its unfair to be shot at by more than one enemy in combat, but that single console heavy BoP is not doing his teammates any favors and it hardly spells victory without the threat of losing.
"Well, what about if there are more than one cheese BoPs working together - greater power through numbers plus cheese?!?"
Thats true, more than one of these BoPs or whatever ship is using them is as deadly as multiple Gravity Wells, EWP clouds, AMS stacking, PSW stacking , multi-Tractor Beam using, SNB stacking teams that exist now and is the near constant in game tactic that we see becuase teamwork and stacking powers (especially if well timed) is the nature of the beast that is team versus team PvP.
Oddly its been this way for a long long time and shouldn't surprise anybody, teamwork and spaming powers in combat works and is the reason why (especially in Ker'rat) the zone/insatnce tends to be controled by thiose whom have the numbers advantage.

Lets take a look at the two biggest knicker-twisting consoles the feds hate us KDF having at the moment.

Theta Radiation Vent:
AoE Radiation DoT field ( no different from Eject Warp Plasma )
-2.5% crew per second ( More hurtful to ships with smaller crews than larger crews and it does not stack)
-4,850 perception (meh, if this bothers you then you need to play KDF more to get used to the AMS look)
-50 to all shield facings per second ( This may hold concern if its drain is buffed beyond (-50) a second by the skills tree, otherwise its 50 points a second which on paper does not seem bad against ships with shields in 10K+ range - though escorts should fear it since they tend to have lower shield scores.
If anything needs checking to ensure its working right - its this aspect of the power)

-50% turnrate (you should be moving straight to escape the cloud anyways)
-50% Impulse speed (sucks, but keep some escape/running/Engines boosts handy like the Fed Runner console and you should be fine.)
If you are experiencing rapid hull loss while in this cloud, its not from the cloud itself (unless its bugged) and you may be recieving multiple strikes from the enemy. Damn us Klinks for shooting.

Aceton Assimilator
Science vessel, raider Captain
Level 51 Aceton Assimulator for 300 seconds
target: 250 degree PbAoE - 15 power levels per second
target: 30 radiation damage per second
target: 606 radiation damage per second when shot by energy weapons.

Hardly the devastating device on paper many claim it to be, and it can be killed by energy weapons if one out damages the Assimulator faster than it kills the target.

If any changes could be suggested the "per second" timing of damage may need to be changed for the 606 damage when shot by energy weapons since the timing of a shot is set and last about 4 seconds, I can see how this would suck at 2424 straight hull damage in that time span only to have it repeated every 4 seconds becuase of Auto fire.
The big downside to this beasty appears to be shooting it that starts the whole process, so those whom run with weapons on Auto are going hate it as the more energy shots one pumps into it the more it pumps out (even though it caps at 2424 hull damage/ +120 hull damage in a 4 second timeperiod when shot by energy weapons)

Oddly though I did play around with this on Tribble and even dropped it multiple times on some unsuspecting Players in tribbKer'rat (at a time when one could even drop it while cloaked). The big outcome of this devastaing device is that they ignored it and even said it was no big deal, hardly a bump in the road in drain or damage output. That was in a 1 vs 1 situation though and this device very much relies on multiple targets to be nasty, so that may be the differnce (even though its damage never gets higher than its cap persecond)
Makes me wonder how much of the "I've been shutdown and died in seconds" cries is becuase of this and the other devices or just over-reaction and missconception of the target under fire by multiple opponents becuae if you are Theta'ed and ***'ed while taking fire from 2 or more Klinks - you will most likely die quickly.... much like being GW'ed, TB'ed and SWNB'ed by 2+ circling fed ships.

Otherwise I say we Klinks enjoy them until the Devs nerf them do to fedwhine like happens most times in STO - something new never gets tested on Tribble, is released to holodeck, Some love it & others cry fould and then it gets nerfed into uselessness by an over-reacting playerbase.
It'll happen soon enough, so enjoy them while you can.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 34
12-15-2011, 05:32 AM
Azz...you buried me under a words avalanche!
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 35
12-15-2011, 06:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starwrath
Azz...you buried me under a words avalanche!
My being mouthy and longwinded shouldn't come as a surprise. :p
hell, its my biggest weakness in PvP.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 36
12-15-2011, 06:39 AM
And your English is far better than mine!
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 37
12-15-2011, 07:01 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starwrath
And your English is far better than mine!
lol- depends on the state of my mind. I often find my grammar and sentence structure sucked wind and my spelling is abysmal.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 38
12-15-2011, 07:04 AM
No, you write very well, but you always make a mistake: becuase!
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 39
12-15-2011, 07:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starwrath
No, you write very well, but you always make a mistake: becuase!
and teh, my sentences are always full of the misspelled "teh". Though many feel its more tey instead.

(10 points to whom catches the Klingon meaning of teh)
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 40
12-15-2011, 07:32 AM
The problems here aren't specifically factional but more of a continuation of previously broken mechanics which remain unaddressed. Spam (in this case stacking multiple abilities) and disables aren't a new issue. Many of these consoles are based on mechanics that don't seem quite right anyway.

Theta and Eject Warp Plasma are cleared by the first tic of HE but the debuff is quickly reapplied and subsequent tics of HEs HoT fail to remove the debuff or protect against it.

AMS is broken in several ways but the perception debuff from Theta allows you to see nothing but the cloud around 1km around your ship. AMS prevents you from seeing the one who used it but Theta prevents you from seeing anything. You can't even tell which way to turn if you could turn in the first place.

All of these problems are compounded by the fact that they are free AoE abilities which are semicounterable by only single target heals.

Too many abilities, too freely available, based on bad mechanics makes these seem worse than they might actually be if all things worked as they should.
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