Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 21
02-18-2012, 12:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pecanin4800
Another one of "experts" that installed game ,started it and knew right from word go exactly what to do

i take my hat of to you my dear "EXPERT"
ah another of the "i dont need to read any guides or ask for advice" player...

Funny thing is, the space combat in this isnt much dif from years of playing STC(outside the fact it has more Z axis movment), but again, it dosnt matter, Im sure your excellent at costing your team optionals in elites or possibly even normal mode....since you shouldnt have to read or ask for advice.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 22
02-19-2012, 09:09 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dribyelruh View Post
Lots of stuff which I mostly agree with
I don't think I'm making myself clear. I don't disagree that the PvE is beyond easy and that it's very forgiving of bad players and builds but at the same time I disagree that making it more difficult will force them to improve. Just look at Night of the Comet as an example, that's been nerfed twice now; once because people couldn't manage to fly in a circle around a star (it's not like it's even a tight circle) and then again recently because they couldn't be bothered to manage aggro on the D7's at the end. If they don't accept that they're doing something wrong and improve from there (and that's not even a build issue, that's a player issue) then what else can Cryptic do to improve them that won't be nerfed due to lack of interest on the players part? My disagreement isn't that increasing the difficulty and having NPCs using more abilities will increase the general ability of PvE players it's just that a good portion have shown that they don't want to improve with the constant nerf demands. There was nothing in game that was impossible before and after the constant nerf demands there definitely isn't now.
That's why I also disagree that all PvEers suck (although a lot do) because some have looked at what's giving them trouble and improved; the basic premise is correct but the generalisation drags in a lot of good players* that don't deserve to be tarred with the same brush. Increasing the difficulty will improve them but those that haven't even managed to get through the PvE that's here already, and there are plenty out there, will just fall even further behind and cry for more nerfs.


Those good PvE players likely won't be as good as a PvPer but that's because they've (PvP players) learnt by playing other players, a challenge that no NPC will ever offer. But at the same time those that have deliberately gone looking for that challenge are the kind that are going to look to improve when they encounter something challenging. In that respect PvP already had a huge advantage in the type of person to play that type of content.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 23
02-19-2012, 12:54 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Militis View Post
I don't think I'm making myself clear. I don't disagree that the PvE is beyond easy and that it's very forgiving of bad players and builds but at the same time I disagree that making it more difficult will force them to improve. Just look at Night of the Comet as an example, that's been nerfed twice now; once because people couldn't manage to fly in a circle around a star (it's not like it's even a tight circle) and then again recently because they couldn't be bothered to manage aggro on the D7's at the end. If they don't accept that they're doing something wrong and improve from there (and that's not even a build issue, that's a player issue) then what else can Cryptic do to improve them that won't be nerfed due to lack of interest on the players part? My disagreement isn't that increasing the difficulty and having NPCs using more abilities will increase the general ability of PvE players it's just that a good portion have shown that they don't want to improve with the constant nerf demands. There was nothing in game that was impossible before and after the constant nerf demands there definitely isn't now.
And I agree with your night of the comet example. Having one difficult mission out of hundreds of "pound spacebar ftw" missions isn't going to lead to much improvement. Players will, at worst, suffer through the increased difficulty with their current builds even if completing the mission takes longer, and at worst call for nerfs.

That's not the same as having a proper difficulty curve though. Proper game design dictates that difficulty should start out easy, and gradually increase with time. Sheer vertical cliffs, and especially reverse difficulty curves that go backwards, are the antithesis of proper game design. When you have a gradual but consistent increase in difficulty, players will get better. That's very basic game design, and very basic psychology. When you have a sheer vertical cliff for a single mission, like in night of the comet, they won't. If I'm teaching someone to play drums, I'm not going to have them play nothing but a basic 4/4 rock beat for a month and then expect them to learn the Purdie shuffle and push-pull technique in the next month. Lessons need to follow a proper difficulty curve, just as well designed games do.
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